Being an iconoclast and a humorist, I find that I am often amused by irreverence. This is especially true when the impious behavior is directed toward poking fun at the rich and powerful, regardless of their race, ethnicity, sex/gender, or sexual orientation. And yes, in my own attempts to juxtapose disparate ideas or simply get a laugh, I have certainly stepped over that ever shifting and often unrecognizable line between being clever and being offensive. I never try to offend, I should add, but when pushing into new territories of thinking, sometimes it just happens.
Recently I have been struck by some pieces of humor directed toward Barack Obama and I have been trying ascertain whether the creators have crossed a line. The first one, the photo with the watermelons (above), is titled something like “No, children, there will be no Easter Egg hunt at the White House this year.” Playing directly on the stereotype that black people lose themselves in the presence of watermelon, any of us would have a difficult time maintaining that the photo was created in the spirit of a good, healthy laugh.
But why would it be seen as offensive? First, when someone says that something is “offensive,” that person is actually saying that he or she feels attacked–and that the attack hurts. Second, feeling attacked in this way stems from sensing that the attacker believes that there is some degree of truth to their offensive statement, video, photo, etc. I’ve always thought that “offense” is the wrong way to describe such a feeling, but it’s the one that we’re stuck with for the time being.
While I find myself saying that people can too easily toss around the “I’m offended at that” statement, particularly because when asked many cannot say exactly what they are offended by, I do recognize that the essential feeling of not wanting to be judged is what is at the core of the feeling–and how many of us mind if others compare us to people who are like us in some identifiable way (e.g., from our nuclear family) but then engage in some immoral or improper behavior (e.g., walk around town naked while proclaiming the gospel of L. Ron Hubbard)?
I’ve heard people argue that joking that black people like watermelon is much like joking that Japanese like sushi or that Koreans like kimchi or that Mexicans like hot peppers. Sure not all do, but by and large those foods are extremely popular in those three cultures and so the generalization works. The difference, and hence why the White House watermelon image is offensive, is that blacks have been historically portrayed as hapless, stupid and apelike while eating watermelon. In other words, the watermelon has been used as a prop to drive home the point that black people are inferior.
So last year someone produced a CD with a number of songs on it and passed it around in (mostly) conservative circles–after Rush Limbaugh hawked it on his radio show. Most of the songs simply poke fun at liberals and hypocrisy (e.g., John Edwards Poverty Tour”), but others were written to provoke. One was called “Barack the Magic Negro” (the tune of “Puff the Magic Dragon” with lyrics about Obama). My first question to myself was, Is this how Republicans are hoping to recapture the black vote? In fact, one of the men who was vying for leadership of the Republican National Committee, Chip Saltsman, sent it to his supporters. That’s pretty dumb. Forget about political correctness for a moment, and whether free speech should be curtailed. Just ask this question: Would you want a guy leading YOUR political organization who thought it was okay to send such a song out to people who are already considered by many to be oblivious to race concerns–if not outright racist? Oh yeah, THAT GUY will surely revive the Republican Party.
Listen for yourself:
“Barack the Magic Negro”
Here’s another song making light of Latinos who are perceived to not want to assimilate into the United States and who, it is thought by many, want to turn this country from one that is English speaking to another that is Spanish speaking. So imagine that you are like the majority of Mexican Americans in this country and have taken residency in the United States, speak English, and swear allegiance to the stars and stripes. Along comes a song that tells others around you–your barber, your electrician, your boss, your child’s teacher–that Mexicans don’t want to be Americans and have fealty first and foremost to Mexico. The negative repercussions could be enormous, like the Latino residents who have recently been killed by angry youths on the streets of NYC who simply wanted to beat down an immigrant. Clearly someone or some thing helped these youth to cross over some line between humor and offense–and the shift had grave consequences for those who died. (One, by the way, was from a tiny town in the Ecuadorian Andes where I spent several weeks working with the local priest, and so the story did hit home with me.)
Listen to this song:
“Star Spanglish Banner”
What do you think? Do YOU know how Mexicans feel? With how many Mexicans have you spoken about this issue? What do you know about how such sentiments positively or negatively affect their lives? How would you feel about Mexican neighbors or co-workers or roommates or playmates for your child AFTER listening to this song?
I don’t really get offended by almost anything, and treat those videos as exactly what they are: political satire aimed to piss people off. In all honesty they made me laugh, but at the same time I don’t think people in a position of power or authority should be going around showing these off like they are some kind of campaign flyer, making fun of your opponents isn’t really the best way to go about winning an election. I believe that the person that this video was probably intended to offend the most, Barack Obama, most likely couldn’t care less about it. He’s a smart man, smart enough to know that there was no way in hell he would get through this election without being the target of racist jokes and remarks, and look what happened, he won. I pretty much agree with Sam on the whole topic of what it means for something to be “offensive”, I think people take this stuff far too seriously, when really they should just see it for the joke that it is. As for the video poking fun at Mexican Americans, I think that people who take a something like that as an excuse to go out and commit hate crimes and kill people need to have their head examined, and that there is no way the fault should be put on the people who created the video, because like I said about the Obama video previously, its ridiculous to get worked up over something so silly. If everyone went out and killed someone every time they disagreed with a youtube video the world would be a pretty screwed up place right now. Stereotypes like the one mentioned in regards to the watermelon white house picture are something else that I’m baffled by. How can people be so offended by them? Stereotypes aren’t something that were just made up out of the blue by someone with nothing better to do, they are a generalization that came about because they are true about a significant portion of a group of people. I mean when the content of the stereotype itself is offensive, such as when African Americans are referred to as “poor” or “lazy”, I can completely understand the cause for anger. But watermelon? Really? Why would anyone be offended by that? If someone walked up to me and said something like: “Haha, you like pizza!”, I couldn’t care less. Maybe I’m missing the point, or maybe people are just too damn sensitive these days, but really I find the whole concept ridiculous. I hope one day we live in a world where people aren’t offended by random stereotypes, and care more about things that actually matter.
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I am actually very glad you brought this picture and these songs to our attention. “When do we cross over the line?” brings up the fact that there is definatley a line. In the past couple of years there have been way to many comments, opinions, stupid songs/articles etc where people feel the need to go way too far. Don’t get me wrong Im all for saying what you feel but honeslty in this day and age you have to at least try and be sensitive and censor yourself when need be.
Furthermore, I am starting to resent all of the “black:” jokes and puns towards our President. I’m not even black and Im pissed about it. What year is is 1950? No, we need to move on and focus on substance. If he proves to be a good leader then that’s all that should matter. I mean at least give him the chance, Bush was a complete idiot this is a given fact. Pres. Barack could turn out to be a total waste and full of crap but at least it will be based on that and not just because he’s black.
The songs pertaining to the President and the latin americans are obviously written by a closed minded moron. Who has that much time to harass another race.
The fact that the latin american immigrants dont usually feel the need to learn english is there own business. When you really look at it the things they must have been through just to get to the US is more than majority of the country has done for the freedom we recieve on a daily basis. If it’s not you or isn’t directly effecting you in a bad way then why would you care whether or not they speak englsih. Yes, it will make things go a little slower if you have to talk with these people but its a small effort in comparison to the sacrifices they have made to be a part of this country.
It makes me sick to think that these are the kinds of aspects of our society that the rest of the world see’s. What message are we sending? This is the land of the free and the home of the insensitive assholes who force you to convert to our selfish way of living? You must speak english and completley shed yourself of any culture you may have come with? Its really pathetic.
What needs to happen is that everyone needs to be understanding because we all are derived from some sort of immigrant ancestry. What I worry about is what racial group is next? Will we exclude everyone in this racial hazing or will it end when we realize we have run our of groups to harass?
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When DON’T we cross over the line?
We’re supposed to be a nation that prides ourselves on achieving the “american dream” and doing so while in the face of diversity. We are the melting pot nation of the world, yet we have taken a long time to get anywhere near the goal of equality for all and achieving the impossible. We’ve been through slavery, racism, women’s suffrage, and the list goes on and on. Even when we were going through the whole primaries and the election, all people were talking about was Obama’s race-not what he was promoting and standing for, what he was wanting to change and fix. Our focus wasn’t where it should have been-our perspectives needed a check.
Cheap jabs at groups of people, races, genders happen all the time and we play it off as a joke or “come on man-you know I was just kidding”, but do we? There is something in us that deep down hears these stereotypes, racist jokes, and demeaning words on a daily basis and begin to believe it, though we would never admit it. How many times have I been called a “ginger” and pretended not to care? Countless times.
One thing that Sam mentioned that I found interesting is saying that when we get offended, we often didn’t really know why-well I can tell you why I think most of us get offended. I’m hurt-when someone calls me a ginger, they may say it not meaning any harsh feelings, but where did the term come from in the first place? It was meant to make anyone with red hair feel bad about themselves, feel inferior, like there was something wrong with us/them for something we had no control over and when I hear that term I may play it off as fine but I’m really thinking “I wish my hair was NORMAL, I wish it was brown”. So while they may not mean any harm, they cause me to strive for something I actually never strive to care about any other time in my life: normality. My friends and I accept each other for the dorks that we are and when I do something not so “cool” or “normal” they either join in or laugh with the appreciative thought that I’m their friend and vice-versa.
Where do we get off making these stereotypes and quoting them on a daily basis, laughing it off and going on with our day? Where do we get off trying to, most likely without realizing it, strive to bring others down, to make them crave normality? Who do WE think we are?
-j.swerdon
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Many times people say things that are insulting in more ways than one without even realizing it. As a white male, this most often happens to me when someone insults my intelligence by asking something patronizing because I look young, or simply asking/informing me of something that I would consider to be beyond blatantly obvious. Most of the time, however, the offender is not intentionally calling me stupid, just reaffirming his or her own beliefs or confirming some bit of information about what they are asking about. I think that this is particularly interesting because I don’t know that I’ve ever been stereotyped or made the subject of crude humor in such a way as to offend me. Naturally, I realize this is because of being a middle class white male. Additionally, what amazes me the most is how often I do hear the phrase “that offends me” with no real distinction about why.
Ironically enough, the same racially offensive material that gets laughter from those that its not directed at usually just annoys me. I can’t say that I’ve ever been offended myself, because there is no real reason to be; instead, I recognize how much ignorance and indifference it takes to create/distribute material like these two examples, and attribute that to their creators. Most of the time, it turns out that the people who perpetrate this kind of material are either targeting a specific group of people whose opinions are similar to their own. What I continue to struggle to understand, is why people feel like they need to continue to persuade those who already think in a similar manner to themselves. I know this is a stretch from the original topic, but I can’t help letting my mind wonder here and pose this question: What is the point of creating material (of any medium) that appeals to those who think in a similar manner to the creator? We see this all the time, not only in the examples posted, but in articles/magazines/commercials. I mean, for Christ’s sake, I have yet to hear a legitimate validation for the party convention’s surrounding an election year. Every year its the same campy bullshit: one party appealing with all of its hearts to those voters/members who clearly are already voting in one direction, and have actively participated in the entire process.
Ultimately, I take just as much offense to being subjected to the kind of complete garbage that goes on during party conventions as I do to any racial epitaph. I mean really, you want to talk about insulting, just listen to some of the things these people say about the other party, and watch it decay into slinging insults and calling one another liars.
A digression I know, but just food for thought.
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Well first off, I didn’t even know there was a watermelon stereotype for black people. I think seeing an image like that is definitely “offensive” if you are a black person though. However, if I were Barack Obama or his family I would not necessarily take an image like that to heart. I think there are people out there that create these images to cause controversy and to try and spark humor but only because that is their job. We spoke about this in our discussion group this week. We spoke about cartoons and how a lot of times they can be offensive, like images of Jesus holding weapons or other images about Barack Obama that are seen as rude and insulting. I personally don’t think people should get offended by these images though because that is the cartoonist’s job. They draw controversial things to get a rise out of people because the more interesting their cartoons are, the more profit they make. As long as you are confident with what you stand for and what you believe in, you should not let one persons joke offend you. Also, in the blog it mentions how taking “offense” usually means that the person taking offense believes that the attacker sees some truth in their statement. This is exactly what I’m saying about how sometimes it is just people’s jobs to create humorous images or images that cause controversy, they don’t necessarily have to believe there is truth in the image.
I think it is absolutely awful to have that song about Barack Obama but then to put it on a CD with other hurtful songs about Liberals and hand them out to the public? That is just stooping down to a new level. That only makes the Republicans seems like racist jerks. Many may find that funny and like I said earlier, some people put out those songs because it’s there job or just for harmless humor, but for the Republicans to then take it and give it out to people is crossing the line.
Regarding the video made about Mexicans wanting to take over America, I really can’t take that too seriously. Then again, I’m not Mexican so I guess if I were I would see it in a different light. I think stuff like this is completely blown out of proportion though. Mexicans are not trying to take over our country and trying to change the language from English to Spanish. Mexicans are not unintelligent, they know how powerful America is and would never think that they could “take it over”. As far as having one of my kids room with a Mexican in the future, I would not mind at all. I think there could be a potential culture block between them but that could be a good thing. I think Americans should and can afford to branch out and experience other cultures.
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First off, I want to say that I have never heard those dongs before. Second, I want to say that it makes me feel no difference in culture. For me its simple, you could be of any race, color, origin, religion, sex, whatever, and it wouldn’t matter. What DOES matter though is one thing…RESPECT!!! I have a very big problem with disrespect, whether towards me or others. What I am talking about isn’t a song, a style, etc. What I am talking about has to do with attitude and character. I think everyone is a good person when I first meet them, that’s who I am. Like I said, I don’t care where you come from, I like everyone. The problem comes in when you think for one second that you are Gods gift to the world. Now I say that lightly, but when you think it is ok to lie, cheat, steal, etc because it is you “right” to do so, that’s when I have problem.
I look at those two videos and just see a video. I don’t see ignorance or don’t see hatred. I see someone who thought it may be funny to create that video. Why are we as a society so adamant about being politically correct? I’m not saying we should go around and just start cussing at people, but I’m just saying when did it become a problem to say the word secretary or sex change? I was looking at a news article and they made a big fuss about sex change, the proper term is now “gender re-assignment”. ARE YOU KIDDING ME?? We as a society are too focused on other people’s feelings and less on what is. This is our problem. When videos such as those two come into existence, just let them go. They cause no harm to anyone nor do they insinuate it. I’m sick and tired of hearing about these “wrong” words or these “wrong” ideas. Who put the media in charge of telling me what’s right and wrong?
As for this idea of “White America”, I have a couple things to say about that. When I hear anyone talk about how much better they are of another it springs the questions…How? How are you better? I never get a real answer. If there are people out there who still think this is a “WHITE” and only “WHITE” society, all they need to do is turn on the TV. The leader of your country, the country you live, work, breathe in is not white. So now, tell me how you are better? I am amused every time and I don’t think its going to stop. Being “offensive” is a personal response to something that you were brought up with. Most of the time, it is something that your family had been brought up with or what the media announced as bad. Make your own opinions and have reasons. Don’t just follow the crowd, be your own person and make your own decisions.
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The segment that Dr. Richards wrote was sort of concerning stereotypes and generalizations. We actually talked about this somewhat in my discussion group this week. Many people are totally against stereotypes and making fun of different races and such. I personally agree with Dr. Richards on that obviously these generalizations are somewhat true which is why they were brought up. The thing with them is that what hurts people really is what context they bring up along with them. This includes the history and other details the generalizations are referring to.
I am Indian subcontinent descent, which means my parents from born in India. So therefore I am Indian, not Native American, a big misconception which is not a big deal to me. However, people make generalizations about me and my race all the time including how we own gas stations, drive cabs, are good at math, and are terrorists. A lot of these are true somewhat which is why they have been brought up. That is absolutely fine with me since some Indians are indeed terrorists and do in fact gas stations. If the purpose of them telling me was to be for humor I do not care at all what so much. Nevertheless, if there are underlying tones degrading my race I might have some thing to say, but again others are allowed to have their opinions. Basically what I am trying to say is that I think all races should not take everything so personally. Some people are just stupid out there, so let them be stupid and ignorant. Who really cares? Just keep living your life and move on.
Now on to the thing that Dr. Richards was talking about concerning the Mexicans and how the song was saying derogatory things against them and the immigration issue. I am personally all for illegal immigration since it helps out businesses and our economies. Furthermore, it helps out those people as well get a new life. Americans that are against usually do not understand the implications and effects it has on them personally. If I were a Mexican, I probably would be hurt by this and probably hate America and its citizens because they are stupid. That song is uncalled for, but again I think people have the right to do it. Mexicans just need to take it for what it is and move on, even though I completely disagree with it. Even my race was part of the immigration reform but no one actually talks about us. I know how it feels, or at least I think I do. The United States is supposed to be a haven for people, but I guess times have changed and people just need to move on. For the people of Mexican descent, they just need to take things so harshly.
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Americans have been crossing over the line for decades and maybe even centuries. I’m not even really sure what this “line” is exactly, but in my own words, I guess I’d have to say it’s the point of being inappropriate and ignorant.
The Star Spanglish Banner video actually offended me and I’m a white woman. I don’t necessarily believe in illegal immigration – I think people should become American citizens just like everyone else, but saying that Mexicans are trying to overthrow the US is bogus. In my mind, the only thing Mexicans want to do is create a better life for themselves and their families. If the US didn’t make it so difficult to become a citizen, we wouldn’t have as many illegal immigrants as we do. People tend to forget that most of our ancestors were immigrants trying to make a better life for themselves and their families, too. If it wasn’t for them we wouldn’t be here. The video did just what I described crossing over the line as… inappropriate and ignorant. Who is to say what the intentions of struggling immigrants are?
Obviously, I don’t think crossing this line is right, but what could you really expect when a black man is elected into office? You think those self-proclaimed comedians are going to sit back and watch the show? Yeah right…
If Hillary Clinton or a Japanese man or woman was elected into office instead of Obama, critics would be jumping out of their chairs just as quickly recording songs mocking women or drawing California rolls on the lawn of the White House. Obviously, this is all politically incorrect and outright stupid, especially for politicians to be advocating, but it’s reality. Americans, for the most part, are ignorant and find stupidity humorous.
To call all of these things offensive, though, I would have to reconsider. Like Richards said, saying black people love watermelon is the same as saying Japanese love sushi and Mexicans love hot peppers. Well, I’m Irish and we all know what we’re supposed to love. Potatoes and whiskey. I like the two, sure, but I don’t sit around all day eating potatoes and washing them down with a fifth of whiskey. And I’m pretty certain that black people don’t sit around all day eating watermelon; at least my black friends don’t.
I’d agree that these jokes are stupid, but if someone said you like whiskey and potatoes because you’re Irish, I would not find that offensive in any way. In fact, I’d probably laugh and start craving my Dad’s famous mashed potatoes and a stiff drink.
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Especially in today’s world it is so hard to know where the line is and when it’s being crossed. It is so easy to get away with so much but it is sometimes hard to judge when you have reached that breaking point and someone is going to be offended by a remark you did not mean to be offensive. I had not seen the white house and watermelon picture before this blog and while I can understand how some may find it offensive, I found it amusing. But that’s true nearly everything, right? What some may find offensive and crossing the line, others think is funny and acceptable. I understand though that it also depends on whether the joke it being directed at you or not. And while this joke is not directed at me, I also feel though that my conscious usually knows when something is being taken too far. And while some may feel that no jokes are acceptable if they are making fun of someone else, I am able to laugh at jokes directed towards me and the color of my skin because I think that being able to laugh at your self and your quirkiness is part of life.
The song about Obama is a different story though. Some people don’t know when to stop and when the line is being crossed. And as I stated before, while the line may be hard to see, I think that many people know when they are getting near that line and I cant imagine the writer of this song did not sense that. The fact that other politicians were sending this to his supporters was shocking. One would think that someone in such a position would know better than that but people in all positions made bad calls now and then.
The star spanglish banner was also another shocking thing to hear. It is amazing to hear how small minded people are. People are here because we have a great country based on freedom and people want to be here and take advantage of the great things we have to offer. We should be honored to know that we live in such a great place that people would give almost anything to be here. That we provide people with opportunity. And although I have never talked to a Mexican on this issue, I cannot imagine that they do not want to learn the language of this country so that they are able to get ahead in this country and succeed. It is also so frustrating to hear people say that they cannot stand to hear people speak other languages in this country, it is an amazing thing to me to know that people from so many different places want to be in the place that we just happened to be born in by chance. We should be patient and accepting of these people that wish they had been given the same opportunities that were placed in our laps.
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I don’t think that the watermelon represents blacks being inferior; I just feel that it is a stereotype that black people like watermelons and it should not be taken offensively. While I feel that many people take things too seriously, sometimes lines are crossed and people do get hurt. Sometimes people keep pushing the line on offensive for fun until they offend someone. People do this just to anger others; the whole point of them making rude comments is to offend people. I think that this scenario is common in places where there is not much diversity and general dislike of cultures. In situations like this, it just gets ugly quick because the person or people being attacked are usually defensive. They retaliate back with worse words and these stereotypes and vulgar terms toward each other then have more meaning behind them because of such instances. I feel that this is not close to the majority though, and that large majority of the time these things are done in good fun. Cultures and people have differences and as long as people are different they will make fun of each other for things they are not that is just how it is. The stereotypes that stick stick because people fit them.
While I didn’t find the picture offensive at all I thought the two videos both were offensive. The first video with Obama “Barack the Magic Negro” wasn’t too offensive but definitely worse than the picture of the watermelons. Barack’s blackness was questioned because he isn’t 100% authentically black, and doesn’t like Snoop Dog and is not from the hood. The second video “Star Spanglish Banner” was pretty rude. Recently the United States has had much hate on immigration, specifically Mexicans. I don’t know why all of the sudden everyone hates Mexicans, but since the economy has gotten worse and Mexicans are taking many jobs everyone has started hating this culture even more. The culture themselves work very hard and for cheap pay, but unlike other industries where the United States exploits labor, the Mexicans are working here in our country. Everyday people are seeing more and more Mexicans taking jobs in the United States where when they go to Wal-Mart for example, they don’t see the people who were paid to make the items on the shelves they just see; oh everything is so cheap here. I feel the main reason that the United States dislikes Mexicans is because they don’t need to think about how immigration is hurting our economy; they see if first hand, nothing is hidden, you don’t need to prove anything it is all right there in front of them. Both videos were offensive but still nothing too terrible. People need to stop being so uptight and take things a little less serious, laugh a little people.
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In response to the blog titled, “When Do We Cross Over the Line,” I feel that the image presented with the watermelons on the White House lawn is extremely offensive. Like Sam says, showing the watermelons in reference to a black man in office is much different than saying every Japanese person enjoys sushi or any other stereotype. This “political cartoon” is degrading because the reference to black people loving watermelon has a negative connotation in our society. Obama is a man who has bridged many racial divides. And even more than that, he has looked past color, and onto social standing and worrying about the people who need help the most, regardless of how they look.
This cartoon was probably supposed to be comical and provoke a laugh. However, with the current approval rating of the president(over 70% I believe), I don’t understand what the artist is trying to accomplish. There will always be critics, but if you are going to be critical, attack the man’s policies not his racial background. I’m sure that a man in a position like President Obama has heard and seen countless jokes trying to demoralize him from doing his job. However, I believe that this man is above and beyond all of the pettiness that people try to throw at him.
Racism and prejudice is definitely still alive in our culture, as evidenced by the images and clips shown in this blog. People still do cross that line, because rather than looking at someone and seeing them simply as a human being, they look at their skin color, physical features, and social standing. People still do pass judgment on others without knowing an ounce about them or their personality.
I appreciate the critics out there. They keep people, especially politicians, as honest as they can be. However, I only appreciate these critics when they are saying something meaningful or speaking out for the good of the people around them. There is absolutely no need to draw a cartoon like the one shown in this blog, because it simply does not accomplish anything besides degrading a particular individual. An individual who has given everything for the good of the country that this artist probably lives in.
The worst thing about this cartoon and these video clips is that while they are designed to poke fun at simply the people they target, they are offending countless others along the way. People do not realize that any small action can affect others in a way they never thought possible. My best friend is black and I know that he finds watermelon or fried chicken references extremely offensive. There are times when people he barely even knows will make a dumb comment like that, and while he plays it off and stands up to be the better person, I can still tell he is hurt by it. People, all over the world, need to start getting to the core of people, and then make a judgment of them. If we can start doing this, I believe we can start breaking down this line.
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The watermelon joke is completely unnecessary and irrelevant. It is not political, satirizing any recent events or concerns of the public. It is merely mocking President Obama’s race. If I were president (this is me fantasizing now) and the lawn was covered with bagels to mock my religion, would it be as funny? The cartoon is just feeding into stereotypes, trying to further a racial divide.
Cartoons can be offensive, fine; historically, political cartoons were satirical, subversive and thought provoking. The artists could take liberties and say things that more serious commentators could not, due to the nature of the work. Due to the nature of their work, satirists, comedians, and cartoonists can still thrive in some countries where citizens have never dreamt of freedom of speech. Similarly, cartoonists are usually protects from libel suits in the United States.
Humor does not translate, does not make sense to everyone. It cannot be slanderous. Stephen Colbert was asked to speak before President George W. Bush at the White House Correspondents’ Association dinner in 2006. Those who invited him did not anticipate that he would skewer the president because they did not understand the nature of his program. They actually thought that he was a conservative commentator / comedian.
All of that said: we have freedom of speech in this country, and the anti-Mexican video did not convert me to the director’s views; rather, it made me sympathetic to Mexicans. The “Negro” video was ignorant and stupid. Those videos play to people who already agree with them. If they inspire hatred, I can only imagine that it is only fueling a feeling already in existence, not informing and igniting recruits. For all of the anti-Obama videos out there, I am sure that there are enough to combat this stupidity. He is, as the video informs us, “over-exposed.”
Should idiots offend us? No. We should pity them, I feel. They were born with half a brain and not afforded an education. They are so bored and so angry that they make stupid videos online because they cannot find anyone around them who agrees with them. (No, I am not trying to offend YouTubers everywhere… just the neo-Nazis, racists, and Grey’s Anatomy addicts). We believe what we believe and do not have to watch those videos if we do not want to, and if those people are in our classes, then we can practice our diplomacy / debate skills. President Bartlet on the West Wing said (probably quoting someone else) that people should surround themselves with people who are smarter than they are, and the really smart people of the world should surround themselves with people who disagree with them. Words (and pictures) are words (and pictures). They hurt, but they are no more than that.
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My initial reaction on the topic of “crossing the line” is that to make the determination on racial jokes you need to consider more than their content. For instance, the relationship between the person saying it and their audience or how it is said. I could continue in this line of argument and make the case that being able to laugh at things is the first step in bringing races together. In fact for a long time I have used Dave Chappelle and the way he makes light of issues in America as an example. I wouldn’t be alone either as many use Chappelle’s ability to make us laugh as a sign that this is an acceptable way of discussing these matters. I’m beginning to think that maybe the issue is not that simple. Even Chappelle sometimes views his humor as taking it too far.
In one of his more famous skits, Chappelle creates a fake sitcom that is set in the 50’s. As you might expect the show is centered on a middle class family in all of its white suburban glory. The only catch is that their last name is “Niggar”. The juxtaposition between the ideal white family and the most reviled word in our culture may be a stroke of comedic genius. The head of the Niggar family is late on a bill, a nephew is born with “those trademark Niggar lips”, their son sleeps too late making him a “lazy Niggar”. The skit was wildly popular and I can remember talking about it with friends after it aired. In an interview Chappelle was asked about the skit and he gave a response that I was not ready for. In his own family he took a great deal of heat for throwing around a term that carried such weight. His sister felt that it was a cheap laugh and that he should show more respect for himself and his race. In my own opinion the skit made the term no less vulgar but that doesn’t mean his sister is incorrect.
Because of his extraordinary ability as a comedian Chappelle has the potential to shape the way his audience feels about things. In his case this would apply to many young minds like my group of friends at the time he released the skit. Just because what he says is funny does not mean that it is harmless. This is his sister’s point and the reason I have become more skeptical. For those with bad intentions, humor provides a cloak. Lets pretend for a second that the videos posted in the blog actually sounded good (regardless of content). They would receive a great deal of play on the internet and reach a huge number of people. Like it or not, America is home to a number of idiots and these videos may just be the grounds upon which they would make judgment on our President or their Mexican neighbors. Jokes which push the line possess significant potential for corrupting minds even if they come in innocent looking packaging. Or maybe they’re just funny, I don’t know I’m still trying to figure this out.
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When it comes to making jokes about race, there are always going to be controversies. In our society today, comedy tends to get a bit insensitive on the touchy subjects. It may be assumed that we can passively poke fun at the vicious stereotypes used against all races, but to some it’s a barbaric reality. Using the image from the blog as an example, this could be quite the offensive stab to an African American. This belittles a culture. This sends out the message that watermelons in a yard are all we amount to. Personally, this stereotype is actually a first for me. I’ve never been confronted with a significant group of black people that adore watermelons. I guess if it’s grown like cotton, then it’s a black ritual right? This sickens me. This is similar to a scenario that I spoke about in my discussion group. One day, my coworker who’s black, was eating a bagel at her desk for breakfast. This white woman, who’s an employee as well, came passed her and said “what you eating, chicken?” The moment I heard that remark, my first reaction was that of laughter. But then I had to recollect and figure out that the derivation of her remark. Why did she even say that? Like what was her purpose? The thought of connecting chicken to her as a person boggled me. And one thing I try not to do is automatically just jump to conclusions. One criticism I can say about the black race is that we often attack as an immediate instinct. We never give a white person or another race the benefit of the doubt, we quickly cast them as a potential racist. For instance, I was at the grocery store with a black friend and we got up to the line of the cash register. The cashier was a white woman and when we arrived in front of her, she didn’t greet us. Immediately my friend caught an attitude, rolled her eyes and said out loud “I can’t stand these racist ass motherfuckers” Never did she consider the fact that the woman might have had a bad day and wasn’t in the mood to speak to anyone. It seems that in a way black people feel that white people aren’t entitled to not give blacks the upmost respect; like this is the least you can do. In retrospect, this ultimately tried to justify the anger and the hatred of blacks towards other human beings. Two wrongs simply don’t make a right. Then looking at the video parodies of Obama and the Mexicans, there is some sense of humor in there but its receptiveness can only be taken positively subjectively. There is a substantial amount of validity in these comedic topics, but are we being overly pessimistic?
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It is videos like these that make me embarrassed to be an American. I know that Dr. Richards said in class that we should feel lucky, because America is a good place to live. And I understand that. But what happened to the melting pot. Are we so removed from our own history, that we forget where we all ourselves came from? We are all of different cultures. Like we talked about it class, are DNA connects us to multiple roots. So how can people be so ignorant that they do not even think twice before putting videos like those on the internet? In the blog Dr. Richards began by talking about joking and what is and is not considered offensive, and the overuse of the word “offensive.” However, I don’t know how these videos would be considered anything other than offensive.
We were talking about “offensive” terms in our small group class and someone mentioned that the offensiveness depended on the context. When it comes to videos on the internet there is no true “context.” Anyone could watch those videos and not know the reasons why they originated. To me they are “offensive” because they hurt feelings. They degrade and belittle.
I feel uptight anymore because I don’t find any joke relating to race funny. The only time I feel it is possibly acceptable is when someone is making a joke about his/her own race. But still, I am not sure it gives me the right to laugh. And if I laugh I feel it would have to be because I understand that it is a joke, but to watch a racist laugh it would make me really angry.
Dr. Richards ended his blog talking about Mexicans, and whether we “know” how they feel and what we would think after watching it and talking with a Mexican neighbor. I don’t know how they feel, but I wish I knew more. I wish everyone knew more about how so many different races feel. I despise how ignorant a lot of people are. Sometimes it makes me unpleasant to be around because I just don’t get how people don’t see what they are doing. But worse I don’t get how they can not care. Videos like these never speak to me about the race being portrayed. They speak to me in a depressive way about how ignorant a lot of people are.
The videos were aggravating. The national anthem, an anthem some immigrants are finding comfort was just thrown in their faces. And a reference to watermelons, a reference that runs deep through the history of this nations faults. How can we be raising children in an environment like the current one?
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“When do we cross the line?” The line is an interesting concept because unlike a real line, there is no clearly drawn “line in the sand” that one either steps over or does not step over. I feel, much like Sam does, that it is fun to poke fun at things for the sake of poking fun at things, to make fun of people in power and to challenge people and ideas for the purpose of challenging them. However, in the case of this Youtube clip, I feel that even though there isn’t an expressly drawn out “line”, that idea of it has certainly been pushed to the fullest extent.
One of the other bloggers responding to this article made a good point that immigrants now are acclimating as fast and faster as our parents, grandparents, and their parents and grandparents did. I have met and known non Native-born citizens that have had a better sense of national pride than many people that I’ve known that are born and bred American citizens. I have seen some of my friends openly mock and bash American ideas and pillars, while I have seen foreigners uphold them.
The Obama video and the “Star Spanglish Banner” video both have something in common. They are both (maybe arguably, but definitely in my opinion) rude and potentially degrading. Now, granted, like Sam said, offensive is a word that some people throw around liberally. “Oh, that’s so offensive” or “that offends me.” In order to truly take offense to something, like previously noted, there must be a grain of truth in what’s being said (maybe at least from a historical perspective) and it must be truly damaging to one’s self-concept or self-esteem. Obama has proven that he does not fit the White supremacist stereotype of being an ignorant negro who loses control in the presence of watermelon. And, interestingly enough, he has proven just how much better he is than certain people who have been circulating this video around. Just think, that person could’ve been representing us! There’s probably people in as high or higher positions who are also partake in these politically incorrect attempts at humor.
The Star Spanglish Banner is equally as damaging and potentially hurtful. Many immigrants seek to cross the border and have a chance at the same thing we all have a chance at: that ever elusive “American Dream.” They want to come, to raise their families in America, and to be Americans. Granted, they are not going to leave their heritage behind, and they are certainly not going to forget where their roots are. But neither did our grandparents, or their grandparents. And nobody would challenge their American “status”. I just hope that the people who made these videos appreciate exactly what message they’re sending, and hopefully, will see how truly misguided it really is.
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I’ve never really thought about being offended. Well, I mean when looking past the actual feeling that comes along with the word anyway. You hear someone say something and it upsets you. It could embarrass you, so that could make it offensive. It could make you mad. That could make it offensive, but why are you mad? It’s just a word. The word, however, comes along with a meaning. This update stated that the feeling is one that “stems from sensing that the attacker believes that there is some degree of truth to their offensive.” I don’t see that as being true though, at least not all of the time. Sometimes people say things simply to get a rise out of people, or because they are upset and their mood is displayed within the way they treat others. In fact, I feel that the majority of offenses come from people trying to hurt others. For example, take all the derogatory terms that come with stereotypes and race. Those do not have truth to them. Even the picture of the White House in the blog, that is offensive, but it doesn’t display a truth. I’ve also come to notice that some phrases and words that used to be offensive nowadays are used in joking manners. As discussed within my discussion group, there is a difference between the word “nigger” and “nigga.” The former is still to this day extremely offensive and can cause extreme unrest if even whispered. However, I feel that “nigga” is a part of our culture. Although African American singers and rappers sing the word in their songs, their fan base is not just African Americans. Black and white teenagers alike will sing along to the lyrics “if you feelin like a pimp nigga, go and brush your shoulders off” without breaking a sweat. Why or the better question is how? It is not thought of as extremely offensive because it is part of the culture. I, a white female, would be able to sing at a club or a bar the word “nigga” and people would just be singing along with me. Granted, if there was a different tone to how I was saying the word, it would be a different story and stray into the “nigger” category. To say that is such taboo in our culture that I am even awkward typing it out. The point, however, is that to be offensive does not just mean a degree of truth in the statement. Offended is its own emotion. It stands separate from embarrassed or angry, and most importantly it is subject to change. The same thing that made people angry one hundred years ago may not make people angry today. While being offended is more direct than being angry, it still stands apart and can still change with the times, and is not solely rooted in a hint of truth.
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Ok. Let’s get one thing straight. Adolph Hitler was a douche. He was a dick. He was one of the biggest fuckups in the all of history. Secondly, the dude that wanted his son’s name out on the birthday cake needs to understand is that his son is named after one of the most hated men in all of the world by pretty much most of the world. Now first off, why would this dude name his son after Adolph? Simple, He’s part of the Aryan nation. The Aryan Nation is another group of fuckups that support Hitler and a whole bunch of other dumb shit. See the thing about a name is that it really is important what you name your children. Our President is named Barack Hussein Obama. Because of his name, many have called him a terrorist and a Muslim and other things. My name is Jeremy which is the New Testament version Jeremiah which translates in the Hebrew “Yahweh will rise” or “Jesus will rise”. This wasn’t an accident on her part. My brother‘s name is Isaiah which translates in the Hebrew “Salvation of Yahweh” or “Salvation of Jesus”. We both grew up in the church and she grew up in the church. See what I don’t get is black people be naming they kids Tranika or DeQuan or Latavia or whatever else they can come up with. Names are important. When you hear the name Bill Clinton, what do you think of? I think “First Black President”. When you hear Christopher Columbus, what do you think of? I think “Dumb Motherfucker”. Or what about when you hear Paris Hilton? I think “Dumb Blonde Bitch”. Just for the hell of it, if you mention Gina Carano, Vida Guerra, or Diora Baird my knees get weak. The point of this is not just what are name is, but it’s what we do with those names. Chris Benoit is one of the greatest wrestlers of all time. He gave his heart and soul to the business and up until a point there was never a bad thing said about him until one day he from all the medication he was taking he killed his wife, son, and himself. Now to some, 20 years of a great legacy is tarnished by three days of a terrible event. What is really in a name? I believe this. That when a child is born, when the parents first see their newborn whatever name pops into their skull from that good feeling is what they child should be named. Now some people already have a named planned out for their kids. The fact of the matter is that a name is important. Seeing as how my brother and I are named after two of the most prominent figures in the Bible we’ve picked up the nickname “Prophet” because Isaiah and Jeremiah were prophets and nicknames are just as important. I’ve got a shitload. Look, you can have a name, but it’s what you do with that name that makes it all the more important.
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I think most of those clips and pictures are pretty funny. Sorry if it offends anyone but the picture with the watermelons is hysterical. I also think that the people who produced those images have every right to do so. I do not know if they are politicians, kids, executives or whoever. Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. Once you put a limit on it, it violates the constitution and the very rock on which our country was built. However, I think that these people should not be allowed to apologize, hide, or deny that they were involved in the production of these materials. You can not send the e-mail out to your fellow republican politicians and then state in a bull-shit press conference that you regret your actions. You knew what you were doing when you did that and that is how the world views you. I am so sick of hearing people say things and two days later having them apologize. When will the American government learn to think before they speak or act? Didn’t we all learn this in elementary school? You apologize to Johnny because you called him a butt-head in third grade and go back to recess, but congressmen shouldn’t be allowed to go free after saying some of the things that they do. If you exercise your freedom of speech, in my opinion, you better know what your saying, stand by it, and not be a coward and take it back two days later. As for the people who laugh at this stuff, I am one of them. I can laugh at it, but laughter doesn’t say I agree with it. Barak the Magic Negro just sounds funny, laughing at it doesn’t qualify me as a conservative racist who hates Obama. Watching them is fine. Ånd if it is your job to produce funny internet videos to make people laugh and they are a little racy, then that is fine. But if you’re a senior politician, don’t be an idiot and send it around the office. I know I said that if you laugh at it that is fine. But I guess it depends. As a college student, there are no repercussions to what I laugh at. If I were a politician, I think I would be a little more careful. The guy had the right to laugh at the in the privacy of his own home or office but once he sent it out over e-mail then he is crossing the line. Notice I didn’t say he is violating free speech. None of this violates that right. But he is crossing the line and should stand and answer any questions that come about because of his actions, not just be accommodating and apologize.
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In response to the “When do we cross the line?” blog, I feel as though every president in the history of the United States has been made fun of and criticized. The president is basically like a celebrity, there are so many things that are said about them. I mean as human beings I believe that we have a natural instinct to bash and criticized the person who is running our nation. Who knows why we do it but we do. The watermelon joke can be taken as offensive or as a light and harmful joke. I feel that people who take it as offensive are mostly black people. I feel that if I was black I would be more offended. I didn’t really get the joke at first because I have never heard that black people like watermelon a lot, but as I read the blog it started to upset me more that a person would do such a nasty thing. I don’t understand why people just won’t keep their opinions to themselves, or feel the need to make judgments and express their opinions in an immature manner.
The part where Sam discusses the video about Barak Obama. I don’t think that Sam should blame that song on the Republican Party. I think that people need to grow up at least a little bit. Since when did Republicans and democrats loathe each other? I hate hearing people complain about Republicans and Democrats. Why can’t you just compromise and say that you have different views on how to run our country. I can only hope the people don’t think a true Political Republican made up a song like “Puff the magic dragon” referring to Barack Obama. I mean a politician has a lot of other more important things to worry about than to waste time making up a crappy song. I’m not 100% sticking up for republicans but I can say that, the video was uncalled for and immature. I just don’t understand why people would disrespect their president. He is going to be doing so much for our country. He is considered the change of our society, so why can’t people just grasp that. It’s absurd.
Being a Latina myself I am appalled that someone would make fun of Mexicans singing the star spangled banner. I mean a lot of Mexican people live in our country, and to disrespect their nationality, culture, and home land is a little ridiculous. Over all I think that we as Americans need to start respecting different cultures and ethnicites. Every person who lives in the United States needs to start acting like Americans. Obama is now our new president and I think that americans need to stop bashing him.
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The word offensive is thrown around a lot, and for the most part I don’t think it’s justified. People say they are “offended” every time they hear something that’s not 100% politically correct. It’s gotten to the point where I think offended has lost much of its actual meaning Webster’s defines offended as “To cause displeasure, anger, resentment, or wounded feelings in.” or “To be displeasing or disagreeable to”. Now how many times does someone say something offends him or her before they even really give it a chance to sink it. So I often I head people are offended, but generally it’s like when someone says “ouch” as a general reaction for something even possibly surprising them, but nothing actually caused any pain.
Really, I think the basis for when I would actually go as far as to get offended, is if the “joke” had actual hateful intent behind it. Now, often times this is very hard to tell, especially if it’s just a picture you ran across on the Internet. You never know the intent of a stereotypical “nerd” in his parent’s basement fooling around on Photoshop. But I mean, let’s face it, most stereotypes are kind of funny, or can be funny. I don’t ever mind jokes about races on shows or anything, as long as they’re all kind of represented evenly. If someone is making a joke about one race, the other’s is fair game. Chappelle’s Show was one of my favorites TV shows ever, and it was based basically entirely on race jokes. The great thing about his show is that no race was singled out.
With that being said, the picture did not offend me, me being a 22-year-old white male. I don’t even know if I have a right to have an opinion to be totally honest. I mean, they only reason I say I do is because it deals with people of this country we share. But I’m not offended; if someone is offended by watermelons then they need to go through some actual adversity in their life. Hell, I like watermelons, does that also give me a right to be offended by this picture? The videos/songs are a different story though. They just didn’t give me a joking feel. I think they kind of went out of their way to just about go over the line, but not quite. The worst thing about them is what they were used for though, is that they were part of a political campaign. That takes dirty politics to an entirely different level that they should never reach.
All in all, the racism we see in jokes, campaign, TV shows, whatever, is nothing compared to what it was 50 years ago when it was alright for someone t dress up in “black face”. I’d say we’re on the right track.
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There are many times when humor crosses the line. For instance, the image of the white house lawn as a watermelon patch is highly offensive. Often people think they have the freedom to express themselves and no one will be offended. Now, with a Barack Obama in the white house, people will have to deal with the change America made on November 4, 2008. The image of the watermelons is not just a joke; it forecasts a racist image to its audience. The reference made that saying “Black people like watermelon is just like the Japanese like sushi” is irrelevant. For decades saying African Americans like watermelon, was used in a discriminatory way. When people reference watermelon to African Americans it refers to their time spent as slaves. This is an attack on African American culture. The image is completely appalling and just proves the ignorance that exists in society. Barack Obama’s critics need to realize his father was directly from Africa and his ancestry does not link to slavery. Therefore, I see the attack as an act of racism against African Americans. In addition, it exemplifies the ignorance of Barack Obama’s opponents.
The “Barack the magic negro “video is also highly offensive. The message was not to poke fun at Obama, but it is a politically driven message. The line when it stated “don’t vote for Obama” set the tone for slander and racism against African Americans. Don’t get me wrong I am a person who enjoys a good joke every now and than. However, when there is a hidden message that is highly offensive and inappropriate is truly wrong. During the campaign republicans who forwarded this video to other republicans may felt they needed to attack Obama in order to feel comforted before the election. On election night, the creators of this film were not pleased, but humiliated.
The video “Star Spagnlish Banner” again was another attack towards race. Mexican Americans can not go a day without being subject to racial attacks and hostilities form other Americans. The immigration issue is a problem we face, however for the Mexican’s who take the right way to achieve their citizenship are criticized for the illegal aliens that enter our county. I feel that Mexican Americans are proud of their citizenship. I know my Mexican friends are much Americanized and have great respect for the country. The “Star Spanglish banner” is another way for people to get their racist view across. Legal Mexican’s have every right to be here and express their freedoms as they choose even if they please to speak Spanish. Recently in the news there has been a movement in outlawing bilingual voting forms. However, the movement has failed in many states. Many Americans feel frustrated with the fact that many Mexican Americans are difficult to communicate with because of the language barrier. As a result, innocent Mexican Americans take the blame for others. After hearing the song, I would not feel any different about my Mexican friends, because I know the song is just a bad joke. As we saw in “Barack the Magic Negro” video and the watermelon Image, racial jokes can be highly offensive with a message that attacks a particular race.
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I can understand why people of non-European decent would be offended by some of the jokes that people of other cultures would make about their history or culture. Any statement that has even a modicum of condescension in it would certainly warrant feelings of insult. The picture with the watermelons in front of the White House can definitely be construed as insulting because it is a representation of how black people were portrayed in the days of slavery: as stupid, apelike sub-humans who crave watermelon.
This was actually a subject of discussion in our groups this past week. One girl in the class mentioned having a friend who was black whose two favorite foods were fried chicken and watermelon, but refused to eat either of them because they did not want to further perpetuate the stereotype that all black people love fried chicken and watermelon.
I have to admit I found this bizarre because I couldn’t imagine forsaking something you enjoy just for the sake of killing a stereotype that (and I might be overly optimistic about this) most people wouldn’t give a second thought IF the stereotype was mentioned at all.
For example, I have red hair, and a common stereotype about redheads is that they are bad tempered. While I am loathe to admit it, I’m afraid I do have a bit of a temper, but I don’t attribute this to the color of my hair, nor is it ever in the front of my mind to quell my temper when I happen to be in a temperamental mood for the sake of killing this stereotype. I choose not to let it affect me, and if that’s how people choose to judge me, that is their fault, not mine.
Personally, I believe that these actions that are done in the name of erasing a stereotype are all in vain, simply because ignoring the stereotype doesn’t make it go away, nor does giving in to it by denying yourself whatever the stereotype dictates you enjoy when you genuinely do enjoy whatever the stereotype is.
No, the only way to erase the stereotype is to call it out, to make it known that yes, there were commons belief two centuries ago, but these are different times and we have different customs now. A person’s cultural history should not dictate what they can or cannot like. Stereotypes only survive because of that modicum of condescension. They provoke insult, and insults can last throughout an entire cultural history.
But how do you kill an insult that’s centuries old? The success of its demise is twofold: first, when the stereotype is said, the person who said it needs to make it clear that they are joking, and no harm was intended. This can be accomplished as simply as smiling and using a lighthearted tone when it’s spoken. Second, the person whom the stereotype is referring to should also interpret the stereotype in the spirit it was given: as one of humor and not something to take offense to. The stereotype will then lose its power, as its strength lies within its ability to insult.
People usually don’t point out stereotypes to be mean or insulting, but maybe “crossing the line” is exactly the answer to the continued existence of the insults behind stereotypes. It starts with one person at a time, but it isn’t an impossible goal.
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This is such a complicated story. At first I thought this guy was a complete bigot who just felt like pushing some kind of line with his song about Obama. As I follow the web-trail, however, I understand he was making some kind of parody about an opinion column in the LA times. Mr. Ehrenstein (the writer of the article) argued that Obama satisfies some perceived need in the white community to make amends for slavery. To whites, suggests Ehrenstein, Obama is the perfect solution because he makes them feel better about themselves while actually failing to put a true African-American in to power. Ehrenstein himself claims an African-American heritage and, in general, seems to be against Obama’s first couple of decisions in office (mostly those bearing weight with the LGBT community). All that said, I could see how Paul Shanklin (he wrote “Barack the Magic Negro”) could defend himself against critics who would suggest he is a racist. The bigger question I ask myself (in kind of an echo of Sam’s remark) is “why would Chip Saltsman send the album to all the higher-ups in the Republican National Committee?” By sending the controversial album to so many leaders in the organization, it’s almost like he is sending a bigger message. It makes Republicans look awful. Even if people in the party disagree with the subtleties suggested by these two songs, it would be hard for someone not to generalize that the whole party thinks that the premises are true (that Obama is just a scapegoat for “white guilt” and that all Mexican immigrants are not supportive of the U.S.). The question of where to draw the line concerning stereotypes and issues of race is concerned with motive. So maybe Shanklin could defend himself over “Barack the Magic Negro,” but I think it would be hard to explain “the Star Spanglish Banner.” “Why did you write this song?” I can’t imagine a very “articulate” answer to that one. As for Saltsman, his decision was completely inappropriate and unprofessional. Apparently he’s tried to defend himself in various articles claiming that the media holds him to a double standard and that Ehrenstein should be held to account. He thinks that the article should be held under more scrutiny than the parody aired on Rush Limbaugh’s show (“Barack the Magic Negro” first appeared on his program). We are talking about two totally different kinds of mediums. Ehrenstein was writing for an opinions column in the LA times. He clearly explained his stance and clarified exactly what he meant by saying “Magic Negro.” Saltsman was trying to get into a prominent position at the front lines of politics. Of course the media and the public are going to see him in a construed light, no matter how much he tries to defend himself. There’s really only one question left to ask Saltsman with regards to distributing the albums: “Why?”
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After reading this blog entry it really got me thinking about a lot of things that are going on in our society today when it comes to racism and our generation. I think that the election of Barack Obama into the presidency is obviously a major step for us. The thing that bothers me about it though is that people are constantly going to be pulling the race card. I feel that people, especially the media and comedians, are doing it for the wrong reasons. I feel like they are doing it to make some profit off it. They are doing to it to draw attention to them, and from that have high hopes that they can rake it in.
I also feel that our generation is really trying overcome the presence of racism. I think that having to point out it pointless. Coming from a small town into Penn State, I was expecting to be more overwhelmed by the dynamics of it. But, when I see the different races and ethnicities I just see them as people, not being defined by the color of their skin. So when people poke fun at it, and draw attention to it I get so frustrated. In such a great country that America has become, one would think that racism would be such a thing of the past. It is difficult to not find it in the news. You can always find a headline on CNN about someone poking fun at racism. This is where the “offense” topic comes into play.
I am shocked that a Republican chairman would even consider making fun of race. It shows that the Republican party is very out of touch with the direction that we are attempting our country to go. Our youth is screaming for everyone to be equal and embrace our individuality, and our superiors are completely ignoring it and dwelling on the past. It makes me feel like they are taking such backwards steps. It is making me so disappointed in our government. These people go to college, get their degrees, and campaign their butts off to get to their prestigious positions. It makes me sick in my stomach to think that they make such transparent promises, only to play dirty politics when they get to the peak of their career.
I only hope that our futures are not plagued with constant drama when it comes to dealing with our government. I hope that with this “stimulus package” we can devote a significant amount to the education of our youth. The older people grew up in a time where racism was a key factor in their society. I can only hope that the teachers of today are able to undo this focus, and make sure that our youth grow up with a fresh perspective on race.
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When do we cross the line? I think that answer depends on who you are talking to. I think everyone sets the line at a different point, but I also feel that there are certain things you can joke about that would cross everyone’s line. Personally, I feel that those songs crossed my line and I am a white/caucasian female with I guess technically no reason to be offended. I just think it is incredibly disrespectful and I can’t believe, no I take that back, I can believe members of the Republican party would create such a CD; not to generalize about Republicans of course, I know not all of them are like the highly publicized narrow minded individuals. As I write that however, I realize that I felt compelled to add that last part about not generalizing about Republicans, so as not to offend someone who is Republican and doesn’t hold those stereotyped views. It makes me realize how much the “being offended” about something has taken hold of our society. Now that I think about I realize how much I tip toe around issues of race and political view point and religion so as not to offend anyone I don’t know well enough to know where their “line” is. It really makes talking about these issues rather difficult when you think about it.
I have a few good friends that I hang out with and we seem to talk about religion and politics and sometimes, though not as often, race A LOT! It has actually become a running joke that as soon as one of those three topics comes up in passing, we know it will lead to hours of deep conversation that we all seem to thrive on. Perhaps it is because we are so sheltered from it throughout the rest of our daily lives. It seems many people are reluctant to talk about those topics or maybe I just have not been meeting the right people. I could tell you word for word what each of my friends positions are on each of those topics, and they could tell you mine, yet we still find reasons to talk about it over and over. It becomes a boring night of hanging out if at some point one of those topics is not talked about.
In reading some of the other comments that have been made about the blog, I came across one where the individual was explaining what their TA said on the “crossing the line” issue. His comment was that you “empower racist words by letting them anger you”. I thought that was a really good point and a different way of looking at it. Does that mean that if everyone stopped being “offended” by everything racism would go away? I wonder first, how hard it would be to not be offended on some level. Is it society that teaches us to be offended? Racism is all over the world though, so maybe it is a global societal trait? …An interesting issue to ponder.
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Jokes and parodies about race are often straddling the line between racism and humor. Being Hispanic myself, I listened to and watched the “Star Spanglish Banner” and was horrified by the imagery and lyrics. Although I am not Mexican, I can relate to the people that are being portrayed in the video. There are a lot of people in the United State that are proud of where they come from and don’t try to hide that. There is nothing wrong with that. Many years ago, when people first started coming to the United States from European countries, assimilation was not as important as it is viewed to be today. People who came from Germany spoke German and kept their traditions. So why is it that today, when someone doesn’t learn English, they are seen as non-patriotic towards the United States. May I remind you that the United States has no official national language or religion? Yes, the majority of the country speaks English, majority of our publications are written in English and the majority of media is done in English. But there are also growing populations of citizens that speak Spanish, write their own publications in Spanish, and listen to media in Spanish. There is a growing demand in the job market to speak both English and Spanish. Why is this? Because of the growing number of Spanish-speaking people in the United States. I was at work here in State College one day and I remember listening to my co-workers as I was waiting to punch into work. They were talking about how they can’t stand going into New Jersey anymore because it’s like a different world and nothing is in English anymore. They said it’s not America anymore. It just amazed me how they could say that. I was always brought up to believe that America is more than just one language, race, religion and way of thinking. However, everyone’s upbringing is different. I only hope that our society starts to move towards a more modern view of equality. A lot of the time, racial jokes are made and are justified by the use of humor. “Oh we’re not really offending you, we’re just making fun of you.” If you are making a joke about a specific type of person and not doing with good intention then it’s not right. That’s just how I view it. But I’m coming to find out it is not uncommon for these jokes. Comedy shows dedicate whole hours to these jokes. I have been taught to respect people of all races and to respect different cultures. I have been taught to not judge any person by their appearance. Like the saying goes, don’t judge a book by its cover.
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The offensive line is definitely unclear, especially for those of us who have little experience with racism either directed at us or directed at others. I believe the offensiveness of a statement is totally derived from its context, and even more so, from its accuracy or inaccuracy. But when it comes to racism, I think so much of it has permeated our subconscious culture that we don’t even realize we’re doing it, and when we are doing it intentionally I think the fact that it could be offensive is sometimes entirely forgotten. This is not because we don’t care about others feelings, but simply because sometimes we say things without consulting the mind filter first. When it comes to the watermelon picture, I would definitely dub that racist, because there was plenty of time for the author to realize that that picture was offensive. What I mean is, a lot of thought went into its creation, and then it was placed somewhere to be viewed publicly. That is intentionally offensive. Similarly, the songs were intentional and thought-out, and therefore derogatory in nature. But the deliberate nature of an offensive comment still doesn’t entirely define it as racist. Sometimes, a comedian will play off extremely questionable and generalized stereotypes, and this will not be interpreted as offensive. What gives? I think in that case it is the context. When you go to see a comedian, you expect to laugh, and so your expectations provide a framework in which to view what the comedian is saying. So going back to the watermelon picture, why is that offensive? Is that not comedy? In a sense, it could be. It probably depends on where it was first posted, and who posted it. If it was posted by a well known blogger who is not a racist on a comedy web site, it would probably not be construed as offensive, or at least it would not incite anger because it was just part of the larger joke. But since the World Wide Web is an interconnected system, the fact that it was bound to get into other contexts had to be understood by the author. So we’re still left with a lot of grey area. Maybe, offensiveness has to do with whether or not the statement is true. But then again, the most true statement you can ever make about a group of people is still only a generalization. Maybe, and probably most likely, offensiveness has to do with in-groups and out-groups and how people perceive others within them. A bunch of upper class white republicans probably aren’t considered insiders with blacks, so therefore “Barack the Magic Negro” is probably considered an attack by an outside group. The most certain way to evaluate offensiveness, though, is to put yourself in that “other” person’s shoes. You are then making a human context, a self context, which can help you determine appropriateness.
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Personally, I don’t see why any of this should get attention. Rush Limbaugh is a known racist, he shown he true colors before (ie The McNabb Incident). The spangish banner didn’t offend me, I don’t know why this gets attention. The Parallels I see in both these videos is they both have inarticulate people trying to get a message across with an failed attempt at a joke. The “Barrack the magic Negro” video was a radio talk show host attempt as a white man to parody an article written by a black man who saw the “magic Negro” label given to many black actors to take the role of the black character who saves the day for the white character. As who he was being portrayed in the media the constant fawning and awe of almost ever reporter in the media that any criticism was “waved away” because they gave him a status above criticism. a status that wasn’t above them asking whether he was black or not. The Magic Negro article was a well thought out and written piece that I agree with. Being somebody who waited till from 7pm to 2am in order to vote for him in the Texas Caucus, I am sick and tired about how great he is. He now is our president and no longer a candidate it time to stop comparing him to others and criticizing with respect like for the title he holds. when 2011 rolls around, I hope people are no longer holding their tongue about criticizing him they should say whatever comes to their mind about his policies. As for the Political Satirist parodying the article this isn’t the first time he has published an stupid attempt at an joke, I could care less. The real sad part of the story is when people give this attention. It was enough when Limbaugh but this on his show, but when other who keep tabs on his show give him national attention and but him on the TV or in the press they allow this to grow. Limbaugh and the satirist win because they may accuse them of being racist, any news is good news. As long as you give some one attention they become empowered and if stupid song get you’re attention…
As for the Spanglish banner once aging I refer to the previous sentence. Moreover, I not offended by the song but by the implications of Dr. Richards.
“Along comes a song that tells others around you–your barber, your electrician, your boss, your child’s teacher–that Mexicans don’t want to be Americans and have fealty first and foremost to Mexico.”
Many Mexicans and other immigrants I know become polarized by this issue there are those especially 2nd generation that see themselves as purely American and go as far to look down on immigrant from their race or nationality who don’t. This is a big reason their are many Latinos as border agents and in the military. At the other end of the spectrum are those that see no reason to assimilate and see them selves a opposed to everything American, there are many different reasons for this. as a 2nd generation immigrant I’m opposed to the idea that immigrant must assimilate to American culture.
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I find it rather disgusting that someone whom should respect everyone in the U.S. and people that the very song “Barack the Magic Negro” seeks to offend, would find the song laughable and then forward it on to the rest of his constituents. The Republican Party is obviously not the party of choice for the majority of blacks in America, and this case of disregard obviously does not do anything to dispel this assertion. I am not trying to say that the song is offensive to every African American and that by association, Chip Saltsman is racist, but in my opinion this was not the smartest move to make. Conservatives in America are already reeling from a poor showing in elections, why try to bury them deeper?
In my discussion group this week, I brought up the point that I believe there are certain boundaries that people need to be careful not to cross when delivering a race related remark, or joke. The Star Spanglish Banner is a perfect example. Yes, it is true that there are many situations in which immigrants clearly do not try to assimilate as others before them have done, but why make the assumption that all Hispanics are trying to do this? And to take it even further and say that the United States will soon be Spanish speaking.
I personally don’t know how Mexicans feel, as I am a white woman with Canadian ancestry. I do know how it feels to be singled out because of your background/ancestry as I have encountered many slanders against being French Canadian before. I can’t imagine that anything said in a negative way against the Hispanic demographic would be in any way, shape or form helpful to them. It only serves to further propel the stereotypes that plague them every day.
I cannot say that The Star Spanglish doesn’t bother me at all; seeing pictures of Mexicans at rallies holding up the Mexican flag in hopes of getting rights here in the United States does not sit well with me. I understand that they want the ability to immigrate as they please, and that they also want similar rights to legal citizens but I don’t think that showing their pride of their own country (that they left for more opportunity) is the way to do that. It is almost a slap in the face to America, as if to say that they only want the opportunity, not the way of life. The song doesn’t make me look at any Mexicans differently, because I am not lumping them all into the same category; that is simply the way I view people being that intense about their old country in their new “Dreamland”.
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For years and years people have been judging each other on the basis of habits and surroundings. Some may be offensive and some not. There is still no clear definition of how far a person can go with a joke or comment before pushing the person over the edge or in other words offending him or her. People who live in the North Pole are said to eat lots of fish or those who live in New Orleans that they party a lot due to mardi gras. Those these are not offensive statements but they are not completely true. Not everyone parties and nor does every person eat fish all the time. It is a common misconception due to generalization.
Generalizing people has gone a bit further in this era due to cultural classifications. Black people for loving grape juice and Indians for eating mangoes. The list keeps on going on and on. I love grape juice and I am not black. Infact a friend of mine actually pointed this out to me that why do you drink so much grape juice, are you black? At that remark I was utterly disgusted and started an argument with him. But no matter what we all say people will always judge no matter what we say and how we act. It is the way nature works.
Comedians are people who for some reason don’t have this problem. They make fun of all genders, colors and religions. Why is that so? Who gave them the right to call a black man with the “N” word whereas if someone else says it, its as if he said the worst thing on earth. Its interesting to note here that before I came to the states me and my friends used to “N” word on each other all the time. But we used it because we saw it being used on T.V. and it sounded cool. It was out of innocence but it was when I came here, that I came to know that it is a very offensive to a black person. Though I don’t use it anymore but I’m still in this dilemma that why cant I use it as I don’t mean to offend anyone? Why cant people look into me and see that I am not a racist? Those this is a very subjective idea since it cannot be measured but after all it is just a word. But the masses are always right and there is almost no point going against the flow in most cases. This is when one should know that it is time to stop. I from talking to different black people came to realize that only they can say the “N” word to each other and not others to them as it demeans them and their heritage. It is a common understanding here in the U.S. not to use it but I did not know this and when I was told of it I stopped.
People only realize these things when a lot of damage takes place. When masses gather together and make their voices heard is the only way to let people know how far they can go with a particular subject. Black people stood fast for their rights and made the people of this world know where they stand and how much push is a push and that it doesn’t lead to a shove.
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My main concern with humor that can be deemed “offensive” is the way in which it affects those who are uneducated and unfamiliar with the complexities of race and culture, and are therefore unable to discern a joke from the truth. For example, I followed the link to the youtube page for the “Star Spanglish Banner” video, and checked out some responses to the clip. The first response, posted just nine hours ago despite the fact that the clip was posted in June 2007, was “were gonna have to shoot the illegals.” As Dr. Richards notes, such a reaction has enormous repercussions for how Mexican – and for that matter, Latinos or Hispanics who are incorrectly identified as Mexican – immigrants are perceived and treated in our country. Such attempts at humor can also be misconstrued by those with a specific agenda against diversity and social progress, such as the conservative Republicans who passed around CDs poking fun at liberals and minorities. But of course, why would these people want change when historically they have systematically enforced a hierarchy which allows them to enjoy a position of power?
Some might argue that racial or ethnic humor is not exclusive to minorities, and that white people are subject to their own share. Yet the tone and implications of “humorous stereotypes” against white people are vastly different than the jokes directed at minorities. For example, the joke about white people not having any dancing abilities, or the jokes about the frugality of Jews, does not affect these people beyond the initial joke experience. Yet claiming in a joke that all black people are lazy, can have more serious consequences. If such a joke permeates the mainstream ideology, African-Americans may find discrimination in their hunt for a job. Even more dangerous is the lack of empathy towards the cycle of poverty in inter-cities which often affects African-American families, because of a mainstream perception that such a situation is the result of laziness. In other words, something that starts as a joke can actually interfere with a call for social change.
This being said, humor is often a great way to disarm even the most racist people, and allow them to view stereotypes in a new way. It also allows people to let their guard down and discuss racial issues in an environment which has already been established as comfortable and safe: a place where on can truly speak their thoughts without fear of punishment. Though some people are able to see humor for what it is, and not the proliferation of a stereotype, there are always those who see it as evidence of a fact. But in this case, it is not the humor which needs to be addressed, but the origin of the stereotype and racism which shape how one views other races and cultures.
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I believe that this is so stupid…. I mean obviously people are always going to have offensive terms and words and phrases to bring to the table. Obama is not going to be let down just because people think just because he is black he loves watermelon and that he is ignorant. I believe this goes to show that certain people can use certain term and take it in certain ways. Lets say the “N” word…. now people always say when a black person say this word with an a at the end of it it is okay to use but when any other race says it it is offensive. Obviously no one should be saying the word but hey in reality everybody can’t always be satisfied about others’ comments.
I mean watermelons, it’s a fruit like any other fruit and it happens to taste good so whats the problem? I can’t stand the fact that just because a great person that became president that is black, that people take offense to that so they find something offensive to use against him and that would be a “black joke”. It’s all hate and if people have stuff to say then let them, but regardless OBAMA still rocked the vote and still is president.
Stereotypes are in every race, ethnic group, and background and will be until we can become as one or equal. And even so there still might be stereotypical comments. It’s not right but at the same time it’s irrelevant because it’s not true so we stick to “sticks and stones…etc quote.”
Personally the songs are a mess but also they don’t matter. When do we cross the line? We always cross the line everytime we make a racist comment, phrase, etc but that doesn’t stop us. How dare we complain about unequality when we cause it. Why do certain colors have to have certain stereotypes when we generally live the same thing and that is life. Its sad because blacks and mexicans probably have the worst jokes because people belittle us because of history but we still came up on top.
Eventually we will all get over the fact that terms don’t matter because we still can stand strong physically and mentally. I hate the comments and no one does but when you hear a phrase that is stereotypical about another race it is all of a sudden funny. See! Right there is where the problem is. Maybe if we stop laughing at comments that make us essentially upset if we were in their boots then this issue might go away. Otherwise comments will always exist.
In conclusion, I just don’t pay too much attention to the nonsense people make up and I will always try my hardest too because even though it is something to comment it is not worth my time just attention to not do the same thing.
Sasha H.
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I actually have my own personal opinion about immigration in the United States. However I do not have a concrete stance on how well immigrants should feel the need to assimilate and this is for various reasons. On one hand I feel that immigrants should be allowed to live their lives as they please as long as they abide by the laws of this country no matter their choice of lifestyle. If they do not want to speak English I do not believe they should be forced too, even though it in many cases it may be better when it comes to job opportunities and things like that but, I do not think they should be forced to learn a new language. However I do not believe that people have the right to take a person’s disadvantage at learning one of the hardest known languages in the world and humiliate peoples cultural background. I sometimes do feel bad for the legal immigrants and native born Mexicans in the United States. However when it comes to illegal Mexicans in the Unites States I can’t say that I share the same sentiment. You have to understand that at this day and age and with our economy, many people feel that illegal immigrants are a major strain on our economy and in many cases cause more problems. They also in many cases are the roots of many of the stereotypes that are made about Mexicans in America. I know some people say that illegal immigrants help America by working jobs that other Americans are not willing to take but I do not believe that is true. It is evident that the only reason why so many Americans are not willing to take so of these low class jobs is because of the low salaries that are associated with these jobs. If the immigrants were not willing to work these low wages then employers would be forced to raise the pay for these jobs making the standards for those jobs higher thus raising the standard of living for native born Americans. I also think that would be the answer for a lot of the poverty problems in America so if it takes a few “offensive jokes” to make this happen then so be it. However I do not think that stereotyping large racial groups is the most effective way to cause change. I personally don’t know what to say about making jokes about other races because I do not believe we can generalize what is so right and so wrong about it. It is such a touchy subject and it depends on the context in which what was said. If a black man was to say something about Barack playing basketball it would be ok but if a white person did it, it would seem racist. It’s just contextual so I don’t really know how to take it.
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Before I answer the prescribed question “ when do we cross over the lines”, lets first define what those lines are. I personally think the lines described in the question represent social constructions. Acceptance, labels, social economic status, and political ideology are all things people need to step over before we can get along.
The line of acceptance can be crossed when people feel more comfortable in their environment and surroundings. This is something that takes place on the inside of each individual. I was told State College was a racist town but I came here because I was comfortable in who I was. I did not care about others and I didn’t care what others had to same about me so therefore I know I would survive. But it is not that easy for others that don’t like who they are. On the other side people need to learn how to accept others who are different then they are. There is nothing wrong with learning something new about someone else. Not only does this helps bring people closer together, but it also helps tire down stereotypes.
The line of labels is hard to cross because this is based off of skin colors like white, and black, other. These racial categories are followed by history and history which we can’t change. However we can agree to disagree and recognize we are all different. We have different beliefs, different values, and our culture is different. Therefore we have a different struggle. We need not to use racial stereotypes. And instead change our mind sets about one another, Not all blacks are ghetto, not all Asians are smart, and not all whites are wealth.
The line of social economic status can be cross is if there are more opportunities for minorities to cross over into main stream society. People can find their place in life because they are always being pushed away because their don’t have the income to compete with people with a higher income. This also leads to a difference in their education. For example a kid living a urban neighborhood will only receive a certain education because his or her education system can’t offer to give them the proper skills to survive later in life. This same kid will also experience difficulty in dealing with getting a job. Aside from the everyday interactions and relationships we are split in two political parties. Who I think represent the white ideals vs the minority ideals.
We will cross over the lines when we, as Americans, in the 20th century agree to open our eyes and be more understanding. The lines are made up in my opinion and there are invisible. We need to do what Obama says and lift the pressure and dependence in America. Just think if we really wanted people cross over the line all we need to do is help them one race at a time.
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According to the dictionary, the word offend means “to create or excite anger, resentment, or annoyance in; hurt the feelings of”. The word offend reminds me of all the times I have been called a ‘cunt’, ‘slut’, or even ‘crazy bitch’ (that one really gets me. No woman likes to be called crazy!). However, the strange thing about being offended is, they’re just words. How do we all let words affect us so much? What makes something a derogatory term? Will we ever get to a point where offend is a non-existent word? The answer to this definitely NO. Wherever you live, however old you are there will always be something out there that personally offends each and everyone of us somehow.
Derogatory terms are no more then a few words that someone put together to oppress someone else and they have always been around in some form. I know that for as long as I live, when a man calls me a ‘crazy bitch’, I will feel as though I’m being put down because the word crazy is bad in my mind. There will always be words out there that offend people on some level, even how retarded most of them sound.
Maybe a question we should be asking ourselves is, can we rise above and not let things personally offend us? I think the way to do this is Education. More often then not, when someone is trying to offend you they have no other means of arguing. They have come to the end of their tether on what they know and the only way they know how to defeat you is to offend you enough that you give up (This is how it has often happened to me at least). However, maybe if we were all well educated and knew at least a little bit about the issue we were discussing then no one would be hurt by mean statements in the end. Although, it is not realistic to think that everyone is going to receive higher education at some point in their life. So maybe we just all need to become more aware of what we say. I personally care a lot about other people’s happiness, but I know this not the case for everyone. I wish everyone could just open up and stand in someone else’s shoes for once.
I will admit it; I’m a big optimist. I like to see the good in all people and all things, even if it really isn’t there. That’s why I like to think there is a peaceful solution to everything. In my make believe world, there is no arguing and no one gets hurt over stupid words. I wish my world was real.
Christine
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When trying to relate to other races i feel like it is very easy to cross the line unknowingly. Sometimes we listen to things on the radio or watch something on tv and we try to use that to relate to people of different races. Unfortunalty some people dont understand that what you say may be offensive to another person. For example my father is a jamaican man. So by nature he has a very nonchalant attitude. He also has a very attractive personality, and can get along with pretty much anyone. so it was only natural that the asian people at our chinese food resturant took a liking to him. They are usually very vocal and joke around alot with my father. There banter usually goes back and forth. However one story he told me made me think that they had seriously crossed the line. He had told me that once while picking up his food they were engaging in there usual banter, and while he was leaving the asian man had yelled “goodbye nigger” to him before he walked out the door. Upon hearing this story my mouth immediatly dropped and a loud gasp was released. To me this was crossing the line. However my father was apperently not offened because in retelling the story he was laughing and amused. I on the other hand did not know how to react. They are both friends so i know they didnt mean to say this in a derogatory way. In trying to find out why this was said i came up with the conclusion that they had either heard afriacn americans address each other in this was, heard it on the televison or heard it on the radio. It seemed as if they took this as an appropriate way to address african Americans. I also wondered why my father wasnt concered with this comment. Then it occured to me that my father not being from America, has not had this comment used towards him in a manner to bring him and his race down. He does not feel the same about this word as African Americans do. In his country being people who are black are the majority, and if your not your still jamaican. So to him this word means nothing. at the end of the day he was mainly concerned with the possibility that the asian people would use this term with an African American, not knowing the repercussions, and possible really offend someone.
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In response to “When Do We Cross Over the Line”, I think it is wrong to judge other racial backgrounds based on stereotypes. I’ll be honest with you everyone has some type of stereotype about another race. But I think it is wrong for people to play into the stereotypes and discriminate against others. I sometimes make stereotypical jokes when I’m with my friends but I do not necessarily believe them. I was brought up to respect others regardless of race, age, and sex. Even though I make stereotypical jokes I do not believe any of them. People make jokes to sometimes lighten up serious situations, but they do have to understand they can be offensive to others. When I hear someone from another race make racial jokes about another race aloud I depending on what it is I find them offensive. One day my friends and I were walking back home from a party, some drunk guy yelled from a balcony “hey look it’s the 6 man march”. I don’t know if he was trying to joke around, but my friends and I found it very offensive. We did not know him at all and for him to make a comment like that was totally unnecessary. In regards to the song “Barack Obama the Magic Negro”, I think that was very racial. I know that we all have the freedom of speech, but there are some limitations. For example, a person cannot go to a non-white neighborhood with a Ku Klux Klan outfit yelling out racial slurs. I’m not surprised that videos and photos are posted making fun Obama or trying to slander her name. You would think that since we are in the 21st century, people would grow up and be open to other backgrounds. In regards to the “Star Spanglish Banner”, I think that people should not get upset at Mexican immigrants. This country was taken by force by immigrants so there should not be a problem with another group trying to come to this country. Almost everyone in this country have ancestry from some else in the world. I do not have a problem with Mexicans immigrants, I believe that they should give them more opportunities. So when it comes to joking about a group of people about their race I think it is wrong. I don’t believe that people will stop saying racial jokes, but at least monitor what is said and who is present. When I watch some comedians on television that perform racial jokes I sometimes find them funny depending on the severity of context. However, racial jokes are something’s that should not be taken lightly and should screened depending on the audience in which it is presented if not said at all.
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When we talk about racism in a since we always talk about if it was statement that we can accept from people or if it was something that we look at as crossing the line. I think we take this into account only because the one who are being offended either respects the offender OR because we know there is some type of truth to this stereotype. Sometimes the stereotypes that people are associated with are sometimes offending people want to show that they are different among their race or religion so when we deny stereotypes it a sense of saying not everybody person is like this. We see people who cross the line because they choose to personally see how far people can take it. In a sense they want to see how far the line can be push because why limit yourself. Sometimes none of the things that are said by people are offensive, but people are not always ready for the line to be crossed or tested. Sometime when the lines are crossed, people are not ready, so inn a sense it looks bad when people actually cross them. Some people cross the line out of shear ignorance of any religious or cultural knowledge so when you hear about people crossing the line it more of a group of people upset at somebody making stupid remark over a certain topic that they have know idea about and that is when crossing the line I bad, especially when we include factor of the media because then we don’t have all sides and understands of topics. It because just a one sided topic, but not only that it just sounds bad. Not all of the time do we sit here in magic land thinking that everybody is going to be good. Sometimes when people make remarks, the chain of events that come later are often something special. Often if we look at some of the thing that are used to offend people count completely ridiculous, but for that same reason I just do not understand how or why some of the thing offend people like they do. I guess in this world all you really have I you respect so in the end we look at the situation and we all just want to be treated with respect. If people choose to criticize something it is just better to take all the aspect or all the situations into account before the judgments are actually made because it make you look stupid, ignorant. Not all the time people can get away with just saying want they want without repercussion, but at least understand why you said the thing that you say and understand in from all aspects before you just jump the gun. Some people are disrespect full for no reason.
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I know that the blog “When Do We Cross Over the Line?” was posted last week, but I felt compelled to respond to it. Many people spit racist jokes left and right, and I am sure these jokes have been flying since the beginning of time. People are afraid to say them or laugh at them because they are politically incorrect, but should they be scared? Some people are just too uptight. Sometimes we just need to lighten up and laugh at ourselves. I agree that Whites in the United States tend to seem overpowering, but there are tons of what people would call “racist” jokes that put people in a generalized stereotype. There is not necessarily anything mean, harmful, or offensive about these remarks, but groups of people tend to do the same things. Like Sam stated in the blog that black people tend to be associated with eating watermelon, as Mexicans do with hot peppers, and Japanese with Sushi. Is that really as offensive as it is more cultural?
One day in class, Sam made a comment about how white people cannot dance and they have no rhythm. One girl refuted him in a way that seemed she took offence. Sam told her he was not trying to cross the line, but more make a joke at himself and all of the Caucasians who really cannot dance. Of course, there are some white people who can dance, but there is a majority of black people who have great dance skills. Sam was only playing on a generalization, and if you took a survey of the class I bet the general consensus laughed at the joke. I laughed and I am white. People of different races should be able to laugh at racial jokes, even if their race is included.
I have a friend who is Jewish. She HATES Jewish jokes and gets extremely offended. Personally, I agree when she gets mad at Jewish jokes about the Holocaust. That was a hostile, terrible time, maybe even for some of her ancestors. Those “jokes” are flat out mean. Why does she get offended at jokes about Jews being cheap though? Or about how they have big noses? It is usually not true, so why does she get upset over them? She should be able to laugh about it, especially if it does not pertain to her. She has made funny comments about her nose before, but she cannot take it when other people dish these words out.
As I said earlier, being able to laugh at yourself makes life easier and less stressful. I love to kid around as long as the words are not meant to harm. We are never going to stop seeing silly pictures or videos, like the ones posted, so we just need to learn to laugh along.
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Race is always a sensitive issue but today, it is often used to make a joke. It can be hard to determine if racial jokes are funny or offensive and different people have many different opinions about how far you can go. This is explained in the blog “When do we cross over the line.” It can be hard to tell what is funny and what is offensive. The songs and pictures about Obama were extremely offensive because they play on stereotypes of black people to try to make a joke. I can’t imagine people thinking this is funny. Running for president is difficult for anyone, but being a black man running for president is extremely difficult. Politicians know they will be scrutinized but it shouldn’t be because of what race they are. Politicians should be evaluated based on their policies and beliefs. Although it often does not happen, voters should choose a leader regardless of race. I think the 2008 election has shown many Americans that race is still an important issue today and maybe we haven’t made as much progress as a lot of people think.
Also, Hispanics in America face a lot of discrimination, especially because of what language they speak. It seems as if Americans feel entitled to live here and think no one else has the right to live in America even those most Americans have come here as immigrants themselves. There was a huge controversy recently in Philadelphia regarding a cheese steak shop that refused to serve anyone not ordering in English. Not only is this discrimination, but it also shows how ignorant some Americans are. If I were living in another country, I would hope they would be accepting of me and the fact that I did not know the language. Not all immigrants want to abandon their own culture to assimilate to American culture.
Making jokes about race are often funny, especially if done in a nice manner. But when the jokes use stereotypes as a way of keeping a minority group down, it becomes offensive. A lot of black comedians, especially Dave Chapelle, point out stereotypes of different races but do it in a manner that makes the stereotypes seem stupid. By making fun of these stereotypes, it shows that they are not based on truth and should not be as widely believed as they are and need to change. Hopefully as people become more open to learning about other races, these stereotypes can be removed from our society and people will become more accepting of others. With Obama in the White House, there is finally a chance for equality in America, not only for black people but for people of all races.
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This blog really made me think a lot about the things I say and that other’s say to me that could be labeled as offensive. We talked a lot about this topic in last week’s discussion section, and this blog adds more questions to the great “what is offensive?” debate.
After attending lecture over the last several weeks, one thing that I have learned is that I think a lot like Sam. In particular, we have similar sense of humors. One example of this is shown in the three images and videos from the blog. I think that all three of them are hilarious, and because they are also true, I don’t think that it is right to find these things offensive.
I am a person that likes to joke around a lot and people may find some things I say to be offensive, even if they don’t pertain to them. When someone tells me something that I said was mean, my common response is “when I say something that isn’t true, I’ll apologize.” I just don’t think that people can be offended by a comment if that comment is true.
Black people like chicken and watermelon and Asians are good at math. These are two common stereotypes that many people hold and make comments about. But due to the fact that these are often true, I don’t think that people should be offended by the comments. I have a very good black friend who constantly makes jokes about the fact that his favorite meal is fried chicken with some watermelon on the side. He can joke about a stereotype, something that I think more people should be able to do.
I understand that I am writing about stereotypes that don’t pertain to me and therefore I am not offended, but I have the same attitude to comments that do affect me. For example, not too long ago I was at a party and was called a “rich white girl from the suburbs.” Did I get angry? No. Why? Because it is absolutely true. I was stereotyped based on my appearance and the way I talked and acted, but the accuser was completely correct on their assumptions. Because of this, I felt that I had no right to be mad. Now, if someone had called me something untrue, then I would have gotten mad.
I feel that the public needs to lighten up a little bit on things and stop calling everything “offensive.” Our society has become fixed on this and by doing this, anything from a kid’s cartoon to “Barack the Magic Negro” could be considered offensive. When people put themselves into the media’s attention, whether it be a celebrity, a presidential candidate, or an illegal trying to sneak into America, that person needs to understand that they will be ridiculed. I truly believe that those people care a lot less about what is being said than others think they do. If everything starts to get marked as offensive for one tiny insult or comment, our country would no longer have anything to read, watch, or listen to.
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As far as the watermelon picture goes, I don’t think the joke is crossing the line. It’s just a joke. However, adding an insensitive line like “no kids there won’t be an Easter Egg hunt this year…” seems to make a mockery of tradition. It also seemingly says that just because our president is black, White House traditions won’t continue. White or black or yellow or whatever, we are all United States citizens who will most likely continue the traditions of the White House and our nation.
I actually saw this joke a while ago. My boyfriend’s father showed it to me. Although I am fervently against racism, my boyfriend’s family is racist (something I cannot change). I was confused at the joke. I didn’t understand. When I voiced my confusion he explained to me that black people love watermelon – fried chicken and watermelon. I still didn’t understand. He tried to explain it to me, but I couldn’t understand. I said, “I love watermelon, doesn’t everybody? I don’t get what the problem is…” I wasn’t trying to be stupid; I just couldn’t grasp the meaning of the joke. Eventually, he sighed in exasperation and stopped trying to explain it to me. I of course half yelled that he was being unreasonable and irrational – he just laughed.
I don’t put any stock in this ‘joke,’ I believe it’s an outdated notion and I just cannot find any humor in it.
Concerning the “Barack the Magic Negro,” this is a creative joke that goes a little too far in my opinion. It says Obama is not a real black man, talks about problems that real black people have and have to go through…. I think it not only is making an incredible mockery of Barack (putting him on the level of Puff the magic dragon), but is also furthering and supporting the circulating perceptions of black people by an ignorant public. Because of course “real black men like Snoop… have talked the talk and walked the walk.” Obama achieved a great feat – to say he isn’t authentic is just a way of belittling his success.
In response to the Mexican immigrant video – it’s kind of funny, if I could understand all the words. I am a Mexican American and I do not find it offensive. It’s a stereotyped video, made of stereotypes and it is a little funny because it is based on a bit of truth. What I would find offensive, of what would bother me, is people who actually believe that. People who think ALL Mexicans come here and cause problems. My grandfather speaks both English and Spanish fluently. After talking to him, you would never know that he speaks Spanish or that he is anything but a genuinely U.S. supporting American. To think that anyone would judge HIM or my family just because of our ethnicity would bother me. However, to make a stereotype about Mexicans and make a creative video that does NOT suggest anything violent or mean or contain any comments that suggest violence against people – that’s just a funny, creative video made to parody a perceived problem in America – illegal immigration. Of course, like any joke, it is very exaggerated, but when picking and choosing your life battles… is this really something to get upset about? I don’t think so.
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If you are one of those people that think that people should lighten up and learn how to take a joke. You’re obviously not seeing the point here. These videos are not to be taken lightly…perhaps if YOUR race or YOU were put at the end of a cruel joke then you would understand. It is not fair for people to judge me and not give me a job, treat me with respect, or look at me as a competent person just because of my race.
How would YOU feel if you were told that you couldn’t be paid as much as most people because YOU are of a certain race? How would YOU feel if everyone around you always commented about YOUR race?
I enjoy laughing and I don’t mind a joke or two. But to say that people should lighten up? Do you know the struggles I’ve gone through in order to get where I’m, the amount of times I asked my mom why do people hate the color of my skin? Do you know what its like for a mother to explain such thing to a child?
Lighten up, you say, I think you need to realize that people DIED and are still DYING because of their skin color. How would you feel if you knew that your life could end, you would leave your family, your dreams, your friends, you gf/bf JUST BECAUSE SOMEONE HAD A PROBLEM WITH YOUR SKIN COLOR. How would you feel to be on the spot light every single time someone says a joke and immediately looks at you for your reaction and see if it’s “okay.”
I do think that people should laugh at themselves. But who says that a stereotype describes who I’m? So don’t be naïve and say that if you were Mexican, Black, Jewish, etc. you wouldn’t feel offended. Because the fact is you are not and you will never know what it feels like.
Also – there is research that shows that video games do guide kids to turn to violence as a solution. It is called reinforcement – B.F. Skinner studies – google it.
Other things on my mind – regarding this idea that immigrants bring crime to the U.S.A. Studies/research show that it is the total opposite – an immigrant would want to make themselves not as visible, therefore they usually keep low. The media as taught us about these gangs and “chulos” but this is not every single Mexican – this is not to say that there aren’t Mexican gangs – because they’re definitely out there. But just as many Mexican gangs exist so do American ones.
I usually do laugh at myself and at the ridiculousness that stereotypes are. But this does not mean that EVERYONE is okay with it. So it is unfair for you to find people that do not find humor in this as “taking things too seriously.”
Bottom line – stereotypes can hurt people.
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I strongly believe that there is a fine line between being humorous and then being blatantly disrespectful. I think that every person who uses the “watermelon joke” knows where it derives from and is aware that it sparks anger in most African Americans. Similarly speaking, the same idea applies to the assumption that the majority of Mexicans want to invade the United States and take power over Americans. These are all myths and perspectives that have hypnotized people into thinking this way about the vast majority of cultures. The “offensive” part is what blooms from these narrow-minded ideas and that is what makes African Americans and Mexicans mad. I could never feel their pain of mental abuse when labels are place upon them just for being who they are. I’ve never talked about this situation with a Mexican because I don’t know too many but I don’t need many broken walls to see their point of view.
In regards to Mexican culture, I can predict how such sentiments positively or negatively affect their lives solely based upon my background upbringing. My own family used to make racial remarks about Mexicans and slander their families if they would hear on the news about more trying to “cross the border”. It’s embarrassing to state that fact but it’s the truth just as that song portrays how people like my elders feel about these individuals who just desire opportunity. Point blank, that song was pathetic in two ways: Trying to be funny and trying to make a political statement. If I was even ¼ Mexican I would laugh my socks off because it just had so little significance to my race. On the flipside, what would boil my blood is the impact that it could perhaps have on the minds of Americans of non-Hispanic descent.
I know that Mexicans are ordinary people just like me. I know that they speak another language other than English, and I know that they have the most daring hearts that I will ever come across on this planet. The same goes for black people. I probably won’t pay this song any attention after I finish this journal. However, I know that if a Republican employer saw the video and then interviewed a Mexican man/woman they would probably not consider them for the job no matter how qualified he/she was. It’s a basic example of fear. The fear of losing control and subduing to another is what will influence the decision of anything. Insulting videos that were made on the strength of this ideology is how crossing the line can provoke a sense of offense. I bet that artist didn’t even know if Obama liked watermelon or if the person making the “Star Spanglish Banner” YouTube clip would make the headline blog on a Race-Relations site. But, they did and bottom line, people need to keep their opinions to themselves if they’re blind to which direction it could fly.
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I have an issue with pride.
I am apart of the privileged white male society. If a black couple walks past me in Philly the woman won’t suddenly get cold and hold her man a little closer. If I walk into a convenient store in the middle of the night the old clerk won’t watch me with one hand on the hidden revolver under the counter. I don’t get awkward tense stares if someone asks me if I would like some fried chicken. I will never know what it is really like to be a person of darker skin tone in America today. It is also likely that I will never really know what it is like to be the minority in a social gathering. Those things aside, I think it is nearly impossible to go through this world without someone going out of their way to really try and offend you.
I am a male of not a large stature with a non-threatening face and long blonde hair. On a fairly regular basis I get called a faggot. Pickup truck drives by at 2am “BLONDE FAGGOT!” kids get on the empty bus and see me “hehe look at the faggot”. I have come to the conclusion that they are not simply calling me a faggot in the same way that “gay” is used to mean stupid, because I also get hit on by drunk gay men at 2 in the morning on Sunday night after indigo’s rainbow night lets out. Now I’m not gay, or at least on a scale of 1 to gay I’m probably about a Jake Gyllenhaal. I’ve never actually done the no pants gay dance, but I have no problem convincing total strangers that I love the cock. I believe this might be so because a long time ago I abandoned my pride. Pride is that primitive like mechanism inside all of us that makes us think we need to defend ourselves against people who we care nothing about. If someone is willing to call me a faggot from the window of their moving car, then there is no changing that person, they have gone off the deep end of suppressed homosexuality and they are not coming back. I believe this goes for racists too. If the same thing happened to me that happened to a black man, but instead they called him a nigger, I believe there is no changing that person. The only thing that you can really hope for is that that ignorant asshole will eventually slip up and do something like that in front of someone with power and they will lose their job, or go to jail, or get run over by a truck.
Now I admit that I am comparing the struggles of a black person to the struggles of gay person, but I do not think that they are the same. A black person can’t dress slightly different and groom/talk differently then suddenly be white, they will always be black, as long as they are in America, they will unfortunately always be see as different. Now if you believe that this makes my argument null and void, then fine. I’m only trying to convey the point that an insult is only an insult if it is taken as such. Everyone that has said something offensive to someone else is purposefully looking for a reaction, if you react negatively and in a defensive manner, then they won, they got the reaction they were looking for. If you take that power away from them, then you are the victor. That time those two guys saw me on the bus, and one turned to the other and said “hehe, look at the faggot” I stood up, followed them to their seat, and sat right there next to them. “so I’m glad somebody finally noticed me, you guys wanta come to Chumlies with me tonight? It’s gona be soooo much fun…”
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I will agree that the statement “I find that offensive” is thrown around far too much. I believe that unless you can back up your reasoning for why it is offensive, you have no reason to speak up, especially if it is not directed toward you.
However, sometimes people’s opinions can hurt others, and sometimes they are meant to. I cannot think of anyone that I know who would be angered by the painting of the White House with the watermelons, although some may not like it and it really is not humorous. Sometimes jokes get old, overused, and were never really all that funny in the first place. Some generalizations can be backed up to a point, but they do not need to be our only ideas of a group of people, we need to learn to dig deeper and see the good. However, would a black individual who is upset about this painting be upset about a generalization that put shows them in a good light? For instance, when I go to track meets and we mention good runners, the first question is usually, “are they black?” Would the same person be offended by this comment or find some type of upper hand in it?
The video of Obama is something to be expected in politics, but it does cross the line. This is, after all, the new leader of the free world and we should back him up as a country, whether we voted for him or not, he needs our support.
When I watched the other video of the Mexicans, I realized just how easy it is to portray a group in a bad light. Not all Mexicans feel this way or act like that. I don’t know how they would react to the video, because I am not Mexican nor do I know any well enough to bring the issue up with, but it does bother me that people are spreading this. It seems to me that they are being shown to be bad just because people are upset with illegal immigrants, but how much do these “aliens” do for us? How many hard labor jobs do they do that most of us would not? They are hired because they need the money and are grateful for the work, not because they want to take our jobs and overrun our country. I would be fine with being a co-worker or friend of a Mexican, they’re people too, and not all are angry.
So what is offensive? That depends on your own personal views. But do not go around saying that you find something offensive if you cannot back it up. If it affects you on a personal level, speak your mind. This is what free speech is for isn’t it?
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I think every person has a different spot when their line is crossed and different spots for different issues. I could find something funny or amusing that someone else I know would take offense. It is very difficult because everyone reacts differently. I think we get the most offended when it is something we believe or something about who you are. I am a catholic but not a full on catholic. I don’t take offense to a lot of catholic things but there are certain things that bother me. This is probably because they mean something to me. There are things that I don’t take offence to but I think are very inappropriate and upsetting. I think it has to deal with also, if you can laugh about your self or your beliefs. It is like the comedian we watched in class. If we can’t laugh at our selves most would have taken offence to some of the things mentioned. In a comedian’s show you know he is joking but what about that other person with their tone that didn’t seem to be joking. I think the tone someone makes a remark in is very important. If someone is completely serious about what they are saying, I think people have more of a tendency to take offence.
When we were in class on Tuesday, Professor Richards was saying how we don’t know how Jesus was a prophet to the Muslim religion and was saying we knew nothing about how Muslim, Judaism and Christian had the same God. I took offence or disagreed because I knew that. I went to catholic school for 8 years. I had religion everyday. I didn’t think he could say the whole class was unaware. I knew that was his thought about our class but see how easily someone can get offended when you talk about something they know.
With Barack the magic Negro, I think its funny someone would take time to write sure a song about someone. I don’t think the song it self is funny. I bet Barack didn’t even take offence. He seems stronger but who knows it could have really hurt him. I think the people that heard it were either offended, thought it was inappropriate or they laughed. Everyone has a different place where their line is considered crossed.
For the Mexican’s who are in America, I think many of them believe in the United States and our country. To become a citizen is a lot of work and most of them believe in what they learn. Then the Star Spanish Banner just said they don’t. When I first listened to that song I laughed a little because that is what many people say about Mexican immigrants. I think the song would be really offending to any Mexicans in the United States. A line was crossed with both those songs. Even though they had nothing to do with me, I know people are offended and that’s not right.
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I will admit that many people suffer from the fine line between poking some fun and being slightly offensive. And oftentimes we cross this so-called line and we don’t even know it until the repercussions hit us in the face (sometimes literally).
In our weekly group discussion class we discussed when it is ok to joke about someone’s differences and when you’ve gone too far. I made the point that sometimes I feel certain racial groups become much more heated when a joke (offensive or not) has been made than others. After much discussion on this topic with the people in my class that are of a different race than myself, I have realized that it’s not exactly different races that feel easily offended, it’s different people. A few of the black people in my class say that they oftentimes do not take offense to most jokes because they have a sense of humor. They also made the point that they themselves are highly cultured and interact with all sorts of groups of people and in turn they don’t feel so defensive. This point helps me to believe that when people get heated over what can be argued as nothing, it may just be a sign of ignorance.
On the other hand, if you play on a joke whose actual meaning is offensive then you have without a doubt most likely crossed the line for a vast majority. With the watermelon example, it’s not the actual idea that black people are known for liking watermelon that is offensive, but that the way they are said to eat the watermelon that is a form of inferiority.
As for the “Star Spanglish Banner” video, I feel this video has crossed the line from funny to offensive and highly untrue. Although many feel that the Mexican immigrants are trying to transform our American culture into a Mexican one, I can honestly say that I do not agree. Being from the south I oftentimes get frustrated when I cannot understand the Hispanic cashiers and waiters/waitresses etc. and feel that they should learn the language of our country when they come here. However, I often forget to take a step back and think about how hard it is to learn another country’s language and lifestyle. I took Spanish for five years and I hardly know more than ‘Hola’.
I also find it extremely unfair to say that Mexicans are trying to transform our country into a Mexican one. If they really wanted to live the lifestyle that they had back in Mexico, then they never would have gone through such grueling attempts to make it to America, they would have just stayed there. I feel there is nothing wrong with staying in touch with your culture and practices, but I do think it is unfair to say that they are trying to wish their ways upon us.
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Hmmm. I do find this picture very offensive. And yes I think that offensive is the right word for it. ANY word is the right word for describing what it is that you are feeling. I feel like there are so many other funny things to joke about than to take something like this and call it an attempt at getting someone to laugh. If you ask me most assholes hide behind that idea of just trying to make someone laugh and accuse other people of being oversensitive to hide that fact that they are an asshole who just made a stupid asshole joke. They also somehow try to discredit people who take offensive to their jokes by concentrating on little things like whether “offensive” is the right word or asking people to defend and explain why they were offended. Yes, it is important to explain to the person/s who has offended you why you are upset because in a nicer world, they of course have no idea why. But people whose work and joy is to make up these “jokes” almost always know why someone would be offended by what they say or the image they portray which is why it is suppose to be funny in the first place.
As far as, the watermelon stereotype goes, let me just say that it can not at all be compared to Japanese people eating sushi or Mexican eating red peppers. First of all, they are not even stereotypes….people don’t go around changing pictures of Japanese picture to somehow incorporate sushi. Secondly, I don’t think watermelon is a very popular thing for black people to eat anyway. I think that if you feel like black people loving watermelon (more than anyone else does) is true than you are feeding into this stereotype that has been in existence for more than 100 years. By the way, I hate watermelon!
I had heard of the Magic Negro song but never got a chance to listen to it but let me tell you that I was shocked. Does ANYONE think this is funny? Maybe I’m bias or something but I also can’t believe he thought this would actually HELP his campaign. And it also sounded to me like someone trying to impersonate a black person (the person singing the song that is), which is a problem in itself. And who actually has time to do all this stuff? I found the Star Spanglish Banner just as offensive, probably more offensive actually. I’m going to assume that the video flick also went with the song originally too. I’m going to guess that maybe a few Mexican people should now explain why this is offensive to PROVE to everyone that it is just slightly offensive enough to not be funny.
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