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182266 Responseshttp://www.racerelationsproject.org/2010/02/inequality-class-question-two/Inequality+Class%3A+Question+Two2010-02-20+12%3A23%3A25Sam+Richards to Inequality Class: Question Two
I do not think that the statistic you were talking about meant that if they are black that they automatically go to prison, just that they get sentenced longer. Money may have a lot to do with it though. Depending on the crime a judge may be more likely to sentence a white person with a lot of money and a good lawyer to less time than a black person with not very much money and a below average lawyer. But I think that is just how it works. Unless you want to require that the best lawyers in the country represent the people that cannot afford them, then people have to be satisfied with the fact that the people with the best lawyers are going to get off easer. Dante Stallworth killed a guy while driving drunk a year ago and he is now playing football again with the Ravens, probably because he had a hell of a lawyer. O.J., Ray Lewis, I don't think that this topic is one sided. While it is unfortunate that people with money get off a lot easier I think that it is just that, people with money. And, maybe the poorer you are the more sentencing you get, which is even worse, but I do not think that it is a question of race.
Just because your black doesn’t mean you will get sentenced longer at all. The sentence goes along with the type of the crime. If you commit a crime, the evidence proved in court helps the judge come to a decision. If there is not and significant evidence, the judge can’t just sentence you because your black. That is really wrong and does not occur. The data Sam presented is on a much smaller scale probably. If you took data from across the country, it would be different. We treat everyone fairly in our criminal justice system. That’s why we have a trial by jury and the right to legal representation and counsel.
I believe you are taking things out of context. No one said just because your balck you are subject to be in jail longer. No! But something is clearly missing from this picture. Why is it that two people have the same crime but one ultimately pays the worst consequence? You've seen the statistics. You can't argue the fact that white people are the one's committing the most crime but why are the blacks the one's to be sentence? It doesn't makes any sense at all. The numbers just don't add up! I know we all try to keep this "idea" that we live in a just world, but that's absolute bullshit and we need to stop being ignorant to what's going on around us.
I think it is an interesting comment about the correlation between financial status and quality of a lawyer. The statistic probably does stem from this fact. If you can afford an experienced, persuasive lawyer to represent you, most likely your chances of getting off in the court system are incredibly high. When you have decent representation, you will be much more successful in getting an easier punishment. You will probably show up to court in a nice suit and say all the proper things. Your lawyer will have trained you to say what the judge and jury want to hear. People who do not have much money will not have had this type of preparation and probably will not get the same treatment. So it is interesting to think about if everyone had an equally experienced lawyer how much those statistics would change? Would the black convicts still get harsher punishments?
In my opinion, I believe that both money and race speak volumes when influencing the Criminal Justice System. I agree that not all judges and lawyers are racists, but discrimination still takes place within our system. I also think that money speaks louder than skin tones in some cases and can affect a convicted offender’s chances of being charged for a crime. It seems that minority incarceration just kind of depends on surrounding circumstances, justice official’s values and beliefs, and financial situations.
I’ve heard many explanations as to why discrimination still takes place within the criminal justice system. I mean, with the statistics we’ve seen in class where approximately half of prison populations hold African Americans clearly shows that race does play a factor in our courts system. Some people have said that people of color just flat out commit more crimes than whites do. There is no evidence that links a person’s race to committing more crimes. On the other hand, sociodemographic reasons besides race (such as income, age, and gender) have been linked to crime. The majority of minority groups are suffering from economic disadvantages. Like Sam was saying in class the other day, whites got to the top of the hill and did not allow people of color to have the same opportunities as whites; even after the Civil War and Civil Rights Movements. Poorer people may resort to crime because they were not given the same opportunities that whites have. Income figures of racial groups do have correlation though. An offender’s support system, employment status, housing, and previous criminal offenses are all taken into consideration in the court system. Poorer people may not be able to afford an attorney or pay for bail. Due to financial reasons, Judges may be less likely to drop charges. So it may seem that race is the primary decision maker in how the Criminal Justice System functions when in fact it maybe more of an income discrepancy.
Then again, just because income does play a large factor in an offender’s opportunities to escape incarceration doesn’t mean that race is completely excluded from this argument. Some people believe that the Criminal Justice System is racist or that society is racist which leads to a racism in the courts. Evidence of racial profiling unfortunately still takes place. Some police officers arrest offenders of color even when they have no justification or reason to do so. Arrest rates of minorities are a lot higher than their offenses justify. The fact alone that more people of color are incarcerated than whites shows that our Criminal Justice System has some problems. Stereotyping about a racial group can lead to more arrest rates as well. After September 11th, homeland security has kept a vigilant eye on Muslims and those with a Middle Eastern background. Racial discrimination still takes place and continues to corrupt many officials’ rulings of justice. Although money talks, skin color can speak louder to some justice officials.
So I’ve come to the conclusion that both sides of the argument as to why minorities are incarcerated more than whites are both valid. Racial discrimination and income advantages may all be limited to the type of offense, community in which the offense took place, defendants, and surrounding circumstances. A corrupted system can never truly be fixed, but when people work together for justice’s sake, changes can be made to make the system as fair as possible.
Once again money seems to be the main topic over everything. After talking to my discussion group every week it all boils down to money, and every week we are focused to think why is it always about money? I think in a lot of cases money is the most powerful thing. When it comes to the Criminal Justice System I agree with mlp5180 that the judge takes into account money and race. I don’t think that all judges are racist because there are black/brown/colored judges and when they see a colored person before them who has commit a criminal offense they are not going to be racist towards them. But in the case where a white person is a judge and they have to make a decision based on that fact that this white person or this black person has done a criminal offence then I think the white judge will accuse the black person. A lot of times I think it depends on who the judge is.. the court system does have a lot to due with racism.
Another point to bring up is I think the court also has a problem with sexism. For example, my ex boyfriend got caught with public drunkenness as Penn State. He had his license taken away from him for 6 months and also had to pay a big fine. On the other hand one of my girl friends has gotten six (yes this is a lot) times caught with public drunkenness. In her case, she never got her license taken away and this happened at Penn State here as well. I think the court system is really messed up based on racism, sexism, and money. Because how can a male with one time get caught for public drunkenness get his license taking away compared to a girl that had that happen to her six times and never get her license taken away??
Money can bring people a long way. For example, look at celebrities like Paris Hilton. She has committed acts like DUIs and has been able to pay money to bail her out of it or at least keep her out of jail for lesser days. This is unfair to a normal colored person or even white person who has committed the same act but does not have the money or fame to bail themselves out of the situation.
I also like way mlp5180 said about race and money.. "Poorer people may not be able to afford an attorney or pay for bail. Due to financial reasons, Judges may be less likely to drop charges. So it may seem that race is the primary decision maker in how the Criminal Justice System functions when in fact it maybe more of an income discrepancy. " I agree with this totally. I feel like a lot of times people do not have the money in their pockets or even have the family to help them and bail them out. When the people are in front of the judge, the judge knows somewhat of their background and if one person standing in front of them has more money than the other they are automatically going to think that the one who is more poor is the one who did commit the crime. I think that the court system is really unfair, but also in everyday life everything always boils down to money and even race.
I agree that money is a huge part in the way fairness and power is distributed. To make a comparison and offer a different perspective not yet mentioned (as far as I know) I want to talk about slavery and money. As said in the previous blogs, unfair sentencing in the judicial systems seem to be less influenced by race, which by no means deserves to be dismissed, but is rather controlled by the power of money. This is true for slavery as well. A lot of misconceptions about new world slavery tend to put the blame of enslavement at the hands of racist ideologies. While that may offer some explanation for the forced labor of racial groups easily separated and distinguished from races of higher class and power, that separation lends itself to a financial gap that exists between classes in power and powerless classes. These people in control of those working in forced labor have many things in their favor that can mostly be obtained through money. As shown in the book “Disposable People” a lot of these slaves are workers forced into a life of never-ending debt. Though their race and caste may have, in the eyes of their master, brought them deservingly to their current state as slaves, a sudden possession of money by the slaves would almost certainly, in most cases, free them of their bondage as they could finally pay the full extent of their debt (whether inflated unfairly or not). Additionally (in most cases), if forced labor was to prove to be of no profit to the people abusing the system, it wouldn’t matter how racist the masters were…they wouldn’t go through with slavery anymore. I feel like the same applies in the court system. You could be a racist judge with no regards for brown or black people and honestly believe that a black murderer deserves the worst punishment while the white murder gets a second chance, but if the black man presented the judge with a million dollar check and the white man had nothing to offer, the results would be quite the opposite to those who think racism predominates in the legal systems. I could see how cops might be more prone unclip their holster while approaching a black man pulled over because of stereotypes and stigmas of today’s society. However, come prosecution time, I would find it hard to believe that if money was a key player of the criminal’s sentence it would be completely ignored due to a person’s racist tendencies. I’m not dismissing racism or saying that it has no influence in the criminal or legal systems. I just think that money is a more powerful, yet much more rare factor in every day prosecutions. Therefore I guess you could say that on average, racism does predominate.
You made a really interesting point when you talked about sexism. I had never considered that an option, perhaps because I was so focused on racism in the courts. Nevertheless it is something that definitely exists in our court system. The only possible explanation I can come up with is perhaps judges view women as much more innocent, even if they aren’t. I am not sure if I agree with your point however that colored judges can’t be racist to colored people, or at least not be reversed racist. Perhaps some colored judges feel pressure when dealing with a colored person because they don’t want to give off the idea that they are going easy on them just because they are the same color. That in turn may make them even harder on someone of their same race.
Yes, its true that money plays a role in our Judicial system. They have been cases that money won such as that of Donte Stallworth and O.J. Simpson. These are two murderers who were sentenced to a couple of months in jail and community service. However, for those who are less fortunate, it is a different story.
With all the statistic and data that Sam Richards presented in class, it is obvious that discrimination still take place, even in today's world. People of color, especially African Americans are not always getting a fair judgment compared to whites in America. Blacks have always been oppressed in this country. History reveals the different obstacles that blacks in America overcame such as slavery and the civil rights movement. Whites in America have always been on top and they obviously do not want any other race to take their spot. When blacks were freed from slavery, the had nothing to support themselves to survive. In other words, they had to go back to the people who have been using them to whole time. It is a system that was use to keep black people from booming to their full potential.
Ever since I was born, people around me installed a certain idea in my head. People always gave me the idea that black people commit the crimes. I grew up with this twisted idea that black people always steal, kill, rob, get into fights, and go to prison. Watching films, I noticed that most of the most feared criminals and people in straightjackets were people of color. I kept this sick, false impression until I first visited Taiwan. I saw crime everywhere. On the news, people killed their parents, killed their children, sliced off family members’ arms, and even cut their family members into pieces to throw into soup. These are, of course, the extreme cases that people release to the media because they produce grotesque entertainment. However, drug use, theft, and numerous cases of grand theft auto was all around me. Even my own car was stolen after parking it for 3 hours as I went to attend church.
Then I watched the movie “American History X.” This movie was not all factual, but it represented an aspect of our community that really horrified me. Racism was and is still a disgusting product of our world. It is a vicious cycle that could have been cured or helped, but people kept going at it and it is getting worse and worse every day. It showed me that white people are just as cruel and that evil and crime in this world is not determined at all by skin color but that anyone can do things such as murder and most of our country has touched some form of illegal drug.
When Sam brought the discussion of the people who are arrested and put in prison, I realized that there is blatant racism when it comes to the judicial system. People such as me have always been told that black people commit the crimes and areas with black people are dangerous. It is not so much that they are black that they commit crimes, but because the areas where crime is committed are usually poorer areas of our country. Why are most drug dealers that are arrested black? I know many of my black friends do smoke pot in Penn State, but almost all of my white and Asian friends have smoked pot to my knowing. I have smoked weed before and none of the people that I have encountered during my experiences were black. Anyone who sells drugs is a drug dealer. How come everyone has the impression that drugs are done by people of color rather than Asians and white people? This idea is bullshit.
My opinion is that black people do not commit that many more crimes than white people and if they do it is not because of their race. People who are in poor conditions and have to live in shitty areas often feel restless and an urge to better their conditions. As people think that they are more likely to be criminals than other races, they aren’t given the opportunities the rest of us are given. For example, a cop is more likely to pull over a black person than a white person. In conclusion, I would just have to say the world is bullshit and that people of color are always put down. It’s a sick, twisted, and unfair cycle. That is all.
I kind of agree with the person in the video. I do find it hard to believe that every judge in the U.S Court system is racist. The thing that struck me in the video that we watched in class about the person being arrested for the drug deal is where the police are targeting these drug deals. They were setting up people who were easy targets. I think that since the majority of drug deals take place in poorer neighborhoods, and since many African Americans live in poorer neighborhoods than whites, that is the reason why they are arrested so prevalently for drugs. I feel like a person who deals in rich white neighborhoods is somewhat harder to catch, plus law enforcement doesn’t suspect there to be anyone dealing drugs in a rich white neighborhood.
You made a few great points in your post. The first being the video we watched showed the deal happening and the dealer being caught. Being in a poorer neighborhood makes a lot easier to get caught as well because the police kind of expect it to happen while in richer areas police aren't really looking for drug deals as much. Another point I made in an earlier blog post that dealt with offenders that would go right back to prison after being released was for the same crime which is seen a lot with dealers. Many see dealing to be quick money and why stop if there aren't any other options in poorer neighborhoods.
This question is definitely an interesting one that, to me, has multiple answers. Let me start by saying money plays the biggest role. No matter where you are in the world if you have cash you are going to get along easier than someone who does not have money. This concept is not very hard to grasp and most people understand it. More money can buy “better” lawyers or more lawyers to help you plead your side of the case. I want to talk briefly about marijuana crimes because the marijuana laws are a passion of mine and they clearly illustrate the power of money. It used to be that the majority of smokers were either minorities or came from a lower economic class. However today’s smoking population defies economic class and race. Weed has worked its way into mainstream society with its own brand of movies, music, and comedy. It has also worked its way to the white house with President Obama admitting to past marijuana use. Our current laws with marijuana everywhere are now screwing people but the magnitude of the screwing is different from person to person. Some people come from an upper class family who has the money to pay for a lawyer and others simply do not. That dictates the punishment. Another thing that dictates the punishment is location. There is a huge difference between someone who gets caught smoking a joint in State College and someone who gets caught smoking a joint in New York City. In the State College system the judge may see someone who just was at the wrong place at the wrong time. In contrast the New York City judge may see just another kid who is a troublemaker because he sees so many similar cases, regardless of skin color. That isn’t to say that skin color doesn’t place a role because, quite frankly, it does. I have a white friend who was riding with a black driver. The driver had not been doing anything wrong but since it was a weeknight and the police had nothing better to do they pulled him over. They then searched the car and found some weed along with a few items of paraphernalia. In my opinion if you would have switched the driver and the passenger there is no way that the car would have been pulled over and both of my friends would not have been in any trouble. It is a sad reminder of the world we live in. The numbers that we were shown to us in class do not lie. There is an aspect of racism in the police department, and in the judicial system. However, if you have money it is a lot easier for a judge to give you a second chance instead of locking you up and throwing away the key.
I have to agree 100 percent with you when you say "money plays the biggest role." Just look at Hollywood: how many of your favorite movie stars and pop rockers have gotten in trouble for one thing or another and got away with it when everyone knows that your typical American citizen would have been thrown behind bars for the same crime? It comes down to the fact that money can pretty much buy you out of anything (with the exception of Bernie Madoff who clearly despite the fact that he embezzled more money than any one person should be allowed to have, can't buy his way out of being convicted) why you have it/ are famous. When it comes down to things (and as shown graphically by Sam during class), minorities generally tend to have lower household incomes when compared to those of White people. Not saying that people with money don’t do drugs, but the people who do drugs and get caught tend to be in the lower-class housing developments like the projects or ghettos. And since police know that illegal activity is happening in those areas, of course they’re going to pay more attention to tip offs and are going to be patrolling the streets and sending out undercover officers more than they would be in say Beverly Hills.
Now… the question becomes why is this even allowed in the first place? Clearly it's not difficult to figure out who is accepting bribes (Hey there Your Honor- nice new BMW you have there…), but why isn't anybody doing anything about it? I think that fact is just as disturbing as the fact that more Black people are in jail than White. We all know that life isn’t fair and that the average person typically doesn’t get what they deserve, but is it too much to ask for some decency in the system that is supposedly what sets us apart from third world countries?
So it all seems to come down to money. The difference between white and black people is money. Not. The criminal justice system is racist. There is no way around that. I always wonder why people assume that white people have more money than black people. I guess sometimes it is true, but when it comes to the criminal justice system, no one can be too sure of who has what. If a white person commits a crime equivalent to a black person’s crime, who is to say that the white person will have the money to get the “get out of jail free” card? Maybe the black person has all the money in this case, but maybe they are both deserving of the punishment they receive due to the severity of their crime. Maybe money is the most powerful aspect to beat the system, but I also do think that the opinions of the judge play a huge role in the decision making.
Another issue is the difference between genders for all parties in the situation. For example, if a male cop is on duty, he may be more likely to look out for illegal male activity rather than female activity. This demonstrates sexism and how men may favor women over their own kind. I know people who have been arrested and thrown in jail, and most of the time, the cop has been male. Where I live in New York, the cops are so unfriendly that people try their best to avoid encounters with them solely do to that.
When I was a senior in high school, my criminal justice professor took us to a maximum security prison. To say the least, I have never been more scared in my entire life. The men and women were on different floors so we got to see one of each. The women were more aggressive and crude than the men were by far. This prison was located on the Eastern tip of Long Island in a town called Riverhead. I do not know much about the area, and I know that the prison is maximum security, but the majority of the prisoners, both men and women, in there were black. I got to hear what some of the crimes these people committed and they definitely were in prison for a good reason, not just because they were black.
I don’t think the criminal justice system will ever be ‘just’ but that is something this world needs to face and deal with as long as it is going on. There will forever be arguments and screaming about who and why is guilty or innocent, but as a whole, the system is majorly flawed.
Honestly, It might have to do with money sometimes, depending on the situation. However, for the most part money or color I do not think play a role in sentencing. I feel as if a lot more colored people commit more crime based on the percentage of them in the US. For instance there is more whites in the US, but I think when it comes to crime you seem them in areas where colored people are. Now I am not saying white people do not commit bad crimes because they do, but I feel that if you think black people are getting sentenced longer it is because the crime they did was worse.
In a recent study i looked at it showed that black men are six times more likely to go to jail than white men are. Whether its accurate or not some asked if it was because you think they are deprived economically? They have few choices of landing good jobs due to racism? Or is it their natural racial characteristics? To me i think no, it is not natural racial characteristics. black folk are not predispostioned to crime. it is generally due to the fact that more black people are raised in poverty compared to white people. because of this poverty, they don't have the same access to a good education and school programs to educate and occupy them after school. Any person can get into trouble if they don't have the education for a good job and a lot of free time on their hands. Personally, from what I have seen, and this is my opinion only, criminality is not dependent on ethnicity. I have not seen, myself, any indication that any ethnicity, when they have the same socioeconomic standing and general upbringing, has any greater or lesser proclivity to violence and crime. On another hand it is said that 25% of blacks live in poverty. Poor people are far more likely to wind up in jail than rich people. Because more blacks are poor they are more likely to be in jail. Some say that in their opinion the issue is also far more complex then your several line thesis could even begin to explain. Whites make up a bigger percentage of the population, so naturally, they will be arrested more. Its just a numbers issue. The alarming fact is that blacks are arrested at such a high rate. So how is it that white people make a bigger percentage of the population but blacks are put in jail more and there are less of them just makes you wonder in some cases. In 2002 A new study in the US has shown that while 603,000 black US men are going to college or university, 790,000 are in prison. In the last 20 years, 5 times as many black men have been sent to prison than before that. I'm not sure of the statistics that stand now in the year 2010 but that really makes you sit back and think. Hopefully the statistics are not that crucial anymore and things are starting to change for the better but as far as the court system goes it's hard to say based on individual judges and what they decide to do and will ever in our life be a fair system. Other statics show standing of where black and white races are in jail but as far as the court system and trying to predict where the judges stand on their outlook of who should go to jail and who should not i really think it all depends on them and is hard to say.
I think that with this question, it is a combination of both factors: Money and the color of your skin. Obviously if on average whites have more money, they are going to get a better lawyer. And as guilty as you may be, your lawyer is there to save you and make you appear innocent. If you can't afford a good lawyer, in most cases, you are screwed. Many people who can't afford a lawyer are given one. That lawyer is most likely not as recognized and as experienced.
With the question of whether or not a judge views the case and sees a black man for example, and declares he is guilty. I don't think that the decision is based solely on the color of his skin, but it definitely is a factor in the process. If he is on the verge of declaring whether he is guilty or innocent, he may lean towards guilty if the judge is a white male. White supremacy never disappeared and I don't know that it ever will. I think that there are many flaws with the judicial system and I think they lie within the subconscious minds of judges and juries. Many people may say that they believe in equality and do not consider themselves racist, but when they are in front of a trial of a black man accused of murder, they can't help but think that he is guilty. We wish it weren't this way, but it's partly out of our control. Will this faulty judicial system ever been fixed, or at the least improved?
As long as racism and white supremacy exist, the system will have major issues. There are ideas of how it can be fixed. Add more of a diverse courtroom, more black and hispanic judges. But then isn't that reverse discrimination? There is no easy solution to this issue. There is no easy solution, yet it is a huge problem. Consider two men on trial for the exact same case, murder. They both had the same criminal background and the same amount of evidence. Basically everything is the same except for one thing: The white man is extremely wealthy and can afford a very good lawyer, while the black man is assigned to a lawyer because he can't afford one. The white man wears a very nice, expensive suit, whereas the black man doesn't look very professional. How does this case turn out? Well I can't say, but for one, the white man has the advantage and is more likely to be found not guilty than the black man is. This is just the way that things are and it is awful, I hope that eventually one day the court system will be less faulty and based more on fairness and equality.
All classes commit crime. Anyone from Paris Hilton, to a homeless person on the street, can and does commit crimes. Why is it that statistically, the poor have the highest rate of criminal charges and arrests, and the rich have the lowest rate? How do the rich find ways to avoid serving jail time? The answer is money.
I feel that unfortunately, money plays a big role in the country’s legal system—even a bigger role than race. In the United States, whether we would like to admit it or not, when a person commits a crime, it definitely helps him or her to have money.
For example, in order to get a person out of jail immediately, bail money is needed. Someone who I went to high school with recently got out of jail on a hundred thousand dollar bail. If his family was not as wealthy as they are, this person would have had to spend a longer time in jail.
Furthermore, having money is beneficial in the legal system when one has to appear in court. This is because the better, more experienced lawyers are more expensive to hire. In other words, more money gets you better representation in court.
Also, it is usually the people with more money who are more educated. People who are more educated can express themselves better. This is especially beneficial in a court room. A person with an educated background who speaks well is bound to gain more respect from a judge than a person who is uneducated and does not speak well. My father is a lawyer and has taught me a lot about the legal system. He has told me from his own experiences in courtrooms, that certain people on trial are treated differently than others, depending on background, and presentation.
In one of my other classes, I learned about luxury jails. Luxury jails sounds to me like the biggest oxymoron ever. However, I found this idea of a luxury jail very interesting and decided to do some research on them. I was so surprised to learn that these types of jails do indeed exist. They are referred to as self-pay jail systems. An article which was published in the New York Times states that for roughly $75 to $127 a day, convicts can get special accommodations and privileges! Nonetheless, even with a “pay to stay” upgrade, jail is still not a place where anyone would want to be. The article states that inmates who pay extra for nicer cells still feel like prisoners. Regardless, I feel that this concept is very discriminatory. It is just another example of how those with money have more advantages and “easier times” in life than those who are poor.
I think money definitely plays a big part in the judicial system. The more money you have, the better lawyer you can hire, and the better your chances are of getting off or getting a lesser penalty. I do not think that race has much to do with judges' or juries' convictions. A lot of our discussions in class are about how far we have come as a society with racism. If everybody was still so racist that blacks are convicted more often and harsher just because of their skin color, then I would say we haven't come too far. The reason that more blacks are convicted for longer sentences is because inner city crimes really boost up these stats. Murders and other violent crimes are committed in inner cities every day, and most inner cities are made up of a highly African American population. Not to say that whites or other races don't commit bad crimes, but I think that is the reason why the stats show what they do.
I do not think that all judges that sentence blacks to prison and not whites for the same crime are not inherently racist. Personally, I think the amount of resources, like money, that are available for a person plays a role in their sentencing. As discussed in class, whites have a higher income on average compared to blacks. Therefore, since whites have more resources on average, they can acquire better lawyers and more likely to pay off fines. Hence, they do not face jail sentences or as long jail sentences and can usually get away with probation and paying off fines. Now, I do agree that this is unfair that blacks and whites receive different sentences. It is definitely subjective. Our system needs to follow one protocol when sentencing individuals for crimes. It should be clearly objective and the same for each individual that commits the crime.
I think that this is a great question. Whether or not all judges are inherently racist, I highly doubt that, but I definitely think that parts of the system are corrupt. I’m sure that part of it has to do with richer people being able to afford better lawyers, but I truly believe that there are problems with the judicial system. Major cases that are tried by a jury have a higher potential to be flawed, especially in predominantly white counties. I feel that jurors are easily persuaded by arguments from other jurors, this coming from experience when I sat in on a jury. There are some parts of a trial that certain people understand more than others, and are able to shed light on certain subjects, whether it is for the better or worse. So all it takes is for one white racist on a jury to screw up a whole trial.
I love that you asked this question. Blacks are many times more likely to be charged with crimes than white people but I really don’t think this is because the court system is racist. It just seems unrealistic for judges to be that racist against black people. If they are, then that is terrible. I think it has a lot to do with the difference of economic situations. When people have more money they are more likely to engage in healthy activities. I think that when someone has less money, they have more time on their hands to get into mischief and trouble. With less money, people become more desperate for money which leads to robbery and selling of illegal drugs.
I believe that the amount of money someone has does plays a more important role in the justice system than what race somebody is. People with more money tend to be able to get away with more things, because they can buy the better lawyers who are able to spread the most doubt in a jury making their client innocent. Whether someone is white or black, if they have the same amount of money they will pretty much the same chance as being proven innocent. Take the case of O.J. Simpson for instance. He is an African American man with a lot of money who was clearly able to buy his freedom with that money. Even though he was an African American with a lot of evidence against him he still was able to walk free, because of the money.
I completely agree with her comment. The money factor also needs to be taken into account. I know at Penn State a lot of students have been faced with underage drinking. I am not sure of the percentage but I know there are very few of my friends who haven’t had this charge. The difference is, a lot of them if they received these charges have had lawyers and councils to give them they legal advice they need to work the judges and get out of it. I think money plays a big role in the fact that most of these black people are being screwed over. I find it hard to believe that every judge in the legal system is racist so my immediate response would be we also need to take into account the fact that a lot of these people who make mistakes don’t have the advantages to fix them.
I agree with what this girl said, but then I take sides also because my dad is a member of law enforcement. They are not just going to go after you because you are black. They are going after you because you either did something wrong, or they were suspicious of you doing something that you were not supposed to be doing. I think the reason we see more prisoners who are of color is because there are many black and brown people who live in areas that are not very well developed and therefore there are drugs and crime in those areas. The other thing is that there are many white people who live in under-developed areas and many black and brown people who live in the better places of towns and cities. I think the main thing that we need to understand though is that it is not the color of our skin that gets us into trouble. It is the things we do and the situations that we get ourselves into. I believe that our parents and the people who raised us and taught us right from wrong are the ones responsible for this. When we have parents that do not care what we do and ones that let their 10 year olds out to roam the streets late at night, that is when we find trouble. Those children are the ones whose parents did not teach them right from wrong when they were younger and they are now dealing with those consequences. If we want to see crime rates go down and we want to make a difference, then we need to start with OUR children and by teaching them really what is right and what is wrong and not letting them figure it out on their own by getting themselves into trouble to realize the difference. The money aspect of it is not the issue. Children can be taught many things no matter where they live and no matter how much money their parents make. If the parents of that child want him or her to do well and succeed in life, then they have every chance of making that happen. It all starts with basic common sense. The child should be not necessarily asleep, but inside the house at a reasonable time of night and not outside messing around and destroying other people’s property with their friends. I think peer pressure has a lot to do with crimes as well because they will think they are being left out if they do not participate, when it really is in their best interest to just walk away. We need to make the change and teach our children to perform differently and not rely on others to change now because it will not happen. I know it is impossible to get everyone to do this, but that is why it is hard to make change because there are so many people that do not want to change their ways.
I do believe that race plays a big role in the length of the sentence for a crime, but I also believe that it is correlated to the amount of money that person or family has. More African Americans are convicted of committing crimes, but are they really committing that many more crimes than whites or other nationalities? Probably not. In my opinion, I strongly believe that a judge can be bought from the beginning. Money plays an important role. If a white wealthy male and an average black male are tried for the same crime, of course the white male will have a better lawyer, and a better chance of not being convicted. If a rich black male and a poor white male were tried, I think that the court order would be flip flopped and the black male would be off free. The crime that was committed also plays into this. If a person stole a bi store, and the other person sold illegal drugs. Regardless of race, the person who did the greater crime would be punished in a harsher manner. I learned in my section; however, that in society, if a black, a Hispanic, and a white were all applying for the same job, and all three people were equally qualified, the white person has a much higher chance of getting the job. It is similar in the situation of names. A person with a foreign sounding name is less likely to get a call back that a person with an ordinary American name. In shopping malls, pharmacies, and convenience stores, I also learned that the people behind the surveillance cameras and the workers will pay more attention to the “colored” people in the stores. Why does society feel that color of skin creates a good or bad person? The moral standards people uphold themselves to have nothing to do with race in my opinion. I live in an inner city, which is quite diverse. There are black, Hispanic, and white people with the best manners I have ever seen. They treat everybody kindly and do not disrespect anybody. One the other hand, there are black, Hispanic and white people who do steal, destruct property, deal drugs, use weapons, and cause problems in the streets. I have seen a white female be arrested for drug dealing, and a Hispanic be arrested for stabbing one of my friends. This is why my outlook on crime is based more on the money aspect. Because in my neighborhood the crime rates seem pretty equal among races, I see it as the people who are sentenced for a greater time are more than likely those people who cannot afford a good lawyer as a system of defense. It is sad to say that that is what our society has come down to, but I do believe it is true.
I most definitely think that the amount of money you have is proportionate to the amount of time you are going to spend in jail regardless of what race you are. Our judicial system is screwed up enough with regards to the statistics that Sam showed in class about blacks being sentenced longer than whites for the same crimes. There are so many examples in the media of people who either got out of jail time completely or got a really short prison sentence because they were rich and famous. For example, Donte Stallworth who was a big time NFL player was charged with DUI and second degree manslaughter last April. He spent 24 days in jail out of his 30 day sentence. In Florida where he was convicted, vehicular manslaughter while DUI, which carries a maximum sentence of 15 years in prison. Although I realize that the 15 year sentence is the maximum, I wonder what would have happened had Stallworth not been a wealthy professional athlete and just you’re regular Joe Schmo. Even though we discussed drug charges the most in class, I thought that this was an example of a time when someone seemed to get off easier because of the amount of money they had. I am positive if it were to be researched, there are many other famous athletes, actors, models, etc that have received lighter punishments because of who they are. I think that the statement made by the girl in this video poses an interesting question. Going to court in and of itself costs a decent amount of money. When you add a lawyer into the mix it is hard to afford when you are a middle class person. You are probably more likely to be treated fairly when you have a lawyer present. They are trained to know the law and the loopholes and hopefully be able to help you. However, if you come from a low income area and are white, black, brown, red, or purple, you probably can not afford a lawyer to represent you at your trial. This is unfortunate because you have a much better chance of being taken advantage of without legal representation. Overall, while the statistics state that blacks receive more jail time than whites for the same crimes, I think it would be interesting to see what the statistics were if they were broken down into affluence and then color in order to compare it to the statistics brought up in class. The judicial system in the United States is broken and corrupt and also needs to be fixed.
I think that white people having more money is absolutely a factor in the reason why black people are more likely to end up in jail than white people. As she stated, the system is really messed up and I think the court room and the jury tends to be skewed by how good of a show a lawyer puts on. If you commit a crime and you have the funds to hire a lawyer who is well practiced and good at what he or she does, and has that superstar reputation, then you’ll definitely have more of a chance of getting off. As it goes along with the data concerning the incomes of different racial groups, the black population would probably be less likely to afford a better lawyer. Concerning all racial groups across the board, I think the better the lawyer, the more likely the person is not going to get convicted.
This question is very interesting. As we learned in class, there are a lot more blacks in jails, then whites, and they make up a smaller percentage of the population. I often wonder if the court system is “racist” or not, because there are so many more black and minorities in trouble with the law then whites. However, I feel that the main reason why they are more likely to be in trouble is because of where they are from. I really don’t think race plays a huge role, just your background. If you grew up in a city and had a single parent, and were often living off the streets then education would most likely be the least thing on your mind, and crime may be your only alternative to clothing and food. Unfortunately, the statistics don’t agree with me. It seems to be that more and more minorities are being arrested and caught for crimes, then whites are. I do think that the police are more likely to stop a Black or Hispanic person, just because of the stereotype that they are more likely to be poor. For whatever reason, this society has often placed Black and Hispanics into the “poor” category. Police often think of that, and think they may be from a bad background, and like stated before, crime may be their only alternative. Money does play a major role in the court system, I think, because it can help you with so much. Lawyers and bail all require money; white people are more likely to have more money and also more likely to be able to get out of jail. The other side of this is that if a white person is in jail, they probably are not from a very wealthy background or good family base, so they would be more likely to turn to crime. They most likely wouldn’t have the money to pay for a lawyer or bail, and that doesn’t have to do with being white, but because of their background. Unfortunately, many more whites than other minorities seem to have more money, which means a better family base, and a better background. That means that there is a less chance of being involved with crime. I don’t know any cops, but I do think it would be interesting to ask them on average, how many more black people do they arrest then whites and for what reason. I also thought it was interesting to see that women are the least likely to be in jail. I know that brings up the issue of gender, but why is it that people are so shocked to hear a woman commit a crime, then a black male. In today’s society is almost expected that a black male will end up in crime. This assumption is so present in our society, and is seen in the statistics of jail inmates. My thought is that because black males know they are expected to commit a crime, then they don’t overcome the stereotype but continue it. I just don’t think that race should play any role in how your life plays out, especially by playing a role in if you stay in jail or not. However, because white people have more money on average then minorities, they have the power to get out of the trouble they are in with the law. Also, fewer whites are in the jail system, most likely, because they are from better backgrounds and are less likely to commit a crime.
In my opinion, I think economic situation has much more to do with jail sentences than the color of someone’s skin. It is true that there are still many people in our world that are racist. Whether or not people want to believe that is one thing but it is evident in many ways especially in the south. I witnessed first hand a white guy calling a black kid “boy” when I was driving down through Georgia. I was actually shocked but now that I think about it I don’t think I should have been. There is definitely still racism and thinking that every single person in a country of 300 million would be changed only 140 years or so after the “abolishment” of slavery is just naive (of course I know that not everyone was here then and there are minorities to account for). That being said, I do think that money has more to do with it than anything else.
When you hear that a person killed someone and was found guilty, what do you usually think? Personally I think “well did he get life in prison or the death sentence if he was in Texas.” This was not the case with the former NBA basketball player, Jason Williams. He was found guilty but only of manslaughter when it was commonly known he murdered someone in cold blood. His jail sentence: 7 years. The reason I am talking about this is because it is almost time for him to be released from prison back into the world. Also of note is the fact he is a black man and had wealth from playing in the professional leagues. Because this is so important is to show that a black person who is known for committing murder (other than OJ) but who has the wealth to hire very good attorneys can get out of something that a person of normal financial status would not have. Being a white kid, if I committed this murder, because I cannot hire Johnny Cochran I would be sitting behind bars now, in ten years, thirty, and probably for the rest of my life.
I personally think that there is more opportunity to commit a crime when you live in an urban area and you are willing to do anything to make some money. Most people who live in urban areas are black; therefore, more opportunity to commit a crime and a larger police presence to look for that crime being committed. It’s true maybe that white people commit the same amount of crimes but in areas where it is perhaps not looked for or where they have the money to hire the right lawyer. Blacks who commit a crime in an urban area have a higher chance of getting caught and a lower chance of affording the same caliber lawyer. The result: more black people behind bars.
I think that this is a really interesting question to discuss. I think that it is not so much of a race thing as it is a money issue. I mean don't get me wrong I think that there are plenty of cases in which race plays into the discrimination of an individual, however I think that the larger issue in society at the moment is the fact that money can help you more than your race in getting out of something.
Now, I'm not going to go on and on about the OJ case because that is just one example. There are tons of different cases in which, merely being a household name saved the person from any jail time at all. For example, take Paris Hilton and her what 4 hour stint in jail? She didn't have to stay because she had money and was a whiney little heiress. There are a ton of other examples of celebrities who got off way too easy when it came to a crime they committed and paying for it; of all races. They have the best lawyers that money can buy because they can afford to.
That I think is the real issue is who has the access to the sort of lawyers who can get a person convicted off an attempted vehicular manslaughter charge off on just community service or sometimes even less. People with money have access to things that we mere mortals just don't and I think that is where a lot of people say race plays a role in the court system. The truth is, that because of how twisted this country is the rich get richer and the poor stay poor.
Many of these poor are statistically black people because of the unfortunate way this county has become divided up. Areas that are predominately white are that way because the taxes are increased to the point that many black families looking to move into the area simply can't afford it. Its like residential segregation and something needs to be done about that before we can ever really have a conversation about what is fair and what isn't. So many underprivileged people just can't afford the types of things that those with more money can and its unfortunate that this means an increase in crime in poorer neighborhoods because, quite frankly, its what is expected there because the opportunities are sparse.
I think that we need to almost work our way backwards to try to even attempt to correct this problem. We need to start with improving the poorer neighborhoods and providing more opportunities for those in those communities like those found in the richer neighborhoods and then the issue of crime.
Personally, I never really considered the amount of money someone had, when talking about whites and blacks, as being the reasoning behind the longer sentence for the same crime. I assumed that the reasoning behind the statistics are more because of the areas that the person was found committing this illegal act. When it came to blacks, I feel that a large majority of the people in that statistic come from a poverty prone area and the individual is in the middle of a group of people that isn’t the best to be associating with. Although Im sure that not all of the people come from that type of neighborhood or hang around with a crowd of gang members, I feel that that stat is a bit skewed toward that type of lifestyle. Therefore, the judge then would look at that person with a bit less sympathy and sentence him or her to a longer amount of time in jail because he or she is more prone to come out and continue to commit the same crime because of the pressure they receive from peers when they get out. When it came to white people being in the same situations, I feel that there aren’t as many areas around the United States that have a large population of white gang members. Therefore, in my head, Im thinking that the reasoning behind whites having a lower sentence is because they are not as prone to get out and continue on a road they were on.
However, you raise a good point. Sam states that whites are more likely to have money than black people and that may be the underlying factor in sentence time. If a white person is loaded, they will most likely have the best lawyer that money can buy. Blacks may not be able to afford that same lawyer, and therefore will suffer in the court hearing. A lawyer make the big bucks because of how well he or she works over the judge and jury. If they know how to take the perspective of the people witnessing the case from the outside, they are more likely to win them over and have them feeling sorry for the client. If the graphs shown in class are completely unbiased towards lifestyles and are factual is all regards, then the information should have a waterfall affect on the things that people do when they are looking the government in the face and the possibility of a life changing prison sentence is in the near future.
In the end, I think that both the environment someone comes from and the amount of money someone has plays a large factor in sentencing of that person. As was discussed in class, it is hard to let someone that has a history of criminal acts due to gang membership back into the community with the least amount of time spent learning from their mistakes. Also, Im sure that the lawyer that you gets plays just as big a factor as your background. Good question.
I think that if a black person or a white person commits the same crime, that both racism and money have to do with a person’s sentence. I think it is a combination of both racism and money because it definitely does depend on the luck of the draw and what judge gets assigned to a criminal’s case. However, another part of it, and I think a slightly larger part, has to do with money. I can’t help but think that a white person that comes from a well-off family and grows up in a good neighborhood will have a lesser sentence compared to a black person that commits the same crime if the black person is poorer and from a not-so-good neighborhood.
I believe that both money and race play a significant role in the law system these days. It is almost impossible to say what's fair or not nowadays because of how money and race, directly and indirectly, affect a judge's decision etc. Although I believe that racism in courts has increased much as the years have gone by, it is still at a level where it can be controlled. Unfortunately so, the only thing that it can be controlled by is money, and a lot of the times, the two don't go together.
The ability of a defendant to hire an experienced and persuasive lawyer plays a big role in how he gets sentenced or how his appeal is heard and/or taken into consideration. But good lawyers are expensive, and therefore, that makes me wonder if that is the reason why a lot more black people get sentenced for the same crime than white people. The statistics shown by Sam would certainly suggest so, because if whites have the most income, then that means that they are the ones who can afford the expensive lawyers and therefore, have a better chance of getting out of trouble. And that explains why blacks do not get away so easily, because their average income is much less than white people, they are not able to hire the same type of lawyers that white people are. So as far as money is concerned, it definitely influences the law system.
As far as racism is concerned, even after all these years, it still plays a part in how the law system works. I have many friends who believe that they have been treated unfairly just because they are not white, especially when it comes to traffic and driving. I have heard and read many stories on TV and in newspapers etc about people of race who often have to deal with racism when it comes to law, and how the police treats them differently or is a lot more harsh on them than they are on white people. Though money plays its part, I'm sure that it is not the only factor for why more black people get stricter sentences in comparison to white people who commit the same crime. It is not just because of money and it is very obvious that racism still plays a part in the law system and in the courts.
But, even though racism and money play a big part, I'm sure that the whole system is not corrupt. A lot depends on luck as well, as to what kind of a judge and jury you get etc, because sometimes, you get people who are racially biased, while if you're lucky, you might get someone who is absolutely fair and takes everything into consideration. So, money, racism, luck and many other factors add up in determining how a person gets sentenced, but we definitely cannot ignore the influence that money and racism have on everything, especially in the law system.
When it comes to the criminal justice system I believe both money and race play a big role in it. First, I don’t think race plays such a big part as money does, but the factors that come with race do. From statistics it is shown that black males have less education than whites, have a smaller income and come from difficult backgrounds. This isn’t really to be discussed, its statistics we have seen in class. These three factors education, background and income are all associated with race and hurt the black male. In the court system a lot of what occurs has to do with power.
Power equals money and many of us know that. From personal experience I can say that money can get someone anywhere when it comes to law. I was once driving with a high school friend who’s father is a doctor and well known. He stopped her for speeding as he should have because she was doing 30 over the limit. When she explained who her father was and that he would be paying the officer to avoid this fine, the police officer smiled and went back to his car as if nothing had happened. She said this happened all the time so she was happy. It made me sick that this occurred and it just wasn’t fair.
This is where the black male fails and comes short. It is easier to see why the white male may not be getting sentenced as much. He has the money and he can get the better lawyer. It is the lawyer’s responsibility, if they take the case, to defend their client because in the end they want the money. The white male will do anything so he does not have to go to jail, even if it means paying more money. This is where the black male loses. It is more likely that they will not be able to pay for a lawyer or have a good, qualified one so they end up losing. In the end the better, more qualified lawyer will back up his client and win the case in the end despite who was guilty or not.
This is why white males may not be getting sentenced as much, but we fail to see that and automatically think race. We think the judge is racist and is out to get black people everywhere. This may occur sometimes, but most of the time it doesn’t. It all goes back to how the case is presented and how the lawyer defends his client. In the end the criminal justice system, which is supposed to be fair, is not. This is not the result of racism though, but who has the most money and does the better job. It is just unfortunate that most of the time it is the white male who can afford the amazing lawyer and comes out winning in the end.
Does money have to do with the increased likelihood that a black person will be sent to jail for committing the same crime as a white person? This is a very interesting question that I had never thought about. In fact, I don’t think Sam Richards has even really considered it. In my opinion, I completely agree with the possibility that this has a positive correlation with median family income. White families have a significantly larger median income than black families do. This is proven with reliable statistics. For whatever reason, white people are wealthier than black people.
This can definitely have an affect on many different aspects when comparing the white population to the black population. If a black person is caught dealing drugs and is put on the stand with a possible jail sentence, it is more likely that he won’t have the money to properly defend himself. Without decent representation, the black defendant’s chance of winning his case is very slim. On the other hand, if the defendant were white, then he would be more likely to have the money to defend himself better.
When looking at statistics it’s important to interpret them fully and correctly. Often times, there are countless factors that heavily affect data. In this case, it is very possible that these statistics were altered due to socioeconomic differences.
I also agree with this student when she says, “it’s hard for [her] to believe that every judge out there is inherently racist.” This may be naïve and ignorant, but I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt. I believe that people are born good and judgment free, and that it’s their upbringing that causes racism and hatred. Having said that, I like to think that not every judge was raised in an all-white community with absolutely no exposure to other races and cultures. I’m sure racism is very prevalent in the justice system, however I don’t think it’s as prevalent as Sam Richards makes it out to be.
This is America in the 21st century. The majority of the population has come a long way in terms of equality. Racism is still abundant, however I believe that black people are more likely to get sent to jail because of other factors other than pure racism. Few things occur because for absolute reasons, and I believe this is one of them.
Also, I think Sam Richards does a great job teaching Race Relations. He always gets me thinking and he opens me up to countless new thoughts and ideas. However, I feel that his lectures are primarily based on opinion. Thus when it comes to certain facts that seem extreme I sometimes feel that they can have different interpretations. Racism is a terrible thing and no one should receive unfair treatment because of the color of their skin. This has been taught to generation upon generations of children and it is continually becoming installed into society. Discrimination still exists, however I believe we are on a path to equality.
Personally i think this is a great question ! HEY EMILY!!
i strongly believe that the money you have can get you out of trouble in the judicial system. I know dozens of kids from my high school that all used the same really expensive well known lawyer to get them out of DUI charges and other really offensive crimes just because they had the funds to buy that lawyer. I think that many people like blacks in inner cities that commit the same crimes as my rich white friends dont have the money to buy these lawyers that win their cases based upon who they are and their high standings with in the system. I think that although lawyers are great and necessary in some situations, the name of the lawyer or the price shouldnt allow the judge to make their final verdict. When these types of situations arise i think that the system should know better and be moral enough on their own to not take the blame off people that deserve to be sentenced for their crime. I have always thought that. Even when friends of mind had been let off for charges since they hired this particular lawyer i have always been happy for them that their record isnt tained, but thought it was so wrong of the courts to let someone who clearly broke the law get away with it. Black people may not have this opportunity to hire an expensive lawyer, so their statistics might be much higher as emily said. But besides that fact, i do think that the black community could do a better job of presenting themselves in a better manner. While many black people are highly educated, wealthy and from good homes, the public gets their bad images from the tv radio and news. Rappers only project the idea of the :" thug' into the eyes of the population because they speak about women so horribly, show their guns, tatoo's and talk about violent acts of crime. This should stop if black people dont want to be seen as the bad acting aggressive thug. Of course the public shouldnt generalize based on these images, but its hard not too. Just like other groups look at our white figures like actors and singers and judge us as snotty white people, white people see these rappers and figures and judge them as aggressive. If we could take these images out of the public, maybe the general public including the courts would see black people as less of a threat and finally put them on an even playing field. I do believe that there is some racism in courts which should come to an end. It is not fair to people of color that they are looked at differently in the courts if they are just as at fault as white people. The only t hing i can say in their defense is that there is still racism which needs to be ended, but in the defense of whites,that their public image has to be changed, and that would happen by taking the figures that get so much attention from the media, and change their image
First, I think that she makes a good point that probability of every judge in the court system being racist is highly unlikely. I do not doubt that there are some judges who cannot look past the color of the culprit's skin, however the belief that this could be the overall explanation is illogical.
When considering the justice system in America, we have to consider the demographic of the people in charge. Historically speaking, this country was founded by rich, white men who also formed all the rules and regulations for citizens to follow. Now we may have a little more variety than simply wealthy, gray-haired men, with television judges like Judge Judy and Joe Brown, however according to an article in Picturing Justice by Taunya Lovell Banks, only seven percent of federal judges are women and only three percent of the judges in America are black.
Based on the Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime and Justice Data Online, in Pennsylvania for example, eighty-eight percent of the law enforcement officers are white. Since this is also a reflection of the diversity of judges in the courts, is it possible that the system is corrupt like those supporting modern slavery in Pakistan and Thailand? I would suggest that it is possible that these statistics are a reflection of the differences in family income based on race, however how would you explain the lack of women in the courts?
Though women — without knowing anything about their individual circumstances — may be an exception to this explanation, I do think that a lack of resources proves to be a risk factor for crime and antisocial behavior in humans. For example, consider a father trying to support his wife and children without a secure job, all he wants is the best for his kids. Without the proper funding or equal opportunities, he could feel pressured to find alternative methods to acquire these resources. I do not believe this is an excuse for committing any type of crime; however, this may describe the motivation.
Following the actual committing of the crime, it seems that due to economic hardships, or conversely privileges, individuals can work the system differently. If an impoverished person commits a crime, they have to accept the consequences when they are caught. This is because they are not in a financial situation where they can afford a proper defense. On the other hand, when a financially privileged person is caught, they can pay their way out through bail or they can afford an attorney who — based on a hefty fee — will fight for their best interest. Though it may be an unfortunate reality, money is a strong motivation for many individuals. Due to this unfair advantage, the judicial system is far from just and convicts individuals disproportionately based on race. Maybe a solution could be found by keeping anonymity among the culprits?
There are so many factors that play into the statistics that were shown in class. Since blacks as well as Hispanics are already amongst the majority living in urban areas and are the ones that have an unfair starting line point, it makes sense that they are the ones who make up most the prison inmates in the country.. Blacks and Hispanic, those who are arrested and are from low income families are more likely to be racial profiled, do not have the money to afford a good lawyer, do not have the proper education to know about the rights that they have so they are influenced by police officers to just plead guilty, etc. There are just so many factors that keeps this cycle moving and are keeping minorities in jails. Like Sam said in class, one judge is going to look at the file of a white person and see there aren't that many convictions, he comes from a better background, able to afford a better lawyer and compare it to a black person who's file is going to be a lot more negative just because of the amount of money he's had growing up and pick the guy with the worst file.
In my opinion, money definitely plays a major role in America's judicial system. However, other factors such as location and especially race also have an impact on the decisions made by the Judicial system. Of course, not all judges in the United States are racist, but the way the judicial system is build and the data shows that their is definitely prejudice and favoritism in the judicial system of the United States of America.
With all the statistic and data that Sam Richards presented in class, it is obvious that discrimination still take place, even in today's world. People of color, especially African Americans are not always getting a fair judgment compared to whites in America. Blacks have always been oppressed in this country. History reveals the different obstacles that blacks in America overcame such as slavery and the civil rights movement. Whites in America have always been on top and they obviously do not want any other race to take their spot. When blacks were freed from slavery, the had nothing to support themselves to survive. In other words, they had to go back to the people who have been using them to whole time. It is a system that was use to keep black people from booming to their full potential.
That same system to keep the minorities from the ladder still exist today. The modern day way to oppress the same race that have been oppressed in the past could be through the judicial system of America. A lot of people who disagree with my reasoning but I won't be surprised if majority of those who disagree are whites. The laws on violence and drugs in urban area are more harsh compared to that of a suburban area. Who lives in urban areas? The overwhelming answers are African Americans and other minorities. They might perform the same crime or even a less violent crime in comparison to the whites in the suburbs, but they usually get to stay in jail. The law enforcement workers such as police are also usually bias towards back. For example, my brother have been pulled over numerous times by cops in suburban area where he works for doing absolutely nothing wrong. It is almost like the cops are waiting for him to do something wrong so that they can lock him up.
Even though the system is racially biased, money also plays a major role in the decision made by the judges. You made a point stating that majority of black people do not have the money to get their own lawyers. So, the majority of blacks who are charged of a crime are given state assigned lawyer, who do not usually make an attempt to get them out of trouble. Cases such as that of O.J. Simpson and Donte Stallworth shows how much money can impact a judges decision. These people have all the odds against them. They are a national athlete and they are African Americans. However, their paychecks saved them from getting locked up for murder. The American system simply cannot be corrected.
Money will always be in some way shape or form involved in everyone’s debate. It seems to be the driving force of anything and everything. We can do very little without it. Our education in college is based on money. If we don’t have it, we are not able to go on with our schooling. My uncle faced difficulties when he was assigned a public defender. It was much more difficult for him to make a case with his inexperienced lawyer. It will always be unfair when it comes to what money can buy you. They say money cannot buy you happiness and I believe this to a certain extent. Even those who have still having a good time would not be too big to have a little more money on the side. Money is all too important when it comes to legal troubles and sentencing.
In my honest opinion I think this whole world revolves around money, like the saying goes money makes the world go 'round and I believe that 100%. So yes I think a lot of it has to do with white people because they more often have more money and connections to people in high that they can afford to pay to have excellent lawyers. Whereas blacks are often seen as less fortunate to these resources and are given an attorney, or have to stay in jail because they cannot make bail. I do not think that every single judge out there is inherently racist but because of the fact that judges who treat cases coming from urban areas continuously receive cases with the defendant being a poor black person that it may be hard to treat the next case involving a young black male without the assumption that they did steal or own an illegal gun or sold drugs or whatever the case is. So I am not trying to say that they all have this assumption as soon as they get into the court house but nothing will shock them or be different from what the judge usually sees.
I do believe that the system has a lot to do with how much money a person has. I have an example of how money can buy you a lot and not literally. I went on vacation to Daytona Beach over Christmas break this year with my boyfriend and we met a guy who worked at a high end clothing store. He dressed rich, looked rich and his car explained it all. He drove a brand new BMW. He was Italian and Egyptian. His father is a manager of the Continental Airlines and is loaded. He was telling us a story about how he got 3 DUI's but by getting a good lawyer he got the charges down to speeding tickets. He said he paid 40,000 dollars every time for a lawyer. That proves that if you have the money to pay for a good lawyer or at least a decent lawyer then it really doesn't matter what race you are. I do not think the system is entirely racist as people presume. Money and location has a lot to do with who is incarcerated. If people live in a bad location where most of the popularity is black, obviously more black will be in jail and the same goes for white and brown people. I do not deny that the numbers may make it seem like the system is racist but that is a statement that can't ever be proven. All judges are entitled to make the case turn out as they feel the evidence suggests so whether part of their decision is based on slight racism or the actual crime itself is beyond me. Racism will always exist in every aspect of the world… in the work force, government systems, schools, etc. No situation is ever fair and it seems like whenever the outcomes are different between two different races its automatically "racist". I don't know if I am a little more biased because I am white but I feel like people use race as an excuse for almost everything and sometimes it just gets annoying. It is just proven that white people are the majority here in the United States so therefore people are going to assume we are racist if we make comments or decisions about black or brown people when it may in fact be on their actions and not just about what color they are. Income has a huge role in presenting cases in the judicial system because obviously if you are given a lawyer by the state because you can not afford one, it is not going to be the best lawyer out there and they will not get someone the best outcome that they possibly could. I worked for a lawyer and unless you paid him well, you were not going to get the best results. As I said before, money can buy so much and not just in terms of material things.
I believe that in American society today, race and money have everything to do with the court system. Like the person above me has stated, race may not play as much as a role as money does. Most of the time when a black person gets arrested and a white person gets arrested for the same thing, the white person can either make bail or hire a damn good lawyer to help them get out of the mess they are in. Whereas a black person is read his miranda rights which says, "if you cannot afford (a lawyer) then one will be appointed to you." So many times some lawyers do pro bono work for people. I can say from personal experience this is the case. When I was back in high school, my school had a shadow program where we could choose someone local to shadow around for the day in a profession of our choosing. I was following a local lawyer and we went to a courthouse in New Haven. In this court house the judge was hearing many cases back-to-back. And what seemed to be the case was there were more black people being charged with crimes than white people and these black people had these pro bono lawyers because they probably couldn't afford a decent lawyer.
The next issue I want to point out is also about my town. You see where I come from in Connecticut, we are considered a white, rich town. To my dismay I had to live with these people for too many years. But what I saw with them was power and money. When there perfect son or daughter would get in trouble for something, such as an underage drinking citation, what happened? Yea thats right, they got off with a slap on the wrist because money got them community service or whatever other punishment is out there.
As far as the judges go, well I believe that many judges out there are racist. Or these judges seem to fall into the stereotypical mindset that they are supposed to let the white man off while the black man sits in prison. Now I'm not saying that this is what all judges are about, but I believe the older ones still believe that they should be more kind to the fellow white man. It is a shame that black people have to suffer more just because they can't afford a decent lawyer or because of their skin color.
Ultimately I believe that it is money that plays a big role in keeping anyone out of prison. This is definitely a fact because we don't see too many A-list celebrities in prison. Let's take Paris Hilton for example. She was in jail for what? 8 days before she was whining to daddy about having to sit in some nice, luxury cell? She broke the law and she should have had to suffer for it like anybody else. I'm not saying that celebrities shouldn't get reduced sentences just because of who they are, I'm just saying if you break the law, you should do your time and learn something from it. So all-in-all I believe that money has way more of a role than race in most cases. The people who can afford the lawyer, whether white or black, are better off than those who cannot afford the best lawyer and are appointed one.
First of I would just like to say that this is a really good question, and that everyone should actually think about it. Money in our society plays a major role, at many times it classifies you, and many times you are judged on your wealth. But the question was about people who have more money getting in trouble; my response to this is that most of the people that have money and get in trouble have many ways of getting out. At times people with money tend to have connections to such a level where cases of drug charges maybe dismissed for fines and community service or etc. But at the same time these people who tend to have these connections are white. Not many colored people will have connections with people that are that high up in the management ladder, because as we all know the white man are on top of the mountain so he tends to have the people he needs to make sure he stays there. But I defiantly have to say that having money can make a difference for anybody. I personally believe that as Sam said when two people such as a white and a colored person get caught for the same act the price paid is usually never the same, the white person will get the benefit of the doubt, and get the easy sentencing. Though colored people at times are portrayed to be the hard gangsters, or thugs this is just a stereotype about them, and many colored people have to pay the price even if there act was not that bad. Don’t get me wrong but I am not in ways trying to say every judge is a racist or is prejudice against a specific nationality, but at times sentencing’s are not given fair to everyone. As we talked about money playing an issue if a person has more money they will be able to get the best lawyer possible to help them get out of the situation they are in, compared to someone who is not that wealthy they won’t have the same opportunity to have someone with the same caliber to help them in their case. And we see this case mostly with white people because again they are the wealthiest as we have seen from the stats in class. I believe colored people in general have to think twice as hard as a white person when committing an act because the punishment on a colored person can be very different and harsher then when a white person was to commit it. And all the colored people know this already, but yet they still get shown to us as the bad guys or the people that cause the most trouble, but the question is are they really the ones, or are they just getting portrayed as the troublemakers?
One thing is the luck of the draw. You cannot really compare penn state statistics because up here they do not care, they are just trying to fulfill their quota, in my opinion. You see guys get in fights on the street but my dad comes up for one weekend and gets a ticket for over 200 dollars, he did deserve it though. But how does he get picked out when there is all the college students. Anyways, more luck is showing up to court and the officer cannot make it to the hearing. I have heard plenty of people get off easy when the cop can’t make it. We talk about there not being racism but that is only in our generation. Many cops are old enough to be our parents. I am not excusing their racism but I could guarantee we would all have a different view on race if we grew up 30 years ago. I think we will wait another 30 years to see those numbers go down. When it comes to the money side, I do not think it is specifically about the money but the connections. In the end it has to do with money because people with money have connections to other people with money and/or power. This leads to the vicious circle we call life as we know it. I went to a private school, a lot of my friends parents are attorneys, or businessmen. So if my friends or even me get in some sort of trouble, I have connections that could help me or my friends in court. For someone who grew up with less money obviously do not have the same connections that I have. That will lead to more prosecutions and also less lenient sentences. I know it is not fair but it is the truth and for now, us college students are unable to do anything. Our only hope is after we graduate college and we become the people power. And these positions of power are not just for the privileged white people, but the positions are for the privileged educated people. We are all privileged to go to a school like Penn State and what we do when we reach these positions of power will decide how racism is in our country.
In today’s world, money equals power, and the more money you have the more people you are able to manipulate. When it comes to the court system, I think it is a combination of racism and money that leads discrimination among blacks in the legal system. According to the statistics presented in class, blacks have less money, which lends them less power in addition to forcing many of them to find other means of providing for their families and themselves. And because a good number of the black community falls into this category, people start to discriminate towards black people up for trial. I think it is also important to point out that many of these black people find themselves in this situation due not to their own work, but because of the lack of help from their ancestors and friends. The majority of white people who have money and power are due not to their own hard work, but the work of their kin.
Personally, I think money has a lot to do with why more black people are incarcerated than white people. In today's world, money can take you a long way whether you deserve to get there or not. Since on average, black people have a much lower income than white people, the ability to hire a lawyer is not always possible. Yes, public defendants can be given to a person who cannot afford a lawyer, but in felony cases, having a public defendant is not always as good as a lawyer. Those who are able to hire lawyers, which according to the statistics, would be more commonly a white person, can speak with their lawyer about all the option which are available to them, and often their lawyer can find loopholes to get them from going to jail or get their sentencing decreased. For those who cannot afford a lawyer, they do not necessarily get to meet up with their public defender many times before their trial to try to figure a way to get their sentencing cut or dropped completely, and often, they do not know that there are many ways to get around the system. I'm not saying that racism has nothing to do with it, because I know that racism and discrimination still exist, but I think money takes a big part in the whole judicial system as well. In many cases, there are judges who are extremely racist and who would not give a black person a break even if they had the best lawyer in the world, but this is not the case for all judges. Without the ability to hire a lawyer, a person might not have the means necessary to convince a judge that they do not deserve a harsh punishment, so they receive a harsh sentence.
I really like this question. Shes simply asking do blacks have a higher rate of incarceration because they are black and the judicial system is racist against African Americans; or is it because whites overall, have more money then blacks and are able to afford better lawyers and that its simply whites money that enables them to stay out of jail. I feel like although this question is simple the answer is anything but simple. I feel like yes, obviously having money in America aids people in not going to jail and being found guilty for crimes. For example if you took a rich black male and a white poor male put them in the exact same situation. Same crime, both are the same age, both have no prior records..Odds are most of the time I dont know lets say 60 percent of the time the rich black male will be able to get off with a lighter punishment then the poor white male. However, if we change the scenario and make both males have the exact same economic situation. We would see that probably like 70 or 80 percent of time the black person has a harsher sentence. This is what Sam was talking about when he said comparing "apples to apples" two identical situations. What this shows is that when all thing are equal blacks will undoubtedly receive unfair and bias treatment. This is quite apparent. The question then lies…Why are blacks receiving unequal treatment from the judicial system then whites are getting..The only answer to that is racism. The courts like at two people and say well….because your black your going to jail and your counter part will not go to jail simply because he is white. This is how things work in America its not fair, in fact its far from right. Its wrong and its been that way for a very long time now. Now both of the previous examples do not truly express real life black and white financial status( I mean what the average is) The first example had the black male richer, on average blacks do not have a higher income then whites. The second example had both males making the same amount of money. Again, on average whites and blacks do not make an equal of money. Whites have a higher income. A true example is the scariest because it combines the weaknesses of both examples and blacks bare them….In real life blacks make less money on average then whites and because of racism blacks are more likely to be found guilty then are whites. So….Its as if blacks are unfortunately getting the perfect storm… ( being black in America and making less then whites) to have much higher rates of incarceration then whites. Its the sad but very real truth.
The statistics from the lecture on race inequality truly blew my mind. My senior year of high school I shadowed a lawyer in my hometown. For my last two periods of the day and into the afternoon I would report to the law office and follow him as he went through his day. I would accompany him to the courthouse and watch trials that were going on. From what I learned while shadowing him, the judge had guidelines by which he would sentence people. So when I heard that when a white and a black person with the same background were charged with the same crime, that a black person would serve more jail time I was quite surprised. I’m not arguing with the statistics but after learning the guidelines I was sincerely shocked.
In Luzerne County, a county next to mine, there was a huge judge scandal were Judges Mark Ciavarella and Michael Conahan took more than $2.6 million in exchange for sentencing youths to time at private juvenile detention centers. They were eventually caught and are now on trial. In this situation two juveniles with similar cases would end up with two totally different charges. Sometimes even small charges would result in juveniles going to this detention center. Obviously this is a situation in which the court system is very corrupt, I do not think that you can say that this is the same situation as is the case with black and white cases though. I do not think that in the case of black and white it is done on purpose, at least not consciously.
Regarding the comment about black people not having as good of lawyers as white people, I think that is a very possible statement. The statistics showed that on average white people have more money than black people. Lawyers are expensive and since white people have more money on average than black people they do not have as good of lawyers to defend them. In some cases they may need public defenders who are lawyers that are paid by the state to defend people that cannot afford lawyers. Public defenders aren’t being paid directly by the defendant and sometimes they may have a heavy case load. This may cause the public defender to not pay as much attention to a certain case as he would if he were being paid directly by that person. Of course that is unethical for the lawyer to do, but he might not do it on purpose either. In some cases a lawyer may not even see his client for the first time until he is in the courtroom. Money and lawyers may be the factor as to why those statistics were as they were.
I do think that money has a lot to do with this question. People who have more money can obviously afford to hire a more expensive and trained lawyer. According to the statistics, on average, white people have more money than black people. I think that this plays a huge role in sentencing people to jail time. This advantage of having more money benefits white people and they may be able to reduce the sentencing that they may have received if they were to have a lower financial budget. At the same time, I definitely believe that racism plays a large role in the decision of sentencing, but I don’t think that that is the only factor evaluated in the courtroom. A person’s race only goes so far when a judge makes a decision, but having more money can without a doubt better a person’s chances of receiving a “better” sentencing.
I think it’s a combination of white people having more money than black people as well as judges and juries being more racist than they’ll admit in their judgment. I don’t think a judge looks at a suspect in a courtroom and instantly has that person figured out. A lot of reading goes into deciding a court case. There are so many factors that accumulate to reach a rational decision in a court hearing.
However, I think that some judges make their decisions based on what they’ve seen in the past. With experience, many judges and people who work in the judicial system can make a quick decision based on a quick impression of the suspect. A lot of black people are pinned for committing crimes, but that doesn’t mean they’re all convicted. Juries that hear the court case throughout the entire time have a series of judgments they make as the trial proceeds. Every little detail about the indicted person’s background, upbringing and their everyday demeanor and behavior tell the jury how to think about a person. Because the suspect may be black, the details about their upbringing may be less than favorable for the suspect themselves. A lot of black people live in urban areas. A lot of black people may have been brought up in a rough area where they were subject to drugs and violence. This does not, however, mean that all black people are drug dealers from the ghetto. Unfortunately, some members of the jury may feel this way. Many of the stereotypes of black people that have been suspected of committing a crime certainly affect the judgment of a judge and jury on at least the subconscious level. It’s best for everyone to take the least bias view they can of a court situation and try to judge each trial based on only relevant facts.
The fact that many black people can’t hire adequate lawyers I think is very relevant to the fact that blacks feel that they’re prosecuted and convicted more often than white people. Today, in American court systems, you can essentially buy your freedom, or a lesser penalty if you come with an excellent lawyer to trial. No good lawyers are inexpensive. Black people may have court supplied lawyers which are inexperienced kids right out of law school. A rich person can hire the best lawyer in their area for an exorbitant sum of money and essentially guarantee themselves a better outcome than had they gotten a cheap lawyer. Lawyers make or break a trial for the suspect and right now, it seems that white people can afford better lawyers than black people. Overall, I think racial stereotypes along with money affect the outcomes of trials in the American court system.
I believe you are misinterpreting the data. The statistics were about blacks receiving longer sentencing and in that case I do believe that money plays a role. Actually Sam mentioned that in his lecture. He spoke abut how blacks have less money so they could not afford to purchase lawyers. Whites, in general can afford the top of the line lawyers to get them out of the crimes. However racism does play a part sometimes, often times unconsciously. Racism is not living in the heart of every judge or law enforcement figure. However we cannot deny the fact that race does play a part and when it does it is not always intentional. People are brought up (raised) on the beliefs that blacks are criminals so they unconsciously label blacks as people who are more likely to repeat the crimes.
I think that both money and race have a role in how whites and blacks are treated differently in the court system. From the statistics alone can prove this statement. However, I feel that money and obtaining the right lawyer goes a long way. Look at the OJ Simpson trial. He had the money to pay for a big time lawyer and he was found not guilty. On the other side, if he did not have the money that he had and had to pay for a lesser quality lawyer, that outcome might have been differently. So I think money has to a bigger role than the whole race issue.
I think money has a definite impact on the incarceration of blacks over whites. People who have money, which we’ve learned are primarily white people, do have more money to spend on lawyers or even to cover up their crimes. I do not think that there are so many judges out there that are just inherently racist. While Sam has presented compelling evidence saying that racism is still alive and well in our world today, I don’t think that there are many people who work their way up the system to get in a position of power to screw colored people over simply because they’re racist. In our day and age today, if you are racist and in a position of power, you’re more likely to be exposed for your racist beliefs before you are success in your career. Racism still makes news and because of that, I don’t think that there are that many vicious people out there in positions of power working as racists because the consequences are so strong.
This is a really good question that I think needs to be factored into the statistics. I feel that money has a lot to do with what is going on in the justice system, while also race factors. The system is very corrupt and I feel that if you are a black and poor, you are even more likely to go to jail compared to a rich white person. I believe even a poor white person has a better chance of not going to jail than a poor black person. Gender also has a factor as well as many other things. I think there is way more depth to this issue than just race.
Ok to me it depends on the location and where you have been locked up at cause to me it’s not every judge and every state that screws up African American lives, I think money play a role in some cases but to me in the more segregated place in the US that is where it get screwed up and some places in this world they feel every chance they get black should be thrown away and out of the community hands. I think money come in the way of who has the money to work the system sometimes I feel as if blacks will never get that fair chance because in some system they know black doesn’t have the money for good lawyer and to put up a fight in my eye that’s just how I see it.
I think she brings up a good point. Blacks fairing more poorly than whites in the criminal justice system is well-documented and I think there are probably a few reasons for this. But I think her reason is one that probably gets overlooked, and it may in fact be the biggest reason for this apparent “racial bias” in the government. Blacks on average do not have the wealth that whites do, and thus they can’t afford some of the resources that whites do when defending themselves in the judicial system.
Whether it’s fair or not, the best lawyers and legal consultants out there charge the most for their services. But there’s a reason for that. They’re so expensive because they’ve proven to be the best and most successful at winning cases. So people are going to want to acquire these lawyers when they’re defending themselves. And who is most likely to hire them? The people that can afford it. Who are the people that can afford it? Rich people. Which people are the most rich? Whites. I think it’s as simple as that.
Consider some of the most famous legal cases. The ones that probably immediately come to mind are those involving rich – or famous – people. Now I don’t know how successful they often are, but I would imagine their success rates are probably pretty high, considering that they pay for the best team of lawyers to help them. And in these cases, whether the defendant is black or white doesn’t matter – what matters is that the person has plenty of money to defend himself with.
In fact I’d like to see some research on this. I think the data would be pretty humbling for those that talk about a racial bias in the court room. What if someone looked at all the cases in the legal system with a single black or white defendant and then only considered the ones that involved a defendant that earns over $500,000 a year? Doesn’t matter what they do to earn the money, just as long as they earn that much and are a black person or a white person. Then, let’s look at how they fare – do they get convicted…do they go to jail…how long is the sentence? Obviously the percentages here would fare these rich defendants much better than others. But even further, I think if you split the results up between the blacks and whites, the difference between the success rate of rich blacks and rich whites would be much closer than the difference between the one that looks at all blacks and all whites. There would still likely be a bit of an advantage for the whites, which I would then attribute to a racial bias from either the jury or the judge.
The general numbers get weighed down by poor blacks that cannot afford for very much legal support or advice at all. Thus they fair poorly in the system. But I think when you factor money into the equation, it helps the blacks as much as it does the whites.
I do not think that the statistic you were talking about meant that if they are black that they automatically go to prison, just that they get sentenced longer. Money may have a lot to do with it though. Depending on the crime a judge may be more likely to sentence a white person with a lot of money and a good lawyer to less time than a black person with not very much money and a below average lawyer. But I think that is just how it works. Unless you want to require that the best lawyers in the country represent the people that cannot afford them, then people have to be satisfied with the fact that the people with the best lawyers are going to get off easer. Dante Stallworth killed a guy while driving drunk a year ago and he is now playing football again with the Ravens, probably because he had a hell of a lawyer. O.J., Ray Lewis, I don't think that this topic is one sided. While it is unfortunate that people with money get off a lot easier I think that it is just that, people with money. And, maybe the poorer you are the more sentencing you get, which is even worse, but I do not think that it is a question of race.
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spf5027 Reply:
February 22nd, 2010 at 9:24 pm
Just because your black doesn’t mean you will get sentenced longer at all. The sentence goes along with the type of the crime. If you commit a crime, the evidence proved in court helps the judge come to a decision. If there is not and significant evidence, the judge can’t just sentence you because your black. That is really wrong and does not occur. The data Sam presented is on a much smaller scale probably. If you took data from across the country, it would be different. We treat everyone fairly in our criminal justice system. That’s why we have a trial by jury and the right to legal representation and counsel.
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bos5127 Reply:
February 25th, 2010 at 4:03 am
I believe you are taking things out of context. No one said just because your balck you are subject to be in jail longer. No! But something is clearly missing from this picture. Why is it that two people have the same crime but one ultimately pays the worst consequence? You've seen the statistics. You can't argue the fact that white people are the one's committing the most crime but why are the blacks the one's to be sentence? It doesn't makes any sense at all. The numbers just don't add up! I know we all try to keep this "idea" that we live in a just world, but that's absolute bullshit and we need to stop being ignorant to what's going on around us.
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spf5027 Reply:
February 25th, 2010 at 4:22 am
Sam said it in his lecture bud. Thats a fact.
ggmarie123 Reply:
February 24th, 2010 at 3:56 am
I think it is an interesting comment about the correlation between financial status and quality of a lawyer. The statistic probably does stem from this fact. If you can afford an experienced, persuasive lawyer to represent you, most likely your chances of getting off in the court system are incredibly high. When you have decent representation, you will be much more successful in getting an easier punishment. You will probably show up to court in a nice suit and say all the proper things. Your lawyer will have trained you to say what the judge and jury want to hear. People who do not have much money will not have had this type of preparation and probably will not get the same treatment. So it is interesting to think about if everyone had an equally experienced lawyer how much those statistics would change? Would the black convicts still get harsher punishments?
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In my opinion, I believe that both money and race speak volumes when influencing the Criminal Justice System. I agree that not all judges and lawyers are racists, but discrimination still takes place within our system. I also think that money speaks louder than skin tones in some cases and can affect a convicted offender’s chances of being charged for a crime. It seems that minority incarceration just kind of depends on surrounding circumstances, justice official’s values and beliefs, and financial situations.
I’ve heard many explanations as to why discrimination still takes place within the criminal justice system. I mean, with the statistics we’ve seen in class where approximately half of prison populations hold African Americans clearly shows that race does play a factor in our courts system. Some people have said that people of color just flat out commit more crimes than whites do. There is no evidence that links a person’s race to committing more crimes. On the other hand, sociodemographic reasons besides race (such as income, age, and gender) have been linked to crime. The majority of minority groups are suffering from economic disadvantages. Like Sam was saying in class the other day, whites got to the top of the hill and did not allow people of color to have the same opportunities as whites; even after the Civil War and Civil Rights Movements. Poorer people may resort to crime because they were not given the same opportunities that whites have. Income figures of racial groups do have correlation though. An offender’s support system, employment status, housing, and previous criminal offenses are all taken into consideration in the court system. Poorer people may not be able to afford an attorney or pay for bail. Due to financial reasons, Judges may be less likely to drop charges. So it may seem that race is the primary decision maker in how the Criminal Justice System functions when in fact it maybe more of an income discrepancy.
Then again, just because income does play a large factor in an offender’s opportunities to escape incarceration doesn’t mean that race is completely excluded from this argument. Some people believe that the Criminal Justice System is racist or that society is racist which leads to a racism in the courts. Evidence of racial profiling unfortunately still takes place. Some police officers arrest offenders of color even when they have no justification or reason to do so. Arrest rates of minorities are a lot higher than their offenses justify. The fact alone that more people of color are incarcerated than whites shows that our Criminal Justice System has some problems. Stereotyping about a racial group can lead to more arrest rates as well. After September 11th, homeland security has kept a vigilant eye on Muslims and those with a Middle Eastern background. Racial discrimination still takes place and continues to corrupt many officials’ rulings of justice. Although money talks, skin color can speak louder to some justice officials.
So I’ve come to the conclusion that both sides of the argument as to why minorities are incarcerated more than whites are both valid. Racial discrimination and income advantages may all be limited to the type of offense, community in which the offense took place, defendants, and surrounding circumstances. A corrupted system can never truly be fixed, but when people work together for justice’s sake, changes can be made to make the system as fair as possible.
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Sstraub25 Reply:
February 22nd, 2010 at 11:12 pm
Once again money seems to be the main topic over everything. After talking to my discussion group every week it all boils down to money, and every week we are focused to think why is it always about money? I think in a lot of cases money is the most powerful thing. When it comes to the Criminal Justice System I agree with mlp5180 that the judge takes into account money and race. I don’t think that all judges are racist because there are black/brown/colored judges and when they see a colored person before them who has commit a criminal offense they are not going to be racist towards them. But in the case where a white person is a judge and they have to make a decision based on that fact that this white person or this black person has done a criminal offence then I think the white judge will accuse the black person. A lot of times I think it depends on who the judge is.. the court system does have a lot to due with racism.
Another point to bring up is I think the court also has a problem with sexism. For example, my ex boyfriend got caught with public drunkenness as Penn State. He had his license taken away from him for 6 months and also had to pay a big fine. On the other hand one of my girl friends has gotten six (yes this is a lot) times caught with public drunkenness. In her case, she never got her license taken away and this happened at Penn State here as well. I think the court system is really messed up based on racism, sexism, and money. Because how can a male with one time get caught for public drunkenness get his license taking away compared to a girl that had that happen to her six times and never get her license taken away??
Money can bring people a long way. For example, look at celebrities like Paris Hilton. She has committed acts like DUIs and has been able to pay money to bail her out of it or at least keep her out of jail for lesser days. This is unfair to a normal colored person or even white person who has committed the same act but does not have the money or fame to bail themselves out of the situation.
I also like way mlp5180 said about race and money.. "Poorer people may not be able to afford an attorney or pay for bail. Due to financial reasons, Judges may be less likely to drop charges. So it may seem that race is the primary decision maker in how the Criminal Justice System functions when in fact it maybe more of an income discrepancy. " I agree with this totally. I feel like a lot of times people do not have the money in their pockets or even have the family to help them and bail them out. When the people are in front of the judge, the judge knows somewhat of their background and if one person standing in front of them has more money than the other they are automatically going to think that the one who is more poor is the one who did commit the crime. I think that the court system is really unfair, but also in everyday life everything always boils down to money and even race.
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Oncodoc Reply:
February 23rd, 2010 at 1:30 am
I agree that money is a huge part in the way fairness and power is distributed. To make a comparison and offer a different perspective not yet mentioned (as far as I know) I want to talk about slavery and money. As said in the previous blogs, unfair sentencing in the judicial systems seem to be less influenced by race, which by no means deserves to be dismissed, but is rather controlled by the power of money. This is true for slavery as well. A lot of misconceptions about new world slavery tend to put the blame of enslavement at the hands of racist ideologies. While that may offer some explanation for the forced labor of racial groups easily separated and distinguished from races of higher class and power, that separation lends itself to a financial gap that exists between classes in power and powerless classes. These people in control of those working in forced labor have many things in their favor that can mostly be obtained through money. As shown in the book “Disposable People” a lot of these slaves are workers forced into a life of never-ending debt. Though their race and caste may have, in the eyes of their master, brought them deservingly to their current state as slaves, a sudden possession of money by the slaves would almost certainly, in most cases, free them of their bondage as they could finally pay the full extent of their debt (whether inflated unfairly or not). Additionally (in most cases), if forced labor was to prove to be of no profit to the people abusing the system, it wouldn’t matter how racist the masters were…they wouldn’t go through with slavery anymore. I feel like the same applies in the court system. You could be a racist judge with no regards for brown or black people and honestly believe that a black murderer deserves the worst punishment while the white murder gets a second chance, but if the black man presented the judge with a million dollar check and the white man had nothing to offer, the results would be quite the opposite to those who think racism predominates in the legal systems. I could see how cops might be more prone unclip their holster while approaching a black man pulled over because of stereotypes and stigmas of today’s society. However, come prosecution time, I would find it hard to believe that if money was a key player of the criminal’s sentence it would be completely ignored due to a person’s racist tendencies. I’m not dismissing racism or saying that it has no influence in the criminal or legal systems. I just think that money is a more powerful, yet much more rare factor in every day prosecutions. Therefore I guess you could say that on average, racism does predominate.
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BruceEtt Reply:
February 23rd, 2010 at 3:59 pm
You made a really interesting point when you talked about sexism. I had never considered that an option, perhaps because I was so focused on racism in the courts. Nevertheless it is something that definitely exists in our court system. The only possible explanation I can come up with is perhaps judges view women as much more innocent, even if they aren’t. I am not sure if I agree with your point however that colored judges can’t be racist to colored people, or at least not be reversed racist. Perhaps some colored judges feel pressure when dealing with a colored person because they don’t want to give off the idea that they are going easy on them just because they are the same color. That in turn may make them even harder on someone of their same race.
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akeem10 Reply:
February 26th, 2010 at 1:31 am
Yes, its true that money plays a role in our Judicial system. They have been cases that money won such as that of Donte Stallworth and O.J. Simpson. These are two murderers who were sentenced to a couple of months in jail and community service. However, for those who are less fortunate, it is a different story.
With all the statistic and data that Sam Richards presented in class, it is obvious that discrimination still take place, even in today's world. People of color, especially African Americans are not always getting a fair judgment compared to whites in America. Blacks have always been oppressed in this country. History reveals the different obstacles that blacks in America overcame such as slavery and the civil rights movement. Whites in America have always been on top and they obviously do not want any other race to take their spot. When blacks were freed from slavery, the had nothing to support themselves to survive. In other words, they had to go back to the people who have been using them to whole time. It is a system that was use to keep black people from booming to their full potential.
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Ever since I was born, people around me installed a certain idea in my head. People always gave me the idea that black people commit the crimes. I grew up with this twisted idea that black people always steal, kill, rob, get into fights, and go to prison. Watching films, I noticed that most of the most feared criminals and people in straightjackets were people of color. I kept this sick, false impression until I first visited Taiwan. I saw crime everywhere. On the news, people killed their parents, killed their children, sliced off family members’ arms, and even cut their family members into pieces to throw into soup. These are, of course, the extreme cases that people release to the media because they produce grotesque entertainment. However, drug use, theft, and numerous cases of grand theft auto was all around me. Even my own car was stolen after parking it for 3 hours as I went to attend church.
Then I watched the movie “American History X.” This movie was not all factual, but it represented an aspect of our community that really horrified me. Racism was and is still a disgusting product of our world. It is a vicious cycle that could have been cured or helped, but people kept going at it and it is getting worse and worse every day. It showed me that white people are just as cruel and that evil and crime in this world is not determined at all by skin color but that anyone can do things such as murder and most of our country has touched some form of illegal drug.
When Sam brought the discussion of the people who are arrested and put in prison, I realized that there is blatant racism when it comes to the judicial system. People such as me have always been told that black people commit the crimes and areas with black people are dangerous. It is not so much that they are black that they commit crimes, but because the areas where crime is committed are usually poorer areas of our country. Why are most drug dealers that are arrested black? I know many of my black friends do smoke pot in Penn State, but almost all of my white and Asian friends have smoked pot to my knowing. I have smoked weed before and none of the people that I have encountered during my experiences were black. Anyone who sells drugs is a drug dealer. How come everyone has the impression that drugs are done by people of color rather than Asians and white people? This idea is bullshit.
My opinion is that black people do not commit that many more crimes than white people and if they do it is not because of their race. People who are in poor conditions and have to live in shitty areas often feel restless and an urge to better their conditions. As people think that they are more likely to be criminals than other races, they aren’t given the opportunities the rest of us are given. For example, a cop is more likely to pull over a black person than a white person. In conclusion, I would just have to say the world is bullshit and that people of color are always put down. It’s a sick, twisted, and unfair cycle. That is all.
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I kind of agree with the person in the video. I do find it hard to believe that every judge in the U.S Court system is racist. The thing that struck me in the video that we watched in class about the person being arrested for the drug deal is where the police are targeting these drug deals. They were setting up people who were easy targets. I think that since the majority of drug deals take place in poorer neighborhoods, and since many African Americans live in poorer neighborhoods than whites, that is the reason why they are arrested so prevalently for drugs. I feel like a person who deals in rich white neighborhoods is somewhat harder to catch, plus law enforcement doesn’t suspect there to be anyone dealing drugs in a rich white neighborhood.
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debateordie Reply:
February 24th, 2010 at 6:33 pm
You made a few great points in your post. The first being the video we watched showed the deal happening and the dealer being caught. Being in a poorer neighborhood makes a lot easier to get caught as well because the police kind of expect it to happen while in richer areas police aren't really looking for drug deals as much. Another point I made in an earlier blog post that dealt with offenders that would go right back to prison after being released was for the same crime which is seen a lot with dealers. Many see dealing to be quick money and why stop if there aren't any other options in poorer neighborhoods.
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This question is definitely an interesting one that, to me, has multiple answers. Let me start by saying money plays the biggest role. No matter where you are in the world if you have cash you are going to get along easier than someone who does not have money. This concept is not very hard to grasp and most people understand it. More money can buy “better” lawyers or more lawyers to help you plead your side of the case. I want to talk briefly about marijuana crimes because the marijuana laws are a passion of mine and they clearly illustrate the power of money. It used to be that the majority of smokers were either minorities or came from a lower economic class. However today’s smoking population defies economic class and race. Weed has worked its way into mainstream society with its own brand of movies, music, and comedy. It has also worked its way to the white house with President Obama admitting to past marijuana use. Our current laws with marijuana everywhere are now screwing people but the magnitude of the screwing is different from person to person. Some people come from an upper class family who has the money to pay for a lawyer and others simply do not. That dictates the punishment. Another thing that dictates the punishment is location. There is a huge difference between someone who gets caught smoking a joint in State College and someone who gets caught smoking a joint in New York City. In the State College system the judge may see someone who just was at the wrong place at the wrong time. In contrast the New York City judge may see just another kid who is a troublemaker because he sees so many similar cases, regardless of skin color. That isn’t to say that skin color doesn’t place a role because, quite frankly, it does. I have a white friend who was riding with a black driver. The driver had not been doing anything wrong but since it was a weeknight and the police had nothing better to do they pulled him over. They then searched the car and found some weed along with a few items of paraphernalia. In my opinion if you would have switched the driver and the passenger there is no way that the car would have been pulled over and both of my friends would not have been in any trouble. It is a sad reminder of the world we live in. The numbers that we were shown to us in class do not lie. There is an aspect of racism in the police department, and in the judicial system. However, if you have money it is a lot easier for a judge to give you a second chance instead of locking you up and throwing away the key.
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JulietaVenegas Reply:
February 27th, 2010 at 5:33 am
I have to agree 100 percent with you when you say "money plays the biggest role." Just look at Hollywood: how many of your favorite movie stars and pop rockers have gotten in trouble for one thing or another and got away with it when everyone knows that your typical American citizen would have been thrown behind bars for the same crime? It comes down to the fact that money can pretty much buy you out of anything (with the exception of Bernie Madoff who clearly despite the fact that he embezzled more money than any one person should be allowed to have, can't buy his way out of being convicted) why you have it/ are famous. When it comes down to things (and as shown graphically by Sam during class), minorities generally tend to have lower household incomes when compared to those of White people. Not saying that people with money don’t do drugs, but the people who do drugs and get caught tend to be in the lower-class housing developments like the projects or ghettos. And since police know that illegal activity is happening in those areas, of course they’re going to pay more attention to tip offs and are going to be patrolling the streets and sending out undercover officers more than they would be in say Beverly Hills.
Now… the question becomes why is this even allowed in the first place? Clearly it's not difficult to figure out who is accepting bribes (Hey there Your Honor- nice new BMW you have there…), but why isn't anybody doing anything about it? I think that fact is just as disturbing as the fact that more Black people are in jail than White. We all know that life isn’t fair and that the average person typically doesn’t get what they deserve, but is it too much to ask for some decency in the system that is supposedly what sets us apart from third world countries?
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So it all seems to come down to money. The difference between white and black people is money. Not. The criminal justice system is racist. There is no way around that. I always wonder why people assume that white people have more money than black people. I guess sometimes it is true, but when it comes to the criminal justice system, no one can be too sure of who has what. If a white person commits a crime equivalent to a black person’s crime, who is to say that the white person will have the money to get the “get out of jail free” card? Maybe the black person has all the money in this case, but maybe they are both deserving of the punishment they receive due to the severity of their crime. Maybe money is the most powerful aspect to beat the system, but I also do think that the opinions of the judge play a huge role in the decision making.
Another issue is the difference between genders for all parties in the situation. For example, if a male cop is on duty, he may be more likely to look out for illegal male activity rather than female activity. This demonstrates sexism and how men may favor women over their own kind. I know people who have been arrested and thrown in jail, and most of the time, the cop has been male. Where I live in New York, the cops are so unfriendly that people try their best to avoid encounters with them solely do to that.
When I was a senior in high school, my criminal justice professor took us to a maximum security prison. To say the least, I have never been more scared in my entire life. The men and women were on different floors so we got to see one of each. The women were more aggressive and crude than the men were by far. This prison was located on the Eastern tip of Long Island in a town called Riverhead. I do not know much about the area, and I know that the prison is maximum security, but the majority of the prisoners, both men and women, in there were black. I got to hear what some of the crimes these people committed and they definitely were in prison for a good reason, not just because they were black.
I don’t think the criminal justice system will ever be ‘just’ but that is something this world needs to face and deal with as long as it is going on. There will forever be arguments and screaming about who and why is guilty or innocent, but as a whole, the system is majorly flawed.
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Honestly, It might have to do with money sometimes, depending on the situation. However, for the most part money or color I do not think play a role in sentencing. I feel as if a lot more colored people commit more crime based on the percentage of them in the US. For instance there is more whites in the US, but I think when it comes to crime you seem them in areas where colored people are. Now I am not saying white people do not commit bad crimes because they do, but I feel that if you think black people are getting sentenced longer it is because the crime they did was worse.
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In a recent study i looked at it showed that black men are six times more likely to go to jail than white men are. Whether its accurate or not some asked if it was because you think they are deprived economically? They have few choices of landing good jobs due to racism? Or is it their natural racial characteristics? To me i think no, it is not natural racial characteristics. black folk are not predispostioned to crime. it is generally due to the fact that more black people are raised in poverty compared to white people. because of this poverty, they don't have the same access to a good education and school programs to educate and occupy them after school. Any person can get into trouble if they don't have the education for a good job and a lot of free time on their hands. Personally, from what I have seen, and this is my opinion only, criminality is not dependent on ethnicity. I have not seen, myself, any indication that any ethnicity, when they have the same socioeconomic standing and general upbringing, has any greater or lesser proclivity to violence and crime. On another hand it is said that 25% of blacks live in poverty. Poor people are far more likely to wind up in jail than rich people. Because more blacks are poor they are more likely to be in jail. Some say that in their opinion the issue is also far more complex then your several line thesis could even begin to explain. Whites make up a bigger percentage of the population, so naturally, they will be arrested more. Its just a numbers issue. The alarming fact is that blacks are arrested at such a high rate. So how is it that white people make a bigger percentage of the population but blacks are put in jail more and there are less of them just makes you wonder in some cases. In 2002 A new study in the US has shown that while 603,000 black US men are going to college or university, 790,000 are in prison. In the last 20 years, 5 times as many black men have been sent to prison than before that. I'm not sure of the statistics that stand now in the year 2010 but that really makes you sit back and think. Hopefully the statistics are not that crucial anymore and things are starting to change for the better but as far as the court system goes it's hard to say based on individual judges and what they decide to do and will ever in our life be a fair system. Other statics show standing of where black and white races are in jail but as far as the court system and trying to predict where the judges stand on their outlook of who should go to jail and who should not i really think it all depends on them and is hard to say.
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I think that with this question, it is a combination of both factors: Money and the color of your skin. Obviously if on average whites have more money, they are going to get a better lawyer. And as guilty as you may be, your lawyer is there to save you and make you appear innocent. If you can't afford a good lawyer, in most cases, you are screwed. Many people who can't afford a lawyer are given one. That lawyer is most likely not as recognized and as experienced.
With the question of whether or not a judge views the case and sees a black man for example, and declares he is guilty. I don't think that the decision is based solely on the color of his skin, but it definitely is a factor in the process. If he is on the verge of declaring whether he is guilty or innocent, he may lean towards guilty if the judge is a white male. White supremacy never disappeared and I don't know that it ever will. I think that there are many flaws with the judicial system and I think they lie within the subconscious minds of judges and juries. Many people may say that they believe in equality and do not consider themselves racist, but when they are in front of a trial of a black man accused of murder, they can't help but think that he is guilty. We wish it weren't this way, but it's partly out of our control. Will this faulty judicial system ever been fixed, or at the least improved?
As long as racism and white supremacy exist, the system will have major issues. There are ideas of how it can be fixed. Add more of a diverse courtroom, more black and hispanic judges. But then isn't that reverse discrimination? There is no easy solution to this issue. There is no easy solution, yet it is a huge problem. Consider two men on trial for the exact same case, murder. They both had the same criminal background and the same amount of evidence. Basically everything is the same except for one thing: The white man is extremely wealthy and can afford a very good lawyer, while the black man is assigned to a lawyer because he can't afford one. The white man wears a very nice, expensive suit, whereas the black man doesn't look very professional. How does this case turn out? Well I can't say, but for one, the white man has the advantage and is more likely to be found not guilty than the black man is. This is just the way that things are and it is awful, I hope that eventually one day the court system will be less faulty and based more on fairness and equality.
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All classes commit crime. Anyone from Paris Hilton, to a homeless person on the street, can and does commit crimes. Why is it that statistically, the poor have the highest rate of criminal charges and arrests, and the rich have the lowest rate? How do the rich find ways to avoid serving jail time? The answer is money.
I feel that unfortunately, money plays a big role in the country’s legal system—even a bigger role than race. In the United States, whether we would like to admit it or not, when a person commits a crime, it definitely helps him or her to have money.
For example, in order to get a person out of jail immediately, bail money is needed. Someone who I went to high school with recently got out of jail on a hundred thousand dollar bail. If his family was not as wealthy as they are, this person would have had to spend a longer time in jail.
Furthermore, having money is beneficial in the legal system when one has to appear in court. This is because the better, more experienced lawyers are more expensive to hire. In other words, more money gets you better representation in court.
Also, it is usually the people with more money who are more educated. People who are more educated can express themselves better. This is especially beneficial in a court room. A person with an educated background who speaks well is bound to gain more respect from a judge than a person who is uneducated and does not speak well. My father is a lawyer and has taught me a lot about the legal system. He has told me from his own experiences in courtrooms, that certain people on trial are treated differently than others, depending on background, and presentation.
In one of my other classes, I learned about luxury jails. Luxury jails sounds to me like the biggest oxymoron ever. However, I found this idea of a luxury jail very interesting and decided to do some research on them. I was so surprised to learn that these types of jails do indeed exist. They are referred to as self-pay jail systems. An article which was published in the New York Times states that for roughly $75 to $127 a day, convicts can get special accommodations and privileges! Nonetheless, even with a “pay to stay” upgrade, jail is still not a place where anyone would want to be. The article states that inmates who pay extra for nicer cells still feel like prisoners. Regardless, I feel that this concept is very discriminatory. It is just another example of how those with money have more advantages and “easier times” in life than those who are poor.
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I think money definitely plays a big part in the judicial system. The more money you have, the better lawyer you can hire, and the better your chances are of getting off or getting a lesser penalty. I do not think that race has much to do with judges' or juries' convictions. A lot of our discussions in class are about how far we have come as a society with racism. If everybody was still so racist that blacks are convicted more often and harsher just because of their skin color, then I would say we haven't come too far. The reason that more blacks are convicted for longer sentences is because inner city crimes really boost up these stats. Murders and other violent crimes are committed in inner cities every day, and most inner cities are made up of a highly African American population. Not to say that whites or other races don't commit bad crimes, but I think that is the reason why the stats show what they do.
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I do not think that all judges that sentence blacks to prison and not whites for the same crime are not inherently racist. Personally, I think the amount of resources, like money, that are available for a person plays a role in their sentencing. As discussed in class, whites have a higher income on average compared to blacks. Therefore, since whites have more resources on average, they can acquire better lawyers and more likely to pay off fines. Hence, they do not face jail sentences or as long jail sentences and can usually get away with probation and paying off fines. Now, I do agree that this is unfair that blacks and whites receive different sentences. It is definitely subjective. Our system needs to follow one protocol when sentencing individuals for crimes. It should be clearly objective and the same for each individual that commits the crime.
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I think that this is a great question. Whether or not all judges are inherently racist, I highly doubt that, but I definitely think that parts of the system are corrupt. I’m sure that part of it has to do with richer people being able to afford better lawyers, but I truly believe that there are problems with the judicial system. Major cases that are tried by a jury have a higher potential to be flawed, especially in predominantly white counties. I feel that jurors are easily persuaded by arguments from other jurors, this coming from experience when I sat in on a jury. There are some parts of a trial that certain people understand more than others, and are able to shed light on certain subjects, whether it is for the better or worse. So all it takes is for one white racist on a jury to screw up a whole trial.
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I love that you asked this question. Blacks are many times more likely to be charged with crimes than white people but I really don’t think this is because the court system is racist. It just seems unrealistic for judges to be that racist against black people. If they are, then that is terrible. I think it has a lot to do with the difference of economic situations. When people have more money they are more likely to engage in healthy activities. I think that when someone has less money, they have more time on their hands to get into mischief and trouble. With less money, people become more desperate for money which leads to robbery and selling of illegal drugs.
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I believe that the amount of money someone has does plays a more important role in the justice system than what race somebody is. People with more money tend to be able to get away with more things, because they can buy the better lawyers who are able to spread the most doubt in a jury making their client innocent. Whether someone is white or black, if they have the same amount of money they will pretty much the same chance as being proven innocent. Take the case of O.J. Simpson for instance. He is an African American man with a lot of money who was clearly able to buy his freedom with that money. Even though he was an African American with a lot of evidence against him he still was able to walk free, because of the money.
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I completely agree with her comment. The money factor also needs to be taken into account. I know at Penn State a lot of students have been faced with underage drinking. I am not sure of the percentage but I know there are very few of my friends who haven’t had this charge. The difference is, a lot of them if they received these charges have had lawyers and councils to give them they legal advice they need to work the judges and get out of it. I think money plays a big role in the fact that most of these black people are being screwed over. I find it hard to believe that every judge in the legal system is racist so my immediate response would be we also need to take into account the fact that a lot of these people who make mistakes don’t have the advantages to fix them.
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I agree with what this girl said, but then I take sides also because my dad is a member of law enforcement. They are not just going to go after you because you are black. They are going after you because you either did something wrong, or they were suspicious of you doing something that you were not supposed to be doing. I think the reason we see more prisoners who are of color is because there are many black and brown people who live in areas that are not very well developed and therefore there are drugs and crime in those areas. The other thing is that there are many white people who live in under-developed areas and many black and brown people who live in the better places of towns and cities. I think the main thing that we need to understand though is that it is not the color of our skin that gets us into trouble. It is the things we do and the situations that we get ourselves into. I believe that our parents and the people who raised us and taught us right from wrong are the ones responsible for this. When we have parents that do not care what we do and ones that let their 10 year olds out to roam the streets late at night, that is when we find trouble. Those children are the ones whose parents did not teach them right from wrong when they were younger and they are now dealing with those consequences. If we want to see crime rates go down and we want to make a difference, then we need to start with OUR children and by teaching them really what is right and what is wrong and not letting them figure it out on their own by getting themselves into trouble to realize the difference. The money aspect of it is not the issue. Children can be taught many things no matter where they live and no matter how much money their parents make. If the parents of that child want him or her to do well and succeed in life, then they have every chance of making that happen. It all starts with basic common sense. The child should be not necessarily asleep, but inside the house at a reasonable time of night and not outside messing around and destroying other people’s property with their friends. I think peer pressure has a lot to do with crimes as well because they will think they are being left out if they do not participate, when it really is in their best interest to just walk away. We need to make the change and teach our children to perform differently and not rely on others to change now because it will not happen. I know it is impossible to get everyone to do this, but that is why it is hard to make change because there are so many people that do not want to change their ways.
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I do believe that race plays a big role in the length of the sentence for a crime, but I also believe that it is correlated to the amount of money that person or family has. More African Americans are convicted of committing crimes, but are they really committing that many more crimes than whites or other nationalities? Probably not. In my opinion, I strongly believe that a judge can be bought from the beginning. Money plays an important role. If a white wealthy male and an average black male are tried for the same crime, of course the white male will have a better lawyer, and a better chance of not being convicted. If a rich black male and a poor white male were tried, I think that the court order would be flip flopped and the black male would be off free. The crime that was committed also plays into this. If a person stole a bi store, and the other person sold illegal drugs. Regardless of race, the person who did the greater crime would be punished in a harsher manner. I learned in my section; however, that in society, if a black, a Hispanic, and a white were all applying for the same job, and all three people were equally qualified, the white person has a much higher chance of getting the job. It is similar in the situation of names. A person with a foreign sounding name is less likely to get a call back that a person with an ordinary American name. In shopping malls, pharmacies, and convenience stores, I also learned that the people behind the surveillance cameras and the workers will pay more attention to the “colored” people in the stores. Why does society feel that color of skin creates a good or bad person? The moral standards people uphold themselves to have nothing to do with race in my opinion. I live in an inner city, which is quite diverse. There are black, Hispanic, and white people with the best manners I have ever seen. They treat everybody kindly and do not disrespect anybody. One the other hand, there are black, Hispanic and white people who do steal, destruct property, deal drugs, use weapons, and cause problems in the streets. I have seen a white female be arrested for drug dealing, and a Hispanic be arrested for stabbing one of my friends. This is why my outlook on crime is based more on the money aspect. Because in my neighborhood the crime rates seem pretty equal among races, I see it as the people who are sentenced for a greater time are more than likely those people who cannot afford a good lawyer as a system of defense. It is sad to say that that is what our society has come down to, but I do believe it is true.
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I most definitely think that the amount of money you have is proportionate to the amount of time you are going to spend in jail regardless of what race you are. Our judicial system is screwed up enough with regards to the statistics that Sam showed in class about blacks being sentenced longer than whites for the same crimes. There are so many examples in the media of people who either got out of jail time completely or got a really short prison sentence because they were rich and famous. For example, Donte Stallworth who was a big time NFL player was charged with DUI and second degree manslaughter last April. He spent 24 days in jail out of his 30 day sentence. In Florida where he was convicted, vehicular manslaughter while DUI, which carries a maximum sentence of 15 years in prison. Although I realize that the 15 year sentence is the maximum, I wonder what would have happened had Stallworth not been a wealthy professional athlete and just you’re regular Joe Schmo. Even though we discussed drug charges the most in class, I thought that this was an example of a time when someone seemed to get off easier because of the amount of money they had. I am positive if it were to be researched, there are many other famous athletes, actors, models, etc that have received lighter punishments because of who they are. I think that the statement made by the girl in this video poses an interesting question. Going to court in and of itself costs a decent amount of money. When you add a lawyer into the mix it is hard to afford when you are a middle class person. You are probably more likely to be treated fairly when you have a lawyer present. They are trained to know the law and the loopholes and hopefully be able to help you. However, if you come from a low income area and are white, black, brown, red, or purple, you probably can not afford a lawyer to represent you at your trial. This is unfortunate because you have a much better chance of being taken advantage of without legal representation. Overall, while the statistics state that blacks receive more jail time than whites for the same crimes, I think it would be interesting to see what the statistics were if they were broken down into affluence and then color in order to compare it to the statistics brought up in class. The judicial system in the United States is broken and corrupt and also needs to be fixed.
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I think that white people having more money is absolutely a factor in the reason why black people are more likely to end up in jail than white people. As she stated, the system is really messed up and I think the court room and the jury tends to be skewed by how good of a show a lawyer puts on. If you commit a crime and you have the funds to hire a lawyer who is well practiced and good at what he or she does, and has that superstar reputation, then you’ll definitely have more of a chance of getting off. As it goes along with the data concerning the incomes of different racial groups, the black population would probably be less likely to afford a better lawyer. Concerning all racial groups across the board, I think the better the lawyer, the more likely the person is not going to get convicted.
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This question is very interesting. As we learned in class, there are a lot more blacks in jails, then whites, and they make up a smaller percentage of the population. I often wonder if the court system is “racist” or not, because there are so many more black and minorities in trouble with the law then whites. However, I feel that the main reason why they are more likely to be in trouble is because of where they are from. I really don’t think race plays a huge role, just your background. If you grew up in a city and had a single parent, and were often living off the streets then education would most likely be the least thing on your mind, and crime may be your only alternative to clothing and food. Unfortunately, the statistics don’t agree with me. It seems to be that more and more minorities are being arrested and caught for crimes, then whites are. I do think that the police are more likely to stop a Black or Hispanic person, just because of the stereotype that they are more likely to be poor. For whatever reason, this society has often placed Black and Hispanics into the “poor” category. Police often think of that, and think they may be from a bad background, and like stated before, crime may be their only alternative. Money does play a major role in the court system, I think, because it can help you with so much. Lawyers and bail all require money; white people are more likely to have more money and also more likely to be able to get out of jail. The other side of this is that if a white person is in jail, they probably are not from a very wealthy background or good family base, so they would be more likely to turn to crime. They most likely wouldn’t have the money to pay for a lawyer or bail, and that doesn’t have to do with being white, but because of their background. Unfortunately, many more whites than other minorities seem to have more money, which means a better family base, and a better background. That means that there is a less chance of being involved with crime. I don’t know any cops, but I do think it would be interesting to ask them on average, how many more black people do they arrest then whites and for what reason. I also thought it was interesting to see that women are the least likely to be in jail. I know that brings up the issue of gender, but why is it that people are so shocked to hear a woman commit a crime, then a black male. In today’s society is almost expected that a black male will end up in crime. This assumption is so present in our society, and is seen in the statistics of jail inmates. My thought is that because black males know they are expected to commit a crime, then they don’t overcome the stereotype but continue it. I just don’t think that race should play any role in how your life plays out, especially by playing a role in if you stay in jail or not. However, because white people have more money on average then minorities, they have the power to get out of the trouble they are in with the law. Also, fewer whites are in the jail system, most likely, because they are from better backgrounds and are less likely to commit a crime.
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In my opinion, I think economic situation has much more to do with jail sentences than the color of someone’s skin. It is true that there are still many people in our world that are racist. Whether or not people want to believe that is one thing but it is evident in many ways especially in the south. I witnessed first hand a white guy calling a black kid “boy” when I was driving down through Georgia. I was actually shocked but now that I think about it I don’t think I should have been. There is definitely still racism and thinking that every single person in a country of 300 million would be changed only 140 years or so after the “abolishment” of slavery is just naive (of course I know that not everyone was here then and there are minorities to account for). That being said, I do think that money has more to do with it than anything else.
When you hear that a person killed someone and was found guilty, what do you usually think? Personally I think “well did he get life in prison or the death sentence if he was in Texas.” This was not the case with the former NBA basketball player, Jason Williams. He was found guilty but only of manslaughter when it was commonly known he murdered someone in cold blood. His jail sentence: 7 years. The reason I am talking about this is because it is almost time for him to be released from prison back into the world. Also of note is the fact he is a black man and had wealth from playing in the professional leagues. Because this is so important is to show that a black person who is known for committing murder (other than OJ) but who has the wealth to hire very good attorneys can get out of something that a person of normal financial status would not have. Being a white kid, if I committed this murder, because I cannot hire Johnny Cochran I would be sitting behind bars now, in ten years, thirty, and probably for the rest of my life.
I personally think that there is more opportunity to commit a crime when you live in an urban area and you are willing to do anything to make some money. Most people who live in urban areas are black; therefore, more opportunity to commit a crime and a larger police presence to look for that crime being committed. It’s true maybe that white people commit the same amount of crimes but in areas where it is perhaps not looked for or where they have the money to hire the right lawyer. Blacks who commit a crime in an urban area have a higher chance of getting caught and a lower chance of affording the same caliber lawyer. The result: more black people behind bars.
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I think that this is a really interesting question to discuss. I think that it is not so much of a race thing as it is a money issue. I mean don't get me wrong I think that there are plenty of cases in which race plays into the discrimination of an individual, however I think that the larger issue in society at the moment is the fact that money can help you more than your race in getting out of something.
Now, I'm not going to go on and on about the OJ case because that is just one example. There are tons of different cases in which, merely being a household name saved the person from any jail time at all. For example, take Paris Hilton and her what 4 hour stint in jail? She didn't have to stay because she had money and was a whiney little heiress. There are a ton of other examples of celebrities who got off way too easy when it came to a crime they committed and paying for it; of all races. They have the best lawyers that money can buy because they can afford to.
That I think is the real issue is who has the access to the sort of lawyers who can get a person convicted off an attempted vehicular manslaughter charge off on just community service or sometimes even less. People with money have access to things that we mere mortals just don't and I think that is where a lot of people say race plays a role in the court system. The truth is, that because of how twisted this country is the rich get richer and the poor stay poor.
Many of these poor are statistically black people because of the unfortunate way this county has become divided up. Areas that are predominately white are that way because the taxes are increased to the point that many black families looking to move into the area simply can't afford it. Its like residential segregation and something needs to be done about that before we can ever really have a conversation about what is fair and what isn't. So many underprivileged people just can't afford the types of things that those with more money can and its unfortunate that this means an increase in crime in poorer neighborhoods because, quite frankly, its what is expected there because the opportunities are sparse.
I think that we need to almost work our way backwards to try to even attempt to correct this problem. We need to start with improving the poorer neighborhoods and providing more opportunities for those in those communities like those found in the richer neighborhoods and then the issue of crime.
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Personally, I never really considered the amount of money someone had, when talking about whites and blacks, as being the reasoning behind the longer sentence for the same crime. I assumed that the reasoning behind the statistics are more because of the areas that the person was found committing this illegal act. When it came to blacks, I feel that a large majority of the people in that statistic come from a poverty prone area and the individual is in the middle of a group of people that isn’t the best to be associating with. Although Im sure that not all of the people come from that type of neighborhood or hang around with a crowd of gang members, I feel that that stat is a bit skewed toward that type of lifestyle. Therefore, the judge then would look at that person with a bit less sympathy and sentence him or her to a longer amount of time in jail because he or she is more prone to come out and continue to commit the same crime because of the pressure they receive from peers when they get out. When it came to white people being in the same situations, I feel that there aren’t as many areas around the United States that have a large population of white gang members. Therefore, in my head, Im thinking that the reasoning behind whites having a lower sentence is because they are not as prone to get out and continue on a road they were on.
However, you raise a good point. Sam states that whites are more likely to have money than black people and that may be the underlying factor in sentence time. If a white person is loaded, they will most likely have the best lawyer that money can buy. Blacks may not be able to afford that same lawyer, and therefore will suffer in the court hearing. A lawyer make the big bucks because of how well he or she works over the judge and jury. If they know how to take the perspective of the people witnessing the case from the outside, they are more likely to win them over and have them feeling sorry for the client. If the graphs shown in class are completely unbiased towards lifestyles and are factual is all regards, then the information should have a waterfall affect on the things that people do when they are looking the government in the face and the possibility of a life changing prison sentence is in the near future.
In the end, I think that both the environment someone comes from and the amount of money someone has plays a large factor in sentencing of that person. As was discussed in class, it is hard to let someone that has a history of criminal acts due to gang membership back into the community with the least amount of time spent learning from their mistakes. Also, Im sure that the lawyer that you gets plays just as big a factor as your background. Good question.
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I think that if a black person or a white person commits the same crime, that both racism and money have to do with a person’s sentence. I think it is a combination of both racism and money because it definitely does depend on the luck of the draw and what judge gets assigned to a criminal’s case. However, another part of it, and I think a slightly larger part, has to do with money. I can’t help but think that a white person that comes from a well-off family and grows up in a good neighborhood will have a lesser sentence compared to a black person that commits the same crime if the black person is poorer and from a not-so-good neighborhood.
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I believe that both money and race play a significant role in the law system these days. It is almost impossible to say what's fair or not nowadays because of how money and race, directly and indirectly, affect a judge's decision etc. Although I believe that racism in courts has increased much as the years have gone by, it is still at a level where it can be controlled. Unfortunately so, the only thing that it can be controlled by is money, and a lot of the times, the two don't go together.
The ability of a defendant to hire an experienced and persuasive lawyer plays a big role in how he gets sentenced or how his appeal is heard and/or taken into consideration. But good lawyers are expensive, and therefore, that makes me wonder if that is the reason why a lot more black people get sentenced for the same crime than white people. The statistics shown by Sam would certainly suggest so, because if whites have the most income, then that means that they are the ones who can afford the expensive lawyers and therefore, have a better chance of getting out of trouble. And that explains why blacks do not get away so easily, because their average income is much less than white people, they are not able to hire the same type of lawyers that white people are. So as far as money is concerned, it definitely influences the law system.
As far as racism is concerned, even after all these years, it still plays a part in how the law system works. I have many friends who believe that they have been treated unfairly just because they are not white, especially when it comes to traffic and driving. I have heard and read many stories on TV and in newspapers etc about people of race who often have to deal with racism when it comes to law, and how the police treats them differently or is a lot more harsh on them than they are on white people. Though money plays its part, I'm sure that it is not the only factor for why more black people get stricter sentences in comparison to white people who commit the same crime. It is not just because of money and it is very obvious that racism still plays a part in the law system and in the courts.
But, even though racism and money play a big part, I'm sure that the whole system is not corrupt. A lot depends on luck as well, as to what kind of a judge and jury you get etc, because sometimes, you get people who are racially biased, while if you're lucky, you might get someone who is absolutely fair and takes everything into consideration. So, money, racism, luck and many other factors add up in determining how a person gets sentenced, but we definitely cannot ignore the influence that money and racism have on everything, especially in the law system.
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When it comes to the criminal justice system I believe both money and race play a big role in it. First, I don’t think race plays such a big part as money does, but the factors that come with race do. From statistics it is shown that black males have less education than whites, have a smaller income and come from difficult backgrounds. This isn’t really to be discussed, its statistics we have seen in class. These three factors education, background and income are all associated with race and hurt the black male. In the court system a lot of what occurs has to do with power.
Power equals money and many of us know that. From personal experience I can say that money can get someone anywhere when it comes to law. I was once driving with a high school friend who’s father is a doctor and well known. He stopped her for speeding as he should have because she was doing 30 over the limit. When she explained who her father was and that he would be paying the officer to avoid this fine, the police officer smiled and went back to his car as if nothing had happened. She said this happened all the time so she was happy. It made me sick that this occurred and it just wasn’t fair.
This is where the black male fails and comes short. It is easier to see why the white male may not be getting sentenced as much. He has the money and he can get the better lawyer. It is the lawyer’s responsibility, if they take the case, to defend their client because in the end they want the money. The white male will do anything so he does not have to go to jail, even if it means paying more money. This is where the black male loses. It is more likely that they will not be able to pay for a lawyer or have a good, qualified one so they end up losing. In the end the better, more qualified lawyer will back up his client and win the case in the end despite who was guilty or not.
This is why white males may not be getting sentenced as much, but we fail to see that and automatically think race. We think the judge is racist and is out to get black people everywhere. This may occur sometimes, but most of the time it doesn’t. It all goes back to how the case is presented and how the lawyer defends his client. In the end the criminal justice system, which is supposed to be fair, is not. This is not the result of racism though, but who has the most money and does the better job. It is just unfortunate that most of the time it is the white male who can afford the amazing lawyer and comes out winning in the end.
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Does money have to do with the increased likelihood that a black person will be sent to jail for committing the same crime as a white person? This is a very interesting question that I had never thought about. In fact, I don’t think Sam Richards has even really considered it. In my opinion, I completely agree with the possibility that this has a positive correlation with median family income. White families have a significantly larger median income than black families do. This is proven with reliable statistics. For whatever reason, white people are wealthier than black people.
This can definitely have an affect on many different aspects when comparing the white population to the black population. If a black person is caught dealing drugs and is put on the stand with a possible jail sentence, it is more likely that he won’t have the money to properly defend himself. Without decent representation, the black defendant’s chance of winning his case is very slim. On the other hand, if the defendant were white, then he would be more likely to have the money to defend himself better.
When looking at statistics it’s important to interpret them fully and correctly. Often times, there are countless factors that heavily affect data. In this case, it is very possible that these statistics were altered due to socioeconomic differences.
I also agree with this student when she says, “it’s hard for [her] to believe that every judge out there is inherently racist.” This may be naïve and ignorant, but I choose to give people the benefit of the doubt. I believe that people are born good and judgment free, and that it’s their upbringing that causes racism and hatred. Having said that, I like to think that not every judge was raised in an all-white community with absolutely no exposure to other races and cultures. I’m sure racism is very prevalent in the justice system, however I don’t think it’s as prevalent as Sam Richards makes it out to be.
This is America in the 21st century. The majority of the population has come a long way in terms of equality. Racism is still abundant, however I believe that black people are more likely to get sent to jail because of other factors other than pure racism. Few things occur because for absolute reasons, and I believe this is one of them.
Also, I think Sam Richards does a great job teaching Race Relations. He always gets me thinking and he opens me up to countless new thoughts and ideas. However, I feel that his lectures are primarily based on opinion. Thus when it comes to certain facts that seem extreme I sometimes feel that they can have different interpretations. Racism is a terrible thing and no one should receive unfair treatment because of the color of their skin. This has been taught to generation upon generations of children and it is continually becoming installed into society. Discrimination still exists, however I believe we are on a path to equality.
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Personally i think this is a great question ! HEY EMILY!!
i strongly believe that the money you have can get you out of trouble in the judicial system. I know dozens of kids from my high school that all used the same really expensive well known lawyer to get them out of DUI charges and other really offensive crimes just because they had the funds to buy that lawyer. I think that many people like blacks in inner cities that commit the same crimes as my rich white friends dont have the money to buy these lawyers that win their cases based upon who they are and their high standings with in the system. I think that although lawyers are great and necessary in some situations, the name of the lawyer or the price shouldnt allow the judge to make their final verdict. When these types of situations arise i think that the system should know better and be moral enough on their own to not take the blame off people that deserve to be sentenced for their crime. I have always thought that. Even when friends of mind had been let off for charges since they hired this particular lawyer i have always been happy for them that their record isnt tained, but thought it was so wrong of the courts to let someone who clearly broke the law get away with it. Black people may not have this opportunity to hire an expensive lawyer, so their statistics might be much higher as emily said. But besides that fact, i do think that the black community could do a better job of presenting themselves in a better manner. While many black people are highly educated, wealthy and from good homes, the public gets their bad images from the tv radio and news. Rappers only project the idea of the :" thug' into the eyes of the population because they speak about women so horribly, show their guns, tatoo's and talk about violent acts of crime. This should stop if black people dont want to be seen as the bad acting aggressive thug. Of course the public shouldnt generalize based on these images, but its hard not too. Just like other groups look at our white figures like actors and singers and judge us as snotty white people, white people see these rappers and figures and judge them as aggressive. If we could take these images out of the public, maybe the general public including the courts would see black people as less of a threat and finally put them on an even playing field. I do believe that there is some racism in courts which should come to an end. It is not fair to people of color that they are looked at differently in the courts if they are just as at fault as white people. The only t hing i can say in their defense is that there is still racism which needs to be ended, but in the defense of whites,that their public image has to be changed, and that would happen by taking the figures that get so much attention from the media, and change their image
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First, I think that she makes a good point that probability of every judge in the court system being racist is highly unlikely. I do not doubt that there are some judges who cannot look past the color of the culprit's skin, however the belief that this could be the overall explanation is illogical.
When considering the justice system in America, we have to consider the demographic of the people in charge. Historically speaking, this country was founded by rich, white men who also formed all the rules and regulations for citizens to follow. Now we may have a little more variety than simply wealthy, gray-haired men, with television judges like Judge Judy and Joe Brown, however according to an article in Picturing Justice by Taunya Lovell Banks, only seven percent of federal judges are women and only three percent of the judges in America are black.
Based on the Bureau of Justice Statistics Crime and Justice Data Online, in Pennsylvania for example, eighty-eight percent of the law enforcement officers are white. Since this is also a reflection of the diversity of judges in the courts, is it possible that the system is corrupt like those supporting modern slavery in Pakistan and Thailand? I would suggest that it is possible that these statistics are a reflection of the differences in family income based on race, however how would you explain the lack of women in the courts?
Though women — without knowing anything about their individual circumstances — may be an exception to this explanation, I do think that a lack of resources proves to be a risk factor for crime and antisocial behavior in humans. For example, consider a father trying to support his wife and children without a secure job, all he wants is the best for his kids. Without the proper funding or equal opportunities, he could feel pressured to find alternative methods to acquire these resources. I do not believe this is an excuse for committing any type of crime; however, this may describe the motivation.
Following the actual committing of the crime, it seems that due to economic hardships, or conversely privileges, individuals can work the system differently. If an impoverished person commits a crime, they have to accept the consequences when they are caught. This is because they are not in a financial situation where they can afford a proper defense. On the other hand, when a financially privileged person is caught, they can pay their way out through bail or they can afford an attorney who — based on a hefty fee — will fight for their best interest. Though it may be an unfortunate reality, money is a strong motivation for many individuals. Due to this unfair advantage, the judicial system is far from just and convicts individuals disproportionately based on race. Maybe a solution could be found by keeping anonymity among the culprits?
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There are so many factors that play into the statistics that were shown in class. Since blacks as well as Hispanics are already amongst the majority living in urban areas and are the ones that have an unfair starting line point, it makes sense that they are the ones who make up most the prison inmates in the country.. Blacks and Hispanic, those who are arrested and are from low income families are more likely to be racial profiled, do not have the money to afford a good lawyer, do not have the proper education to know about the rights that they have so they are influenced by police officers to just plead guilty, etc. There are just so many factors that keeps this cycle moving and are keeping minorities in jails. Like Sam said in class, one judge is going to look at the file of a white person and see there aren't that many convictions, he comes from a better background, able to afford a better lawyer and compare it to a black person who's file is going to be a lot more negative just because of the amount of money he's had growing up and pick the guy with the worst file.
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In my opinion, money definitely plays a major role in America's judicial system. However, other factors such as location and especially race also have an impact on the decisions made by the Judicial system. Of course, not all judges in the United States are racist, but the way the judicial system is build and the data shows that their is definitely prejudice and favoritism in the judicial system of the United States of America.
With all the statistic and data that Sam Richards presented in class, it is obvious that discrimination still take place, even in today's world. People of color, especially African Americans are not always getting a fair judgment compared to whites in America. Blacks have always been oppressed in this country. History reveals the different obstacles that blacks in America overcame such as slavery and the civil rights movement. Whites in America have always been on top and they obviously do not want any other race to take their spot. When blacks were freed from slavery, the had nothing to support themselves to survive. In other words, they had to go back to the people who have been using them to whole time. It is a system that was use to keep black people from booming to their full potential.
That same system to keep the minorities from the ladder still exist today. The modern day way to oppress the same race that have been oppressed in the past could be through the judicial system of America. A lot of people who disagree with my reasoning but I won't be surprised if majority of those who disagree are whites. The laws on violence and drugs in urban area are more harsh compared to that of a suburban area. Who lives in urban areas? The overwhelming answers are African Americans and other minorities. They might perform the same crime or even a less violent crime in comparison to the whites in the suburbs, but they usually get to stay in jail. The law enforcement workers such as police are also usually bias towards back. For example, my brother have been pulled over numerous times by cops in suburban area where he works for doing absolutely nothing wrong. It is almost like the cops are waiting for him to do something wrong so that they can lock him up.
Even though the system is racially biased, money also plays a major role in the decision made by the judges. You made a point stating that majority of black people do not have the money to get their own lawyers. So, the majority of blacks who are charged of a crime are given state assigned lawyer, who do not usually make an attempt to get them out of trouble. Cases such as that of O.J. Simpson and Donte Stallworth shows how much money can impact a judges decision. These people have all the odds against them. They are a national athlete and they are African Americans. However, their paychecks saved them from getting locked up for murder. The American system simply cannot be corrected.
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Money will always be in some way shape or form involved in everyone’s debate. It seems to be the driving force of anything and everything. We can do very little without it. Our education in college is based on money. If we don’t have it, we are not able to go on with our schooling. My uncle faced difficulties when he was assigned a public defender. It was much more difficult for him to make a case with his inexperienced lawyer. It will always be unfair when it comes to what money can buy you. They say money cannot buy you happiness and I believe this to a certain extent. Even those who have still having a good time would not be too big to have a little more money on the side. Money is all too important when it comes to legal troubles and sentencing.
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In my honest opinion I think this whole world revolves around money, like the saying goes money makes the world go 'round and I believe that 100%. So yes I think a lot of it has to do with white people because they more often have more money and connections to people in high that they can afford to pay to have excellent lawyers. Whereas blacks are often seen as less fortunate to these resources and are given an attorney, or have to stay in jail because they cannot make bail. I do not think that every single judge out there is inherently racist but because of the fact that judges who treat cases coming from urban areas continuously receive cases with the defendant being a poor black person that it may be hard to treat the next case involving a young black male without the assumption that they did steal or own an illegal gun or sold drugs or whatever the case is. So I am not trying to say that they all have this assumption as soon as they get into the court house but nothing will shock them or be different from what the judge usually sees.
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I do believe that the system has a lot to do with how much money a person has. I have an example of how money can buy you a lot and not literally. I went on vacation to Daytona Beach over Christmas break this year with my boyfriend and we met a guy who worked at a high end clothing store. He dressed rich, looked rich and his car explained it all. He drove a brand new BMW. He was Italian and Egyptian. His father is a manager of the Continental Airlines and is loaded. He was telling us a story about how he got 3 DUI's but by getting a good lawyer he got the charges down to speeding tickets. He said he paid 40,000 dollars every time for a lawyer. That proves that if you have the money to pay for a good lawyer or at least a decent lawyer then it really doesn't matter what race you are. I do not think the system is entirely racist as people presume. Money and location has a lot to do with who is incarcerated. If people live in a bad location where most of the popularity is black, obviously more black will be in jail and the same goes for white and brown people. I do not deny that the numbers may make it seem like the system is racist but that is a statement that can't ever be proven. All judges are entitled to make the case turn out as they feel the evidence suggests so whether part of their decision is based on slight racism or the actual crime itself is beyond me. Racism will always exist in every aspect of the world… in the work force, government systems, schools, etc. No situation is ever fair and it seems like whenever the outcomes are different between two different races its automatically "racist". I don't know if I am a little more biased because I am white but I feel like people use race as an excuse for almost everything and sometimes it just gets annoying. It is just proven that white people are the majority here in the United States so therefore people are going to assume we are racist if we make comments or decisions about black or brown people when it may in fact be on their actions and not just about what color they are. Income has a huge role in presenting cases in the judicial system because obviously if you are given a lawyer by the state because you can not afford one, it is not going to be the best lawyer out there and they will not get someone the best outcome that they possibly could. I worked for a lawyer and unless you paid him well, you were not going to get the best results. As I said before, money can buy so much and not just in terms of material things.
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I believe that in American society today, race and money have everything to do with the court system. Like the person above me has stated, race may not play as much as a role as money does. Most of the time when a black person gets arrested and a white person gets arrested for the same thing, the white person can either make bail or hire a damn good lawyer to help them get out of the mess they are in. Whereas a black person is read his miranda rights which says, "if you cannot afford (a lawyer) then one will be appointed to you." So many times some lawyers do pro bono work for people. I can say from personal experience this is the case. When I was back in high school, my school had a shadow program where we could choose someone local to shadow around for the day in a profession of our choosing. I was following a local lawyer and we went to a courthouse in New Haven. In this court house the judge was hearing many cases back-to-back. And what seemed to be the case was there were more black people being charged with crimes than white people and these black people had these pro bono lawyers because they probably couldn't afford a decent lawyer.
The next issue I want to point out is also about my town. You see where I come from in Connecticut, we are considered a white, rich town. To my dismay I had to live with these people for too many years. But what I saw with them was power and money. When there perfect son or daughter would get in trouble for something, such as an underage drinking citation, what happened? Yea thats right, they got off with a slap on the wrist because money got them community service or whatever other punishment is out there.
As far as the judges go, well I believe that many judges out there are racist. Or these judges seem to fall into the stereotypical mindset that they are supposed to let the white man off while the black man sits in prison. Now I'm not saying that this is what all judges are about, but I believe the older ones still believe that they should be more kind to the fellow white man. It is a shame that black people have to suffer more just because they can't afford a decent lawyer or because of their skin color.
Ultimately I believe that it is money that plays a big role in keeping anyone out of prison. This is definitely a fact because we don't see too many A-list celebrities in prison. Let's take Paris Hilton for example. She was in jail for what? 8 days before she was whining to daddy about having to sit in some nice, luxury cell? She broke the law and she should have had to suffer for it like anybody else. I'm not saying that celebrities shouldn't get reduced sentences just because of who they are, I'm just saying if you break the law, you should do your time and learn something from it. So all-in-all I believe that money has way more of a role than race in most cases. The people who can afford the lawyer, whether white or black, are better off than those who cannot afford the best lawyer and are appointed one.
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First of I would just like to say that this is a really good question, and that everyone should actually think about it. Money in our society plays a major role, at many times it classifies you, and many times you are judged on your wealth. But the question was about people who have more money getting in trouble; my response to this is that most of the people that have money and get in trouble have many ways of getting out. At times people with money tend to have connections to such a level where cases of drug charges maybe dismissed for fines and community service or etc. But at the same time these people who tend to have these connections are white. Not many colored people will have connections with people that are that high up in the management ladder, because as we all know the white man are on top of the mountain so he tends to have the people he needs to make sure he stays there. But I defiantly have to say that having money can make a difference for anybody. I personally believe that as Sam said when two people such as a white and a colored person get caught for the same act the price paid is usually never the same, the white person will get the benefit of the doubt, and get the easy sentencing. Though colored people at times are portrayed to be the hard gangsters, or thugs this is just a stereotype about them, and many colored people have to pay the price even if there act was not that bad. Don’t get me wrong but I am not in ways trying to say every judge is a racist or is prejudice against a specific nationality, but at times sentencing’s are not given fair to everyone. As we talked about money playing an issue if a person has more money they will be able to get the best lawyer possible to help them get out of the situation they are in, compared to someone who is not that wealthy they won’t have the same opportunity to have someone with the same caliber to help them in their case. And we see this case mostly with white people because again they are the wealthiest as we have seen from the stats in class. I believe colored people in general have to think twice as hard as a white person when committing an act because the punishment on a colored person can be very different and harsher then when a white person was to commit it. And all the colored people know this already, but yet they still get shown to us as the bad guys or the people that cause the most trouble, but the question is are they really the ones, or are they just getting portrayed as the troublemakers?
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One thing is the luck of the draw. You cannot really compare penn state statistics because up here they do not care, they are just trying to fulfill their quota, in my opinion. You see guys get in fights on the street but my dad comes up for one weekend and gets a ticket for over 200 dollars, he did deserve it though. But how does he get picked out when there is all the college students. Anyways, more luck is showing up to court and the officer cannot make it to the hearing. I have heard plenty of people get off easy when the cop can’t make it. We talk about there not being racism but that is only in our generation. Many cops are old enough to be our parents. I am not excusing their racism but I could guarantee we would all have a different view on race if we grew up 30 years ago. I think we will wait another 30 years to see those numbers go down. When it comes to the money side, I do not think it is specifically about the money but the connections. In the end it has to do with money because people with money have connections to other people with money and/or power. This leads to the vicious circle we call life as we know it. I went to a private school, a lot of my friends parents are attorneys, or businessmen. So if my friends or even me get in some sort of trouble, I have connections that could help me or my friends in court. For someone who grew up with less money obviously do not have the same connections that I have. That will lead to more prosecutions and also less lenient sentences. I know it is not fair but it is the truth and for now, us college students are unable to do anything. Our only hope is after we graduate college and we become the people power. And these positions of power are not just for the privileged white people, but the positions are for the privileged educated people. We are all privileged to go to a school like Penn State and what we do when we reach these positions of power will decide how racism is in our country.
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In today’s world, money equals power, and the more money you have the more people you are able to manipulate. When it comes to the court system, I think it is a combination of racism and money that leads discrimination among blacks in the legal system. According to the statistics presented in class, blacks have less money, which lends them less power in addition to forcing many of them to find other means of providing for their families and themselves. And because a good number of the black community falls into this category, people start to discriminate towards black people up for trial. I think it is also important to point out that many of these black people find themselves in this situation due not to their own work, but because of the lack of help from their ancestors and friends. The majority of white people who have money and power are due not to their own hard work, but the work of their kin.
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Personally, I think money has a lot to do with why more black people are incarcerated than white people. In today's world, money can take you a long way whether you deserve to get there or not. Since on average, black people have a much lower income than white people, the ability to hire a lawyer is not always possible. Yes, public defendants can be given to a person who cannot afford a lawyer, but in felony cases, having a public defendant is not always as good as a lawyer. Those who are able to hire lawyers, which according to the statistics, would be more commonly a white person, can speak with their lawyer about all the option which are available to them, and often their lawyer can find loopholes to get them from going to jail or get their sentencing decreased. For those who cannot afford a lawyer, they do not necessarily get to meet up with their public defender many times before their trial to try to figure a way to get their sentencing cut or dropped completely, and often, they do not know that there are many ways to get around the system. I'm not saying that racism has nothing to do with it, because I know that racism and discrimination still exist, but I think money takes a big part in the whole judicial system as well. In many cases, there are judges who are extremely racist and who would not give a black person a break even if they had the best lawyer in the world, but this is not the case for all judges. Without the ability to hire a lawyer, a person might not have the means necessary to convince a judge that they do not deserve a harsh punishment, so they receive a harsh sentence.
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I really like this question. Shes simply asking do blacks have a higher rate of incarceration because they are black and the judicial system is racist against African Americans; or is it because whites overall, have more money then blacks and are able to afford better lawyers and that its simply whites money that enables them to stay out of jail. I feel like although this question is simple the answer is anything but simple. I feel like yes, obviously having money in America aids people in not going to jail and being found guilty for crimes. For example if you took a rich black male and a white poor male put them in the exact same situation. Same crime, both are the same age, both have no prior records..Odds are most of the time I dont know lets say 60 percent of the time the rich black male will be able to get off with a lighter punishment then the poor white male. However, if we change the scenario and make both males have the exact same economic situation. We would see that probably like 70 or 80 percent of time the black person has a harsher sentence. This is what Sam was talking about when he said comparing "apples to apples" two identical situations. What this shows is that when all thing are equal blacks will undoubtedly receive unfair and bias treatment. This is quite apparent. The question then lies…Why are blacks receiving unequal treatment from the judicial system then whites are getting..The only answer to that is racism. The courts like at two people and say well….because your black your going to jail and your counter part will not go to jail simply because he is white. This is how things work in America its not fair, in fact its far from right. Its wrong and its been that way for a very long time now. Now both of the previous examples do not truly express real life black and white financial status( I mean what the average is) The first example had the black male richer, on average blacks do not have a higher income then whites. The second example had both males making the same amount of money. Again, on average whites and blacks do not make an equal of money. Whites have a higher income. A true example is the scariest because it combines the weaknesses of both examples and blacks bare them….In real life blacks make less money on average then whites and because of racism blacks are more likely to be found guilty then are whites. So….Its as if blacks are unfortunately getting the perfect storm… ( being black in America and making less then whites) to have much higher rates of incarceration then whites. Its the sad but very real truth.
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The statistics from the lecture on race inequality truly blew my mind. My senior year of high school I shadowed a lawyer in my hometown. For my last two periods of the day and into the afternoon I would report to the law office and follow him as he went through his day. I would accompany him to the courthouse and watch trials that were going on. From what I learned while shadowing him, the judge had guidelines by which he would sentence people. So when I heard that when a white and a black person with the same background were charged with the same crime, that a black person would serve more jail time I was quite surprised. I’m not arguing with the statistics but after learning the guidelines I was sincerely shocked.
In Luzerne County, a county next to mine, there was a huge judge scandal were Judges Mark Ciavarella and Michael Conahan took more than $2.6 million in exchange for sentencing youths to time at private juvenile detention centers. They were eventually caught and are now on trial. In this situation two juveniles with similar cases would end up with two totally different charges. Sometimes even small charges would result in juveniles going to this detention center. Obviously this is a situation in which the court system is very corrupt, I do not think that you can say that this is the same situation as is the case with black and white cases though. I do not think that in the case of black and white it is done on purpose, at least not consciously.
Regarding the comment about black people not having as good of lawyers as white people, I think that is a very possible statement. The statistics showed that on average white people have more money than black people. Lawyers are expensive and since white people have more money on average than black people they do not have as good of lawyers to defend them. In some cases they may need public defenders who are lawyers that are paid by the state to defend people that cannot afford lawyers. Public defenders aren’t being paid directly by the defendant and sometimes they may have a heavy case load. This may cause the public defender to not pay as much attention to a certain case as he would if he were being paid directly by that person. Of course that is unethical for the lawyer to do, but he might not do it on purpose either. In some cases a lawyer may not even see his client for the first time until he is in the courtroom. Money and lawyers may be the factor as to why those statistics were as they were.
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I do think that money has a lot to do with this question. People who have more money can obviously afford to hire a more expensive and trained lawyer. According to the statistics, on average, white people have more money than black people. I think that this plays a huge role in sentencing people to jail time. This advantage of having more money benefits white people and they may be able to reduce the sentencing that they may have received if they were to have a lower financial budget. At the same time, I definitely believe that racism plays a large role in the decision of sentencing, but I don’t think that that is the only factor evaluated in the courtroom. A person’s race only goes so far when a judge makes a decision, but having more money can without a doubt better a person’s chances of receiving a “better” sentencing.
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I think it’s a combination of white people having more money than black people as well as judges and juries being more racist than they’ll admit in their judgment. I don’t think a judge looks at a suspect in a courtroom and instantly has that person figured out. A lot of reading goes into deciding a court case. There are so many factors that accumulate to reach a rational decision in a court hearing.
However, I think that some judges make their decisions based on what they’ve seen in the past. With experience, many judges and people who work in the judicial system can make a quick decision based on a quick impression of the suspect. A lot of black people are pinned for committing crimes, but that doesn’t mean they’re all convicted. Juries that hear the court case throughout the entire time have a series of judgments they make as the trial proceeds. Every little detail about the indicted person’s background, upbringing and their everyday demeanor and behavior tell the jury how to think about a person. Because the suspect may be black, the details about their upbringing may be less than favorable for the suspect themselves. A lot of black people live in urban areas. A lot of black people may have been brought up in a rough area where they were subject to drugs and violence. This does not, however, mean that all black people are drug dealers from the ghetto. Unfortunately, some members of the jury may feel this way. Many of the stereotypes of black people that have been suspected of committing a crime certainly affect the judgment of a judge and jury on at least the subconscious level. It’s best for everyone to take the least bias view they can of a court situation and try to judge each trial based on only relevant facts.
The fact that many black people can’t hire adequate lawyers I think is very relevant to the fact that blacks feel that they’re prosecuted and convicted more often than white people. Today, in American court systems, you can essentially buy your freedom, or a lesser penalty if you come with an excellent lawyer to trial. No good lawyers are inexpensive. Black people may have court supplied lawyers which are inexperienced kids right out of law school. A rich person can hire the best lawyer in their area for an exorbitant sum of money and essentially guarantee themselves a better outcome than had they gotten a cheap lawyer. Lawyers make or break a trial for the suspect and right now, it seems that white people can afford better lawyers than black people. Overall, I think racial stereotypes along with money affect the outcomes of trials in the American court system.
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I believe you are misinterpreting the data. The statistics were about blacks receiving longer sentencing and in that case I do believe that money plays a role. Actually Sam mentioned that in his lecture. He spoke abut how blacks have less money so they could not afford to purchase lawyers. Whites, in general can afford the top of the line lawyers to get them out of the crimes. However racism does play a part sometimes, often times unconsciously. Racism is not living in the heart of every judge or law enforcement figure. However we cannot deny the fact that race does play a part and when it does it is not always intentional. People are brought up (raised) on the beliefs that blacks are criminals so they unconsciously label blacks as people who are more likely to repeat the crimes.
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I think that both money and race have a role in how whites and blacks are treated differently in the court system. From the statistics alone can prove this statement. However, I feel that money and obtaining the right lawyer goes a long way. Look at the OJ Simpson trial. He had the money to pay for a big time lawyer and he was found not guilty. On the other side, if he did not have the money that he had and had to pay for a lesser quality lawyer, that outcome might have been differently. So I think money has to a bigger role than the whole race issue.
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I think money has a definite impact on the incarceration of blacks over whites. People who have money, which we’ve learned are primarily white people, do have more money to spend on lawyers or even to cover up their crimes. I do not think that there are so many judges out there that are just inherently racist. While Sam has presented compelling evidence saying that racism is still alive and well in our world today, I don’t think that there are many people who work their way up the system to get in a position of power to screw colored people over simply because they’re racist. In our day and age today, if you are racist and in a position of power, you’re more likely to be exposed for your racist beliefs before you are success in your career. Racism still makes news and because of that, I don’t think that there are that many vicious people out there in positions of power working as racists because the consequences are so strong.
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This is a really good question that I think needs to be factored into the statistics. I feel that money has a lot to do with what is going on in the justice system, while also race factors. The system is very corrupt and I feel that if you are a black and poor, you are even more likely to go to jail compared to a rich white person. I believe even a poor white person has a better chance of not going to jail than a poor black person. Gender also has a factor as well as many other things. I think there is way more depth to this issue than just race.
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Ok to me it depends on the location and where you have been locked up at cause to me it’s not every judge and every state that screws up African American lives, I think money play a role in some cases but to me in the more segregated place in the US that is where it get screwed up and some places in this world they feel every chance they get black should be thrown away and out of the community hands. I think money come in the way of who has the money to work the system sometimes I feel as if blacks will never get that fair chance because in some system they know black doesn’t have the money for good lawyer and to put up a fight in my eye that’s just how I see it.
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I think she brings up a good point. Blacks fairing more poorly than whites in the criminal justice system is well-documented and I think there are probably a few reasons for this. But I think her reason is one that probably gets overlooked, and it may in fact be the biggest reason for this apparent “racial bias” in the government. Blacks on average do not have the wealth that whites do, and thus they can’t afford some of the resources that whites do when defending themselves in the judicial system.
Whether it’s fair or not, the best lawyers and legal consultants out there charge the most for their services. But there’s a reason for that. They’re so expensive because they’ve proven to be the best and most successful at winning cases. So people are going to want to acquire these lawyers when they’re defending themselves. And who is most likely to hire them? The people that can afford it. Who are the people that can afford it? Rich people. Which people are the most rich? Whites. I think it’s as simple as that.
Consider some of the most famous legal cases. The ones that probably immediately come to mind are those involving rich – or famous – people. Now I don’t know how successful they often are, but I would imagine their success rates are probably pretty high, considering that they pay for the best team of lawyers to help them. And in these cases, whether the defendant is black or white doesn’t matter – what matters is that the person has plenty of money to defend himself with.
In fact I’d like to see some research on this. I think the data would be pretty humbling for those that talk about a racial bias in the court room. What if someone looked at all the cases in the legal system with a single black or white defendant and then only considered the ones that involved a defendant that earns over $500,000 a year? Doesn’t matter what they do to earn the money, just as long as they earn that much and are a black person or a white person. Then, let’s look at how they fare – do they get convicted…do they go to jail…how long is the sentence? Obviously the percentages here would fare these rich defendants much better than others. But even further, I think if you split the results up between the blacks and whites, the difference between the success rate of rich blacks and rich whites would be much closer than the difference between the one that looks at all blacks and all whites. There would still likely be a bit of an advantage for the whites, which I would then attribute to a racial bias from either the jury or the judge.
The general numbers get weighed down by poor blacks that cannot afford for very much legal support or advice at all. Thus they fair poorly in the system. But I think when you factor money into the equation, it helps the blacks as much as it does the whites.
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