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1975312 Responseshttp://www.racerelationsproject.org/2010/03/does-this-rudeness-thing-cut-both-ways/Does+this+rudeness+thing+cut+both+ways%3F2010-03-17+02%3A41%3A16Sam+Richards to Does this rudeness thing cut both ways?
I think it is double standard when black people get so offended people text "rude" remarks about them during class. How do you know it's a white person, it could be a black person just kidding around too. I don't see why it's okay for black people to make fun of white people and not vise versa.
People should just get over these “racial” slurs and stuff, I don’t think they need to be said nor should people feel offended by them. I understand that throughout history people of color have been oppressed and still are today but we should just try to move on. If black people make it okay for them to make fun of white people and not okay for white people to make fun of black people that is simply not giving white people equal treatment.
I really don’t know what can be said to offend a white person, at least about race, but they should not do it to people of color. I’m Hispanic and I’ve been called a Spic before, by black and Hispanic people but I have never really taken offense to it because I don’t even know what it’s supposed to mean. However I recently was told the meaning of it and it kind of did upset me but I still will not fight back if such occurs again.
I think that if you let others see that their words “hurt” you then you are letting them control you and so people should just not take offense to these words. However if these people are legit KKK members or Nazis or whatever then attention should be given to the situation.
I also noticed that lately there has developed “racism” or prejudice against Latinos. I think this is because everyone is scared of the economic situation in the country so they find people to blame it on. The same way the Germans blamed the Jews and set out to destroy them. It’s mostly the government’s fault for racism I think. They put out all these stupid “movements” to save our country and crap but they are not helping, instead they are dividing its people
You didn’t hear of beatings or murders due to racist reasons before, even when there was a heavy flow of Hispanic immigrants to the country but since the “war on illegal immigration” started it has escalated
So I think that the reason people are racist against each other is not because they are racist, but because they are scared and they want to find some way to solve their problems and get back to where they were. But either way white people should not make fun of black people intentionally and vice versa.
I totally agree with you man. but i feel that if we want to take that texting system seriously we both are going to be held accountable for being rude. I don't like what is being said, and i can't stand it when i have to sit there and read absolute garbage. I get frustrated, people don't have any respect for the class, and clearly do not have any respect for Sam. people need to learn that just because it is anonymous doesn't mean gung ho on whatever they feel like it. People need to grow up and seriously consider it this way "would you say it to your parents?" what if your parents saw you saying those things. they would back hand you so hard! Maybe not the white people…but i know my parents would.
I agree with the student in this video that the somewhat pointed comments about the colored people caused significant uproar but similar comments made about white people received less attention from the class. I think this all goes back to two key things: social norms and political correctness. For starters, it has become a social norm in our society for white people to act in a manner whereby they do all they can to avoid stating racist or derogatory comments towards people of color, even if such incidents may occur inadvertently. As Sam previously mentioned, when white people go to the race table, they are unlikely to lead or begin the discussion because they like to get a feel for the views and beliefs of the colored people at the table. This is done because the worst thing that you can call a white person is a racist and that whites will avoid offending colored people at all costs, including how they approach or talk to people of color. In terms of political correctness, our 21st century modern society revolves around sensitivity to people of different races, ethnicities, and cultures and that is why it is so crucial to be aware of your behaviors and speech when talking about such issues. These issues are going to come up because we live in the most diverse country in the world, and the best way to approach them is to just be more open and listen to the needs and beliefs of others willingly without displaying ignorance.
Personally I think that the rude things were because these people are trying to be funny, and they think they are funny. What they do is get some sort of pleasure out of stirring the pot, and if they can do that without getting caught, even better for them and they will keep doing it I guess. Usually the rude messages coming from black people were in retaliation after what the white people said, and maybe some people think that because it’s just “getting even” then it’s okay? Who knows though, we will have to find out by letting black people send their messages first next time.
After watching this flip video I realized I had many opinions on the subject and that this was a good topic for me to respond to. I feel I have encountered many situations like this in my teenage year as my high school was very diverse. It seemed as though white was the minority. It was almost flipped from the norm that whites are the majority in hall ways and classrooms. It always seemed that when a white person acted out in a bad way such as getting into a fight or causing a scene with a teacher it was a bigger deal than when a colored person would do the same. This seemed to be prevelant through out the schools at events such as basketball and hockey games. It also seemed as if they had much better relationships with the people of authority such as security guards and police. If i wanted I could continue on the differences I noticed but I dont feel that is important. The point I am trying to make is that the class has taught me alot already. I believe now that their was no difference in reactions to the actions of both whites blacks and browns but it was only how we percieved it. We had been taught our whole life about racism and segregation and all of this and this only made us more aware of the racial differences. We've been taught how in the past races were treated and looked at differently and sometimes we become guilty of doing so ourself. If this class has taught me one thing its that everything is just peoples individual opinions and views.
Since coming to school here I have noticed the difference in peoples views and opinions on different races. Because there is not nearly as much diversity here at Penn State as there was in my high school, people and much different views. People seem to be almost uneducated on the subject of race and try to hide behind it through political correctness like talked about in class. But again what I have learned in this class is that their is no fault that there is a difference in how people view race because everyone is raised differently and we cannot determine right or wrong. Here at Penn State I dont seem to notice much difference in reactions to the actions of different races. This video and instance is actually one of the first times I have noticed it. This may be because people just have different views but I feel it simply is because of the lack of diversity here. Like stated in class Penn State is 84% percent white and sometimes we dont even realize it. I just want to show that there is much to learn in class no matter where we come from and how we were raised.
You hit it on the head its like what Sam said earlier its ok to make fun of other races except for blacks truth is I really don’t know is it because society expects blacks to act in a negative way so its ok? A large reason to why the conversation always goes back to white and blacks is because we are asking white and blacks to comment about racism. If you put some middle eastern people, Hispanics, and Asians in a room and asked them to talk about racism I guarantee they will not end up talking about white vs black. They'll end up talking about racism they've encountered from their point of view. America is about 75 percent white, whites (lets be honest) don't really like blacks… So if you ask the average white person about racism their gonna talk about their personal experiences and their feelings towards blacks.Racism in America is not mild compared to Europe. Its just very discreet. In our society people care what others think about them so even if someone is racist and wants to say racist things they usually dont because they care about what other people think.Blacks and whites always have tension because.. I believe the average white person doesn't like black people. In other words whites don't want blacks around. Most blacks are able to sense this dislikement towards them and then they in return get angry or call whites racist. Even though most of the time white people aren't racist its just a systematic exclusion of blacks they all want. Also besides Native Americans, whites and blacks built America. There is so much negative history between the two racists. This history is founded by struggle, pain, suffering, inequality, and injustice. I feel like a lot of the time the reason we say its always about whites and blacks is also because we, as individuals, have personal stories or negative anecdotes about a time in our life, or a friends or a family member or someone we know that had a bad experience with the other race
I think that it does go both ways, because people of color still have that feeling that we don’t look at them the same and I think that is a reason why when people posted their comments they thought that white people were being rude. I still feel that we may have that white guilt but black people even though what they went through, I feel like you can also have controversial issues about it. I have seen black people be conceited where you have them to be known to great at like basketball and running and I definitely think they get the same way as white people. Don’t get me wrong now I have seen a lot of rude white people too or if they think they are really good at something. It works both ways I think that even when we try to say that we think black people are conceited you feel that guilt, but at the same time they could say that a white person is conceited and nobody would give it a second thought that they should feel guilty for saying it. I feel that white people may feel like we can’t be ourselves, and that guilt will always be there.
I mean this just goes back to the whole concept that white people are more heavily-criticized for being racist than minorities. This stems from the fact that since whites are the majority in this country, if someone says something negative about them, no one really causes a scene or draws attention to it as much as when a white person offends a black or brown person. A perfect example of this is last year a few days after the election when Obama won, I saw a brown guy in West commons wearing a shirt that stated "This year, I voted black." I was literally appalled by the shirt. If a white person walked around with a shirt that said "This year, I voted white," I can only begin to imagine the commotion it would cause. But I guess that nobody was as concerned upon seeing the shirt as I was, or perhaps they, too, were just too appalled by it to say anything.
We all never truly mean to offend each other and I think that we just need to look at it differently and think of it as all of us are equal and that we shouldn’t feel the need to feel guilt because. Black people may think of white people as rude because we may be the ones that black people feel that we look down on them because of their past. Maybe or maybe because we are white, but I don’t think that it is that big of a deal. Race is just a color and I don’t think they should feel that way.
Let me start off by saying that yes, the rudeness does go both ways. In reference to the text messages, the things that made people react about the white comments were the fact that they were racist. Most of the black comments were stereotypical, which I may say could have been avoided as well. Take for example the comment “nigs ain’t shit” posted under the white responses. Never did I see a person of color call a white person a cracker or anything offensive over the text responses. But let this not become a black vs. white thing. As a whole I feel it is a way the people respond. As a black man I will not take to be offended in such a way and when I read the comment I immediately reacted. Maybe whites did not react the same way when they were offended but that is not my fault nor is it the fault of any person of color. Whites just as well as blacks have the right to comment or react and if white people allow themselves to be silence then shame on them. We are coming together in this race relations project, although it may be hard we have to get past the guilt and come to a common answer.
That thought had never even crossed my mind. It was clearly noticeable that when white people said rude things many times it was ignorant or "offensive" when people of color said things they usually were talking about neighborhoods or other jokes that some would not find "offensive" however, the real point is. We CANT know who wrote what. sure the question was intended for one group but whos to say that someone else didnt just answer themselves? How do you know that the comments you were reading actually came from the groups you believe them to be from? The truth is, we really cant.
I was going through this same question in my group discussion the other day. I found it very interesting that when white people texted something that was offensive or racist there was a lot of buzz and tension around the room, but when black people retaliated with the same kind of texts there really wasn’t any acknowledgement throughout the class. I really have not done any research in this topic but I have my own opinion on why this happens.
Because white people are the majority in our nation and here at Penn State white people almost feel as though since we have most of life’s advantages in our favor that we should never question the minority. I think this also factors into white people taking the back seat in a ‘racist issues’ discussion. From what I have seen I think white people believe that since minorities have many disadvantages in life that somehow letting them rip on us without responding back in any kind of way is a means of making up for those difficulties. Along those lines it seems as though that we are venturing into white guilt in social situations a great deal. On the other hand I think minorities, especially black people, feel the same way at the opposite end of the spectrum, they feel as if they deserve to poke fun at the minorities (even in a racist way) and they don’t feel any guilt about it what so ever. Although this is a very weird and awkward way of looking at these things I think it makes sense. But even though I think it makes sense I feel as though it pushes us farther away from ever getting over racism as a society. How can we overcome racism if it is still normal and accepted in these kinds of circumstances? I don’t think we can. If we ever want to begin to start confronting racism as a whole, matter like these needs to be put in the rearview mirror for us to move on.
Now to go off topic and rant a bit on how I understand racism and the stupidity of it. My father is Colombian and my mom is American, I was born in the United States but I still practice Latino culture with my family and feel I am very in touch with the part of my background. While I have more white friends than black and brown friends I have experienced both social screens and have come to a conclusion about racism. We are the same people! Each group talks about how different we are from each other but I really don’t see it. There are slight differences between the two but it is definitely not enough to warrant racism and the division between us. I think both sides need to realize how racism is only as big as how we make it and get over it.
I was thinking the same thing as this guy, and I also discussed it with a friend of mine in the class and he noticed it as well. Last week a white person used the N-word in a text on the board and a black girl in the class spoke out that she was offended. However, when the black people in class had their chance to text, someone used the N-word again, but this time nothing was said. This is so annoying to me, and I don’t get it. If you’re offended by that word, then it shouldn’t matter who says it. It’s not fair to have a double standard. I feel like at times black people have been outspoken when a white person says the word to accuse that person of racism. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that it’s okay to say the N-word. I have never used that word and never will, but it’s not fair when black people call each other the N-word but then freak out on white people for saying it. They shouldn’t pick and choose who’s allowed to say it. If you’re offended by it, then speak out against anyone who says it, not just white people. Why use the word, anyway? I don’t get why some black people call each other that word. It’s as if when they say it to each other, its meaning is “buddy,” or “bro.” The fact of the matter is that the N-word is a derogatory term in itself.
As far as other offensive comments, I feel like some people (black or white) think that making fun of white people is funny. I’m not offended by this, but at the same time I don’t agree with it. When Sam showed us the website of the things white people love, some of the things listed didn’t even make sense to me. I think white people are often targeted for silly amusement. The song we heard in class, “White & Nerdy,” is also a good example of this. White people often make fun of themselves and other white people as well, so black people probably think it is okay to make fun of them too. This is like the N-word situation reversed, but in this case no one speaks out that they are offended because white people (at least those in class) don’t have a double standard of who can say what when making fun of white people.
Overall, I think white people are a lot more laidback than black people when it comes to instances when people of one race talk about or make fun of another. I think that if more black and white people were friends with each other it wouldn’t be this way because there would be more of an understanding of what is or isn’t offensive.
The gentleman in this video actually proposed a very good question. I can't give a definite answer for this question, but as a black person, I feel I can give a sufficient answer. (And just want to note that I was offended by nothing that was posted on the screen). It caused an uproar because there is a history of white people oppressing black people and not the other way around. Not justifying the fact that black people can say rude things because it is definitely wrong, but the world is what it is. It is what Sam was talking about in class. The worst thing that you can call a white person is a racist because white people never had an oppressive era in the history of the world. Not that minorities are angry of this fact, but minorities are sensitive to the words and actions of white people because white people have a history, so to speak, of putting down other racist. One may say it is in the nature of caucasian people. So for that fact minorities stay alert for the next act of racism, which is no way to live. Also, it is difficult to describe what true racism is and what could possibly be a joke but to ensure that all racism is caught society jumps at everything that looks like a hate crime. Along, with the ideas that I just stated I will also state that white people are not easily offended (as a whole). There isn't to much that you can say to a white person regarding their race that will hurt their feelings because they are on top of the food chain so to speak. So in a sense the emotions of minorities are much more fragile than that of a white person. So to answer the question at hand it is more offensive for a white person to say a racist comment than a black person to say a racist comment because white people have a history of being "racist". I mean in all seriousness true equality in America just began in the 1960's. And even still equality isn't "true". But to answer the other portion of the gentleman's question it is in no way, shape, or form for "black racism" to go unpunished if "white racism" is punished. If we as a society want to promote equality it has to come from both ends of the spectrum. We as a people need to stop being so sensitive and let things be. Minorities if someone calls you a offensive name turn the other cheek, and white people if someone calls you a racist let it be. We will never get to a world where everyone is equal if we keep supporting arguements that keep us apart.
I noticed this exact same thing: Sam stopped class and was defensive when someone of color received an offensive remark on the texting board, but failed to do so when whites received an offensive comment (I believe we were referred to as “sorority sluts”). And coincidentally, this occurred during the same lecture in which Sam tried to say that nothing is offensive.
However, I think the exercise was fruitful in what Sam wanted to demonstrate. He has been trying to show that white people have never had to think about what it is like to be colored in our society. He has used the example of how many people do not think about what it is like to be handicapped; similarly, whites are rarely challenged to think about what it is like to be colored. On the other hand, race is a large part of identity and experience for those of color.
The responses to the question “What does it mean to be white?” demonstrated this idea. Those who were white responded with very simplistic, general responses (as others have pointed out). Many people sent in responses along the lines of “skin color means nothing,” “white is just a color,” “lack of melanoma,” etc. However, students of color responded with more directed and poignant responses, illustrating more thought and reflection on issues of race (if not any more maturity – as the texting program allows us all to give immature responses).
But I think that the fact that Sam will defend colored students, but not white students, goes back to a central issue we’ve been grappling with throughout this semester. Historically, our races have not been equal, and we are still not equal. We are not to a place within race relations where our comments are taken equally. There is still too much emotion, hurt, and fear wrapped up in our language and behavior.
I have struggled with some of Sam’s apparently contradictory comments and lessons in class thus far. For example, he says we all are equal at the race table and we all need to be a part of the solution. Additionally, we had that lecture on the bystander- effect and standing up for others. However, Sam also seems to argue that nothing is offensive and that we should stop over-analyzing our words and comments when it comes to race.
The truth is, we still take more offense to comments and actions against people of color. And I’m not saying that we should not be offended at such things. But if we are all equal at the race table, then we should also all be equal with our political correctness and comments.
Yes rudeness goes both ways. What difference does it make if you are white black, brown, or whatever you want to identify yourself as. Its not only whites who can be rude to others we are all rude to each other and thats that. Its sad because society promotes it and thats how we are used to learning about other races through jokes so we our selves feel thats the best way to do so. We think we are being funny when we are actually showcasing stupidity and utter ignorance.
When people write offensive things on the screen I don't take offense to it because I think they are punks. Like Same said if you cant say iit to whatever race face then don't put it up there for a laugh because its pointless. The only person that going to pat you on the back is your self and your stupid friend who encouraged you to write what you wrote. I thought we were in a place where people had some form of education to know when to utilize common sense and not act like simple-minded animals.
I picked up on this too. The big “racist” comment that put everyone in an uproar was when someone said being white meant “dealing with loud black chicks in the computer lab.” Such a statement can be offensive, and since a white person said it, it is taken as racist. Even Sam Richards was taken back by the comment and requested people refrain from making such racist comments. However, when the tables were turned and the black students in the room were given a chance to answer the question, many of them made comments such as being white meant “being stuck up” or “throw out the uggs.” Such comments were taken with humor and as far as I recall, Sam did not say anything in defense of the white team and say that was racist. There is clearly a double standard in the works here. What makes “dealing with loud black chicks in the computer lab” any different than “being stuck up.” Are they both not offensive? To say that being white means to be stuck up is a negative comment that generalizes the white team. Not every single white person is stuck up. Not every single white girl wears uggs. These comments are stereotypical, yet they were taken as less offensive than the stereotypical comment on black women. To say that black chicks are loud in the computer lab is just to make an observation that holds some truth to it. I have been in plenty of computer labs here on campus that had black women being obnoxiously loud when they shouldn’t be. I’m not saying that every black woman is guilty of this act, but there is some truth to the statement mentioned in class. There is also truth in the statement that white women should throw out the uggs. A lot of white girls on campus own uggs, but not every one of them do. So all the comments mentioned in class seem to hold some truth to them, and they were just statements. So why did the comment towards black people hold more weight to it than the comments towards white people? It seems that this is usually the case. I think our white guilt is the root of all of this. We see any comment directed towards the black race that may be offensive as a large step backwards in the road to equality. Yet, the white people don’t say much when black people direct offensive comments towards them. This is actually another step backwards in the road to equality because now a double standard exists where white people have to be careful about what they say to black people, yet the standards on comments made by black people are a little less regulated.
Rudeness does go both ways between people of color and white people. I have two experiences that I want to share that I have had in college. What was made very clear to me was that the dialogue between white people and people of color is not as open in the North and straightforward as it is in the South. Early in the semester I went to Texas for a LGBT leadership retreat. I was shocked when I went to visit the people of color suite in the hotel for breakfast and saw a sign on the door that said people of color only. There were blacks, Asians, Latinos, and Native American’s in the suite that shared that space and if a white person tried to enter the room everyone converged on that person in a hostile way. I understand that they where trying to show white people how it feels to not be wanted in a space based on skin color, but they did not explain their objectives to the white people who wanted to join their friends inside the suite. I understood that it was a social experiment, but it was the malicious way that they went about it, it was purely not for educational purpose. I felt like I was in a weird twilight zone, were minorities were now reverting to the blatantly racist attitudes that the whites displayed in the during the Civil Rights movement when they were forced to desegregate. Some white people did understand the point that the sign “colored people only” was trying to make and others used it as fuel against people of color as another reason why they didn’t like them.
I was uncomfortable being in that environment, because I did not agree with how the people in the suite handled the situation. We had an opportunity to open up and create a change by being able to have an open dialogue discussion. It was interesting to see how the king of the mountain example came into play once the shoe was on the other foot. When the minorities had the power to control a space they did not use it to repair race relations, but discriminate against whites. I was really disappointed in how everything went down and it took a couple of people to keep me from going off the deep end and telling off every single person in that room. Minorities always speak about equality and how it’s a right for everyone, but I feel that white people aren’t always included in that picture of equality because of what happened in the past. I guess that’s why whites are hesitant to share some of the power, because of guilt and also because they have not have to answer for generational discrimination.
Going back to the question asked by the man in video. If there was a suite for white people and they did not allow people of color in I can guarantee you that it would have been a massive uproar. Letting people have a safe space to talk is step on in the road to repairing race relations and we need more courses like soc 119 and straight talks that allows to have open dialogue and talk about these types of issues. I agree with Sam that you have to allow people to have an open discussion. In my straight talk class I took my sophomore year we had a lot of open discussion and we talked about our fears about discussing race. I remember this White guy in my class who was really concerned about offending people of color in discussion groups. He looked for acceptance before he spoke and constantly kept apologizing and being safe with his word choices. I appreciated that he voiced his concerns and that he eventually opened up and gave his true opinions and concerns. I remember Sam saying along the lines that white people are taught from early on to have a filter and take a passive role in race relations conversations.
I recommend that all students take a race relations course or a straight talks class because not only do you understand your own identity you learn about other peoples identities and to not only celebrate diversity but our similarities as well. There is always going to be “rudeness”, because you cannot make everyone happy all the time. It is in people’s nature to seek out the differences. If it’s not your skin color than it’s your gender, religion, age, class, or your sexual orientation that will be used to discriminate and keep some system of hegemony. Everyone should be held accountable for what they say no matter what their skin color is, ignorance is ignorance.
This is a very interesting question. I did notice this also happening in class. When you are whit eI think that ow are put up to a double standard which I don't think is appropriate at all but unfornatley. I dpnt think this is acceptable at all though. When people were making those comment I think that black people feel entitled to say what they want because they feel that we are held back in todays standards of society. Yes even though statistically speaking this may be true this does not make them any better and they should not be entitled to say what ever they want without getting backlash as well. I feel like so many people think this way not even if they are black but if they are gay, muslim, or any other group that is discriminated in todays life. Yes this is rough and the relaity of things but spreading that hate does not make it any better. People go thorugh rough times everyday but if they thought about the event that happened to them fighting back or doing action like saying negative things about white people will not hep the situation and will most likely end up making is worst. I feel that it is a much stronger stance to not say anything negative at all, acklnoledge who todays world is, and be s truing person breaking down those barriers as the person you are, not with the race you represent. In term of the white people saying negative things they should be ashamed. How do they think its funny white or black to say such things. Hello people it is 2010. We should not drop jokes like these especially in a classroom setting. ITs just rude and makes people feel very uncomfortable wether hey are white or black . Double standards exist everywhere in this world and will always exist in this world. They will orbably never be broken down but if people start to respect eachother one person at a time then eventually one day. I will say that they white people were not more wrong than the people of colro. Its just pure ignorance on both sides. Maybe one day we will learn that being an asshole has nothing to do with race but who you are as a person and people will not be put up to these double standards anymore.
I think that the rudeness does cut both ways. If you think about it, when Same posts a question to all the white people in the room there are always some racist comments in there. And when he posts a comment to all the black people in the room, there are a lot racists comments. I think that this is because the majority of the class is white! The white people in the room clearly outnumber the black people so obviously there are going to be more racist comments coming from the white people. I think that if the room were filled with more black people then there would be just as many racist comments.
i really think that black people say the things they say because they think that they should feel some kind of disadvantage against everyone else that is not black. as for white people, they might have this abstract thing called white guilt that makes them feel horrible for something that they have not done. either way the rudness definetly have something to do with the race of that person because if you had a lecture room full of multicultured kids, you wouldnt see any hate texts because they have nothing to hate the other for. and no matter what you do, you cant stop the hate between both races until you raise them a different way with different mentality.
I have to say, that some of the things that people were saying on the texting thing were just surprising. I mean how old are we again? I just think some of the things that were said were absolutely ridiculous and I was incredibly surprised we did it after the first day. No matter what gender or race of the people who were saying these things, they just should not have been said at all. However, after I watched this video and heard his question, I am pondering the same thing. Now being a white person, I know the stereotypes of white people not being able to dance, can’t jump, and blah blah blah. But when those were posted up on the screen I did not jump on the defensive right away and get offended; it is honestly not worth my time to get offended over every single thing that is said about white people because in all honesty I do not care that much. I cannot jump and I like to think I can dance and have a good time, end of story, who cares. I think because I am a white person these things just do not bother me, I mean they are not terrible things being said so why would I let it bother me. But I did realize a big difference between black and white people getting offended over the texting when the comment about someone having to listen to loud obnoxious black girls in a computer lab. Obviously whoever wrote this in wanted to get a rise out of people, or they just do not care, but to me it really is not that big of a deal. I mean aren’t there bigger things to worry about in the world other than someone calling black girls loud and obnoxious? Because can’t white girls be loud and obnoxious? Or Asian girls? I cannot count the number of times my parents have called me obnoxious, but I have never taken offense to it, I have been called way worse in my life. I just feel like there is always a double standard to what one racial group can say to another and a lot of it has to do with a peoples personalities. Maybe the people in our class that took offense to this comment have had a bad experience with someone calling them loud and obnoxious, who knows? But then it comes back to the questions of why can those people take offense to a comment like that, but when a comment about white people not being any good at sports comes up, why can’t a white person be offended by that? I feel like this would be a good topic to talk about in the discussion groups because I think it really depends on the person and/or peoples personalities.
I believe this has a lot to do with stereotypes and oppression that happened earlier. I don't believe that white people were oppressed by anyone. They were never really forced to do anything so, I don't really think this works both ways. A person of African origins would not try to be politically correct when he or she is speaking to a white person, whereas a white person would always have that at the back of mind when he or she is speaking to a person of African origins. I dont think this would work in the same way when black and brown people are having a conversation though.,
My response to the blog, “Does this rudeness thing cut both ways?” is that I do agree with what was said and also I witnessed the difference in reactions from rudeness put out by white people versus that put out by colored people. What I have to say about this is that I believe that because of the history between white and black people it will be near impossible for equal rights ever to occur. What I mean by this is that when white people say something offensive about black people, they are traced back to believing what people in the past believed, that whites were superior to blacks. On the other hand, when a black person says something about a white person I feel that it more so shows that now they have more rights than they used to before and they can freely say whatever they want to say. I believe that a white person would not be as offended by a rude comment from a black person because I believe that their feeling would be it's okay, we once were able to express our opinions about them, now they are able to express their opinions about us. Also, overall black people simply have a reason to have animosity toward white people, and unfortunately nothing can change that. This is not to say that I believe black people are allowed to say things that white people are not, but I am saying that due to the history between the two races, it is simply more accepted. It's almost as if the black people know that they are more empowered now than they were before and want to do things to prove that they are. I believe this is also the reason for a great increase in reverse racism today. Much like rude comments, even rude gestures are taken extremely differently by each race as Sam mentioned in class. If there happened to be a black only night down in one of the clubs at Penn State, nobody would give a second thought to it. However, if there was a white only night then it would be all over national news. I do not think that this is fair, I simply think that this is what our world has come to. Perhaps in the future we will all be more or less over what has happened in the past to our ancestors. However for now, nobody can change this.
I think most black people show more emotion because the comments that were rude had some racist flair. I didn’t really see any comments targeting whites. Maybe since there are more whites then blacks they feel targeted. I don’t think it’s a color thing on why they show more emotion about comments. I don’t really notice it anyway. Overall I think that the text in wall is a great thing for the class especially the poll questions. Some kids are idiots and write some rude comments but it is a small price to pay. I wish that it could identify who sends the message in.
I feel like this is a very interesting topic and one that has bothered me for awhile now. I feel like it is okay for colored people to say whatever they want about white people and it's okay and not offensive, but as soon as a white person says anything remotely close to offensive towards colored people then it turns into a big uproar. I personally don't really care what people say about me and white people cause that stuff doesn't bother me and some of the things colored people texted was actually funny to me but I'm sure it offended some of the girls in our class, especially sorority girls when they said something about uggz and such. I feel like no matter what white people say about colored people it is always made into a big deal, regardless of what is said, but if colored people are to say something offensive towards white people it just get shrugged off and put aside. Now don't get me wrong, the things said in class about black people and black girls was much more disrespectful than what the colored people texted about white people, but I still feel like it should be equal both ways. Colored people want to be treated equal to white people in regards to jobs and voting and being President, so then when it comes to being racist and saying offensive things then it should be equal, colored people should be yelled at as much as white people are. I feel like white people always have to be careful and watch what they say around colored people because we have to be politically correct and not hurt their feelings, but it's okay for colored people to say whatever they want about white people and we can't get offended by it. I just feel like we have come such a long way from the past and colored people being discriminated and in today's world we should all be treated equal no matter what. And for us to all be treated equal then what colored people say about white people should be labeled as offensive just as much as what white people say about colored people. I also feel like colored people label every white person as racist and rude because of what a couple stupid immature people said. Like what those few white people said about colored people does not represent the opinion of every white person in our class. It doesn't make every white person rude and racist. I personally feel like what the one person said about Sam's wife is 100 times more offensive then anything said about white or colored people and that situation should have been addressed a lot more than the situation where white people said rude things about colored people.
I agree that when we saw the things in class said by white people it was kind of a shock to us other white people, especially when that comment was said about the black people in the library. If the opposite happened I feel like it would not have been a big deal and the other white people in the class would not have thought anything of it. It is true in my mind that white people just ignore when they are called bigots or something of that matter because it is expected but black people can get away with murder when it comes to this category.
The white people are always the ones who did something wrong. I feel that if a white person doesn’t like a black person, then we are considered rude and if a black person doesn’t like a white person it’s ok. I think that the rudeness is equal it is just that whites get looked down on because it’s like that whites are expected to be like that to black people. And black people aren’t expected to be considered rude because anything we say to them is due to race at least that’s the way it seems to be. I think that all people are rude in our own ways and that we all have different opinions and views. What is considered rude by one person may not be considered rude by someone else. I do think that the rudeness does go both ways although we all feel that we are rude to each other.
I think you made a very good point with this comment. I actually also observed this in class when the texts were being sent up on the screen. In response to the new texting response system in class, I don’t like it all. I think it is a huge waste of time, and I feel that we are all staring up onto a screen and watching the same short comments being thrown up into the screen, mixed in with a few rude, inappropriate comments. I think the system would be much better if everyone was linked to their specific comment with an anonymous user ID (like the blog responses), but that nobody would really know who anyone was. By doing this, the anonymity of the responses would still be there, but people would not have so much power to write whatever they please, including inappropriate comments to purposefully hurt other people’s feelings for no apparent reason. It is obvious that power can’t be given to the class because most of the students are unable to handle it. I am shocked that so many students would take advantage of the fact that these responses are completely anonymous and say rude things to other people. As Sam said in class, “if you can’t say the response to a person’s face, you shouldn’t be putting it up on the screen.” Also, even if a person could say such rude things to someone’s face, it’s a race relations class and people should be more respectful towards others.
Specifically in response to the fact that everyone seems to laugh when someone makes fun of a white person, vs. someone making fun of a black person and people getting really offended, I think it has to do with history. Honestly, the ‘N’ word has really strong negative connotations for a lot of people. It was used in an extremely derogatory way towards many black people during a really tough time in their lives when they were race was strongly oppressed. If white people had similar words that were used against them, I feel that the reactions would be just the same. When people make fun of Penn state girls wearing “uggs” or a white “bench warmer”, the words are used in more of a light-hearted way and are just simply poking playful fun.
I think another thing that people need to realize is that the majority of our class is white. Of course the majority of the class is going to feel comfortable within their skin and laugh at the things that they are being made fun of. However, when you are making fun of a minority group, or a smaller percentage of the class, it singles people out more. I remember the one comment stated in class: “loud ass black girls in the computer lab”. Honestly, who wouldn’t get offended by a comment like that? It is obviously meant to purposefully hurt someone’s feelings. Even if the comment was not directed towards black women, a person being extremely loud is not a phrase that has a good connotation tied to it.
I hope that the texting response system improves a little bit during classes because right now I think they are a huge waste of time, and really taking away from class because people are not taking it seriously.
This question raises an interesting topic. During class on Thursday, Sam Richards asked the question, “What is the difference between black people and white people?” When white people were told to respond through text, most of the answers were respectable and nonjudgmental. The only exception was the following response: “I’m tired of loud ass black girls in the computer lab.” It is obvious that this is a terrible thing to say, especially in a room with a large population of black students. This is highly offensive and shows that some people are inherently ignorant and just plain rude. It definitely deserved the response that Sam gave. However, most of the other comments made by white people were along the lines of “there is no difference,” “skin is just a color,” and “whites are the majority.” While these responses are ideal, I have to question the sincerity of them. Is that what people truly think, or is that what white people think black people want to hear? Also, are white people just trying to prove a point to the black population? If those responses were all sincere then discrimination is much less of an issue than it is made out to be. But, I believe that many of those comments were the result of good manners and the participation in an ideal culture. Whether we follow those beliefs or not, there is a large chance that those comments were not all true.
Moreover, when the previously stated, ignorant comment was made, Sam was enraged. But when the black students were told to respond, most of the answers were very racist, judgmental, and stereotypical towards the overall attitudes of the white population. I found this insulting because I consider myself to be very open to other cultures. I may not be fully aware of the racism that still exists today, but I can honestly say that I have never in my life judged a person or treated them differently based on the color of their skin. While, I cannot recall specific examples, I do remember wondering why their multiple comments did not warrant the same reaction that the one racist white comment entailed. One of many things that I learned in class on Thursday, is that Sam Richards can claim to be cultured and unbiased, but that is not always true. Reverse racism is very prevalent and was made apparent through this class exercise. It really does baffle me as to why nothing was said about the stereotypical comments that were made towards white people. It was interesting to see the difference in comments between both races, however are whites supposed to filter their thoughts while blacks can say whatever they feel? That doesn’t sound too fair to me.
Maybe as a Caucasian I’m biased, but I definitely left class on Thursday with some anger. Comments attacking the white population will only make the situation of racism exponentially worse. By black students attacking white students a cycle begins and does not end until one group is able to get in the last word. The only way racism will come to an end is if all sides can make an effort to do so.
I think that rudeness is a two way street. The difference between rudeness initiated in a black/white situation is that a special type of rudeness is more likely to just go one way. There will always be sensitivity by blacks to certain comments that may be made by whites. It may pertain to a label, such as Negro or colored or it may trigger a stereotype that is insensitive or demeaning. Racial rudeness towards whites does not trigger that same degree of emotion.
I think that rudeness outside of racial aspects should be thought of the same regardless of race. Making disparaging comments about someone’s clothing, religion, family or intellect is hurtful, regardless of color.
This kid, my peer brought up a very good and interesting point. WHy is it that when white and black people say racist comment, only white people are told that they have done something wrong and society looks down on the white people that said the comment.
This question raises an interesting topic. During class on Thursday, Sam Richards asked the question, “What is the difference between black people and white people?” When white people were told to respond through text, most of the answers were respectable and nonjudgmental. The only exception was the following response: “I’m tired of loud ass black girls in the computer lab.” It is obvious that this is a terrible thing to say, especially in a room with a large population of black students. This is highly offensive and shows that some people are inherently ignorant and just plain rude. It definitely deserved the response that Sam gave. But when the colored people in the class were told to text their answer to the board about what they thought white people thought about being white they were very offensive, rude, and totally inappropriate. Specifically in response to the fact that everyone seems to laugh when someone makes fun of a white person, vs. someone making fun of a black person and people getting really offended, I think it has to do with history.
Honestly, the ‘N’ word has really strong negative connotations for a lot of people and i understand why people would get offended. If white people had similar words that were used against them, I feel that the reactions would be just the same. It was used in an extremely derogatory way towards many black people during a really tough time in their lives when they were race was strongly oppressed. but that brings up the point why are black people allowed to call each other "Niggers" (sorry for using the word) and white people can not call black people it even if it being using in a non judgment or derogatory way. If they think it is so offensive when white people say it then they need to stop using it too!!!
When people make fun of Penn state girls wearing “uggs” or a white “bench warmer”, the words are used in more of a light-hearted way and are just simply poking playful fun. But it is still rude.
I hate when people of color just assume people that are white have everything handed to them! they do not know what me or my family have been through. They are probably more privileged than most of my family. People of color get college scholarships and financial aid over white people. My friend who will remain anonymous did not get anything for school even though her mom did not work and her father had been laid of his job for a year and could not find another job. She was working a full time job and going to to school. Their family could hardly pay their mortgage. Still she did not get any financial aid. I think it i complete bull shit!
I completely agree with this post. I mean first off colored people didn't even answer the question they were asked. They just assumed they would be asked the same question that whites were asked and jumped the gun. Many did not even take the time to read the question let alone think of an honest answer. I just think that if they want to hear what we have to say they should honestly listen instead of just let our words stream in one ear and out the other.
Also I just want to point out that not only white girls wear uggs and northfaces.
I completely agree with your statement. When first being introduced the text comments I thought it was a good idea, but it will eventually get out of hand. Sam is trying to stir up a conversation from some students that normally don’t speak up. However, since the comments are anonymous, people feel that they can crack jokes without having repercussions. I’ll be honest admitting that I have said a few jokes during the past few classes, but I don’t really mess with race. There was a point where white people were told to only answer, and any joke that was made automatically stirred up controversy with the black people in the front tier. However, once black people had a turn, the jokes that they cracked, racist or not, did not result in a disgusted response. I don’t know where black people get off believing that they are privileged to laugh at white people and make jokes, but the second a white person fights back it’s a crime.
I feel that black people believe they are entitled to make racist jokes and act out because their people went through slavery. The only problem with that is slavery existed over 150 years ago. Just because their ancestors endured pain, doesn’t mean they feel it now. They never even met their great great great grandparents. I admit that slavery was wrong and should have never happened, but I did not enslave your people so don’t take your hate out on me. I notice black people acting privileged in all aspects of life. If you’re ever at a party and a black person starts acting crazy and dancing around, people laugh and enjoy it. But if a white person ever did that, they would be looked at like a loser. I just can’t stand how one race is allowed to get away with things and the other is not. I know it works both ways but white people are suppressed in ways too.
White people feel that if they ever did laugh at a racist joke around black people, they would get jumped. I see it all the time. I don’t know why, but black people think they can take on the world and fight anyone. They see videos on MTV and these “thugged out” millionaire rappers and feel that they have to act tough. Even if a white person has fifty pounds on a black person, the black person thinks they could take them. Also, I feel that black people are more confrontational. If something is said that doesn’t fly, a black person will let you know it 9 times out of 10. Yet if a white person hears a black person say something racist towards them, they’ll probably just sit there and take it. Racism is a problem still and it will only go away when we all see things both ways.
I agree with this question a 100%. I find this to be interesting and disgusting at the same time. I think this texting our answers is a great new thing to be used during class, but is it going to cause too much of a controversy. I feel when its white peoples turn to answer the questions about race we answer them legitimately but when its the other way around black people just make it a joke. Things being said such as, 'orange', 'ed hardy', 'uggs' 'north faces' and 'being white means going to Dave Matthews band concerts' by the way, what does that even mean? The majority of Daves band is black, but good one. Even though this is all true and made me laugh, I still think we need to grow up. Race isn't based on what one wears or what the fashion is it goes much deeper than that. I think its real interesting that before we had this texting thing and people could identify who was making the comment none of the 'real' stuff was coming out. There was barely anything said that would offend anyone of either race, but now that the race is hidden, we really attack each other. I guess that's the point of this texting thing to get what we really feel out into the open but in another way I feel that were in college and we should be a little more mature than this. Race doesn't rely on what we wear or what the 'in' this is. Race is sooo much more than that.
Before this class I really thought we had outgrown racism. I mean, I knew it still existed but not to this extent. I didn't know that we still hated on each other for ridiculous things. And I didn't know it was this bad. In a way I feel like I have been lied to or naive, one of the two. I knew there was still a line there in between black and white people but I had no idea it was still this deep and so much hate and animosity still existed. But I'm happy i found out how things really hard instead of going along through life thinking we're just one big happy world that loves each other. Reading the comments above I realized that no matter what there is always going to be a double standard between everyone and everything. Which is sad to justify everything with but its the truth. Thinking about all this what do 'brown' people have to say? How come its just 'black' and 'white'. I'd find it interesting to know what brown people think of of this whole thing between black and white people and where the stand in it.
I think the problem lies in the above intense debate topic of “white guilt.” Obviously the jack off who said something rude about the “black/brown” team doesn’t care and probably doesn’t experience this phenomenon of “white guilt” like others. That being said the folks who gasped at seeing racial stereotypes on the board were not all black and brown. I think that white folks are (in some cases) hypersensitive to making sure no one rocks the boat and that everyone plays P.C. On the other side of the same coin, when black/brown folks ripped on white people I noticed some gasps however to me (and know that I am white) it did seem like this behavior was less of a “no-no.” This is better than where we were say, 50 years ago however we need to get beyond this if we want to progress in the ongoing race relations dialogue.
I can understand where this phenomenon originated from. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out that hundreds of years of oppression that did not end after the civil war but continues in different shapes forms to this day by the dominant race group’s sociopolitical legacy from yesteryear – I am talking about the white people. I myself felt more uncomfortable at the sight of people from my “team” taking shots at black/brown folks than offended at black/brown team members returning fire. I am sure that in all the white folks who felt this way it came from feeling as though black/brown people were taking kicks while on the ground – as if they are the underdog and need extra assistance. I think this line of thinking is implicitly racist and dates back to hundreds of years of European philosophy which asserted that black/brown peoples needed the guidance of white people. On the same token, when receiving jibes from the black/brown team, just over the line of consciousness I felt that maybe “we deserve it” for our ancestors’ wrongdoings. I think the culmination of this happening is pretty bad. It lends itself to the problem which to SOME extent is a problem of labeling. What I mean by this is that part of the race relations problem comes from BOTH teams’ labeling techniques of the problem. Obviously there are still problems in out society with racism, but for those who are not blatantly racists themselves, some issues arise from this attitude that people on the white team have to feel like they personally should feel guilt for something much bigger than themselves. Sure one’s everyday actions have consequences, however this has been a problem for centuries and it is no one person’s burden to take on the weight of the world. I think when people on either side of the table make jibes at the other it takes away from the dialogue equally. White people are afraid to come to the table for fear of the perceived risk of being labeled a racist and what happened in class the other day is a perfect example. It is as if white people think that certain people at the race relation table deserve special speaking rules which is the farthest from the truth as I have come to learn it. Within the confines of the race relations dialogue everyone should be given the same channel of openness. It is only through honesty and a true yearning for change on both teams that we can make progress. To the white folks: stop wasting your time with focusing all of your energies on what went wrong in the past. Acknowledge it, remember it, but then move forward.
I think that this is a very interesting topic and one that I do not really know a whole lot about. I have felt in the past that people of other races are able to say things without feeling nervous, rude or ignorant, but if white people say it, it seems to be such a problem. I also feel like this problem goes a little bit into the white guilt topic. It seems as though white people know that there is history that they may have a reason to be guilty about, however, not a lot of white people seem to know their direct link to that history. They do not know if their ancestors were involved in holding slaves, or maybe even freeing them. They just seem to know that something bad went down and they need to feel bad about it. This whole idea also relates back to the discussion on how in race discussions, white people sort of sit out and sit back and just listen to what other people have to say until they realize what will be acceptable to say and what not to say. I do think that some things are viewed as rude when white people say things rather than people of color.
I think that a prime example of this is in Laurie’s book when she told the story about how Sam was viewed as the racist white man. There was no other mention of people of other races making a comment and being viewed at the racist black man or the racist Chinese man. People only seem to think that white people could make such a rude comment because they believe that white people believe themselves to be superior or the dominant race or something. All in all, I do not really understand it to be honest. I do not understand how one person could say something and then when it comes out of the mouth of someone of another race, it is completely offensive, rude and ignorant.
I feel this is why white people seem to sit back on race conversations because t hey may say something that gives them the title of being the racist one. It seems contradictory and hypocritical to me however, for someone to put a label on a white person as rude or racist for stating an opinion when that is solely what our society is trying to get rid of. The race discussions are set up to achieve an understanding with one another and get a gist for what other people’s experiences are and by only allowing certain people to say some things and not others is not helping in moving us further towards a more just and equal society.
I was actually thinking the same thing during class. I did not see a reason why there was uproar when white people made rude comments but people just laughed when black people made rude comments. I think it is because the race issues stem from black verses white and how white people were racist towards black people. Now a days most white people try and be politically correct so things do not bother colored people. Now I question whether black people try and be politically correct? Sometimes I feel like they do not. I have witnessed many black people make fun of white people but it comes off as a joke not racism. Black people do not need to watch what they say half the time because I think they believe that they were the victims and now have a right to say anything now. This is also the reason white people can not say anything they want. White people used to be the racists and to prove we have started to unite we have to make sure we do not revert back to racism. I think in class it was a big deal when white people made rude comments because most people did not expect that to happen. Most people probably expected white people to be politically correct but also state how they felt. In addition I think a lot of black people felt like if a white person would say that up on the board without showing who they were they would never say it in public. I think that it was also funny when Sam brought up to the black people that they want the white people to say how they feel but if anything is rude or racist they hate the person who said it. For white people it is not an even playing field; you can either hide your views about other races and have everyone like you or tell how you feel to the other races and be hated and treated like a racist. This was evident on the board where some people decided to hold back their feelings with comments like “I don’t know,” or “it’s just a skin color.” On the other hand some people decided to tell people how they felt about the subject but then got bad feedback from the rest of the class. I think though with the texting exercises more people will actually open up and say how they feel because they could not be pointed out as racist. Hopefully more and more people will find that saying your views allows for more opening and realization about our sociality today and how much work we need to do to unite.
This question is definitely a question I’ve had on my own mind as well, and apparently I am not alone considering most of those above me also agree. I wouldn’t think it’s too far-fetched to believe those of us that agree are also white. This is probably because few, if any, white people comment during class that it seems white people are being held to a double standard; One of which lets people of color speak freely, no matter how rude their comment may be, and yet if one toe is put out of line on the white team, we are being racist and ignorant . . . oh and rich. One of the first things that come to my mind is that any rude comment, white or colored, is usually part of the whole ignorance issue we are trying to overcome in the first place. Regardless, I have seen and heard that many more people of color are very quick to state how a white person’s rude comment is a big part of the race issue, but not their own. I don’t respect any white person who makes a rude comment because I believe Sam’s recent discussion about not thinking about who you AREN’T is another good way to show that we really don’t have the right to speak of how or who other people are. I would hold my words regarding a handicapped person’s attitude towards other non-handicapped people because I really wouldn’t know. An opinion would be fine, sure, but what good would ever come out of my deciding to make a rude comment about a handicapped person? The same way goes towards white people or colored people if you aren’t of that skin color.
Personally, one of the biggest issues, I think, is that there is no responsibility for anyone’s actions for something like this. To send a text without a connection to YOUR phone is way too easy to say what shouldn’t be said. Sadly enough, this sometimes may be the way people actually think, white or colored, but would never be able to say such things face to face to someone of the opposite skin color, so this is a good way to get things off their chest in their mind. However, there comes a time when people just need to grow up and realize that this is not what that texting board is for. Although it is a risky opportunity in my mind, it’s trying to get a race relations class to hopefully try to understand another point of view (from a different skin color) by being able to speak their mind APPROPRIATELY, one of the reasons that this texting board does not hold responsibility to a person’s text.
I’m not completely sure if this comment is fair. Although in class, Sam did call out the comment from a white person (when white people were asked what it means to be white and someone responded “that you have to listen to loud white girls in the computer lab”), and no comments were “called out” from non-white people. I was in class during this experiment, and in my opinion, there was nothing over the top rude said about white people by non-white people. It seemed like most of the responses were related to being privileged and other seemingly “positive” things.
I think that is interesting because, as a white female, I actually take offense to that. It can be just as hurtful to be called privileged as it can to be called things that non-white people are called. For example, it seems that black people are stereotyped as being poor and white people are stereotyped as being rich. So, when a white person finds success, they get the reaction that “of course that would happen, they came from money and had every advantage”. It is as if it was their whiteness that brought them success, no their personal hard work.
On the other hand, when black people find success they get the perception that they fought through all the barriers and are one in a million. It is as if EVERYTHING they achieved was because of their personal hard work. It is a double standard that is very unfair. That’s why I was so happy that in class, Sam really acknowledged that we should not be thinking like this. I think the exact words he used was “there are tons of black and brown people in this room that could buy some of your white families”. I’m sure they could.
I am personally very bothered by this mindset because, although white, I came from a lower middle class family. I am a first generation college student, and am paying for most of my college by myself. I’ve worked so hard for the past four years in class, and have held down a job during school, and have been fortunate enough to secure a job with Merrill Lynch/ Bank of America in New York City for after graduation. I would be willing to bet that when people meet me and talk to me for a couple minutes they would assume I come from a very affluent area, and that my family is extremely well educated. I feel like the battles I went through are discredited because people just assume I had everything handed to me. I am proud of where I am at and what I have achieved as compared to how I started out. I understand that not being white does make life harder, but unless someone has lived my exact circumstance, and the only difference is color, I really don’t know how we can assume skin color is that large of a determinant.
I definitely noticed this as well. I feel like this happens a lot, even in the real world, and it could connect to the whole white guilt or white responsibility thing. I feel like since our history is full of white people putting down or discriminating against colored people, we have been taught that doing that in the present day is ignorant and very unacceptable. I feel like a lot of times, we learn that being rude, discriminating, or making fun of people of color is wrong, not just doing those things in general. This takes discrimination against white people out of the lesson, and makes things like what happened in class “not that bad” when compared to if it happened to a person of color. Recently, I was out at a party with some girls who were black. I admit that I do not normally interact with black people here at Penn State, but it was not like I felt uncomfortable. The black girls were talking about how the “white girls could dance.” This was obviously playing on the stereotype that white people are not as good at dancing. Since I am enrolled in soc 119, it made me think about something similar to this post. Would it be alright if I, a white girl, said something like this that played on a black person stereotype? I really do think that it would not be alright in a lot of people’s opinions, and mostly that rests on the fact that I am a white person talking about a person of color. I also think that a lot of white people are almost scared to speak up when there are situations of “reverse racism” because they feel like its more acceptable and they understand where it is coming from. I think that this idea needs to be eliminated from the minds of white people. If it is not acceptable in one situation, it should not be acceptable in another. With what happened in class, it seems like a lot of people in this class feel like it is more acceptable for reverse racism. I also think that there is a certain “shock” value when we experience or witness racism in the present day, and for a lot of people, racism is a white attacking black thing, not the other way around. The shock value, I think, has to do with the mentality that all that oppression and discrimination is part of the past and we are all better and more intelligent in the present. So when someone does something like what happened in class with the texting, we are all (at least most of us) conditioned and taught to react with shock and disapproval, ESPECIALLY when it is a white person attacking a person who is of color.
The texting polls are a great idea in theory, but did you all really think that college students were mature enough to use them in the proper manner. I mean, I guess that you did, because it's something pretty fair to assume, but it was clearly shown that this is not the case. I'm not sure if it's because it's anonymous, or because people are bored in class, or they want to impress their friends, but this got out of control so fast. I just think it's a shame that Sam tried to do something fun and interesting for us in class, and it was tainted by people acting like idiots… Not like Donny, or whatever his name is video guy, helped out the situation…
Luckily, after a few weeks of trying this out, it seems that Sam has figured it out. I think there's more to be controlled with the close ended responses, but unfortunately there isn't as much value in what is being said. With close ended responses, you're forced to agree with one of 5 options, but with an open ended response we can see how people really think. And when used properly, it sparks good controversy, controversy that can help us think in a different way about race and the topics associated with it. Honestly, I don't even know if the closed ended questions are worth asking because people are going to be more politically correct, but it is a nice break from lecture.
Answering the proposed question, I think that the rudeness does go both ways. Although I noticed black people going crazy at white people's rudeness, I also noticed white people upset by black people's rudeness. Both sides of the argument were relatively heated, and it started to seem like more of a competition to "roast" the other race than to actually text in honest, appropriate answers. Why is that in a class that is supposed to foster better relations? I don't know? Maybe because people are still going to side with and feel the need to defend their race, regardless of what they've been taught. Or maybe people's views, or at least those on the extremes, are impossible to be changed.
Whatever it is, in class polling showed that we still have a long way to go. We all clearly still have HUGE strides to make when it comes to understanding each other, in even wanting to understand each other. But what this activity did show me is that people of both races, really of all races, are discriminatory and prejudice against races that are not their own. Therefore, it isn't just white people that are "racist". In fact, is anyone not racist? Sure, racist is a strong word, but is there really anyone that isn't partial to their own race? I think we'd be hard pressed to find many people, that if given the chance, would be interested and follow through with changing their race. This goes back to a belief that we all accepted, whether we want to admit it or not, at an early age of "I'm better than you."
Actually, I first noticed what Sam mentioned- that the people of color in the room actually seemed to be less serious about the questions being posed, and wrote more offensive things than the white students did. As far as the rudeness thing went, though, it seemed to me that the level of uproar coming from the audience was pretty much the same. If anything, I thought it was worse, actually, when the students of color were posting rude things, just because there are more white people in the room than people of color, and because of the sheer volume of not-so-nice comments made.
I was really disappointed and kind of upset about most of things that were displayed on the texting screen. It was shocking to see how rude people are and think that it is ok to write things like that. I don't quite understand those people's thoughts when they text those meaningless and impolite stuff to the screen. I couldn't understand because when in discussion group, everyone was very nice and always caring about the others. We discussed in our group how people would never dare to say those things to a persons face so what makes it ok to anonymously write that? No one sitting around me in class thought any of the nasty remarks displayed were funny, so why do it? Although I didn’t speak out and make any comments, I sat there in disbelief at the amount of things that people were saying. It was sad that very few people could take Sam’s exercise seriously. It did also seem like people of color were posting much more rude things about whites I found. This did bother me in a way to know all these horrible things that they thought about whites.
I think that this feeling of being politically correct is a good thing because sometimes people would otherwise say offensive things. But I also think that it can be bad because it prevents people from opening up to each other because you accidentally offend a black person or any person of color. How is it that everyone can reprimand white people for saying rude things about black people if black people say rude things about white people? Regardless of what happened in the past, on an individual level this is never okay. I do agree that when both groups put up racist comments it defiantly seemed that the white’s comments were much more offensive and I think also upsetting to a lot of people. I definitely do think that each group responds to both ways very differently. I also agree with the point that when white people make a negative or racist comment about colored people it is socially fine for the colored group to get outraged and furious. However, when a colored group makes a racist comment towards white it is usually just laughed off and not made a big deal or anything. Although I do believe that these issues are going to come up because we live in the most diverse country in the world, and the best way to approach them is to just be more open and listen to the needs and beliefs of others willingly without displaying ignorance. Overall I think this activity showed that we still have a lot of understanding to explore about one another. This did show me that both races still do have a lot of discrimination against one another.
I agree with what is said on this question, it did seem like white people were being reprimanded for saying things that were not called for. But I also thought that people of color were being equally rude or even worse and they weren’t told about it at all. People see an opportunity to anonymously post something and try to make people laugh but I guarantee those things would not have been said face to face. Some of it has to do with the reaction from the students when they saw what was posted many laughed or were waiting for someone of color to flip out. If we cannot take care of a racial issue like this in a racial relations class then how is society ever going to overcome it? Also I think a lot of those rude posts were just students being immature and taking advantage of a good thing. If these posts either had phone numbers or names to go along with it I highly doubt we would have had these rude comments posted because these students would have used their heads a little bit. I also think that if black people would have gone first we would have had the same type of thing going on and white people probably would have retaliated even worse. But if the white students are going to get yelled at for being immature then the black people should have been dealt the same treatment. Both the black and the white sides said some rude things that are the main reason why we are still dealing with race issues. If we can’t do simple activities like that in a classroom how are we ever going to be able to overcome this situation throughout our lifetimes? I think if this activity was used properly and we got some really good points made that would be a spark for conversations not only in lecture but also in our smaller discussion groups. I know sometimes in my discussions we kind of sit there and try to think of things we want to talk about, if we had legit posts to go off of we could use those to talk about later. The whole white guilt thing is defiantly an issue just be going on what has happened in the past that all of the white students in class had nothing to do with. I don’t understand why younger generations of white people are still paying for things that SOME of our ancestors did years ago. I am not saying that in any way what happened will ever be justifiable in any way, but at some point the white people cannot keep being guilty for things we had no control over.
I think there are two distinct ways that this question can be answered. The first is that people of color feel more free to speak their opinions than white people when it comes to race relations. White people, as a whole, are more reluctant to speak out or discuss what is really on their mind before testing the waters. Brown people, on the other hand, seemingly have dealt with these issues for a long time and have very few, if any reservations about what to say. Therefore, it can be the personal attachment and feeling of entitlement that explains why people of color react more strongly to "rude" comments made in class.
However, I think the stronger explanation for this is the usage of words and the meaning behind them. There are many slang words for people of color, the most offensive (in my opinion) being the n word. A word such as this is rooted in deep seeded hatred and racism. It has such a power that it can silence a large crowd or create an uproar, as we have seen many times in class. When someone texts in to the board using a word like this, I do not blame people of color for being offended or truly upset and causing a bit of a scene. At the same time, the scene that is created by yelling and showing anger is the motivation for someone in the crowd to anonymously text something offensive and create such a reaction. I do not quite understand what motivates someone to say a word in such a negative context that it offends large groups of people, unless they truly are that racist which is something I can not believe. I think its more just that they think the reaction is funny or they like creating a hostile environment, or something of the sort. The alternative side to this argument is that no such word exists with such a passion and history toward white people. Although some offensive words like cracker, honkey, and white boy exist, none have the background or history as some of the derogatory terms used to refer to people of color. The worst thing you can call a white person is a racist, and although doing so is highly offensive, it does not create a large backlash. When a white person reacts loudly to being called a racist it makes them look defensive like they are hiding their true feelings. Like Sam said in class, sometimes when someone accuses you of being racist the best thing to do is just sit back and keep your mouth shut. The more you try and defend yourself, the more it looks like you have to hide.
This topic is a very interesting topic and a topic that i feel needs to be brought up. Over the course of using the text messaging on the board in our class has raised a lot of feelings and i feel that it is brought up some tension between white and people of color only when we are separated and are told to respond to each statement. i feel that by "white people" needing to respond, and then "people of color" needing to respond i feel that ultimately there is going to be conflict amongst the class. The topic of this video makes sense to me, because yes i am white, but i did also notice what this kid is talking about from those days in class when "white" people need to answer and then "people of color" need to answer. I feel that all comments whether from people of color or from white people i feel that there are rude comments flying back in fourth on the board from all races. This video is true though, white people did say rude things, but so did people of color and I can not find a reason why there was alot of noise and commotion when a white person made a rude comment but when it was time for the people of color to make a comment, and theirs was rude there was no commotion. I am white but i would never say half of the things that come up on that board. I fell that many of them are rude and i just can not believe that people can actually have the balls to say that stuff for the whole class to see. i feel the comments are just rude and obnoxious on both ends when they are derogatory to one race or another. Some comments are practical and necessary for class but the other comments are just not needed. i know some times there are tensions and issues but then those obnoxious comments should not be said, especially on a screen in class, they should be kept to themselves if they feel that strongly against the other race.
When i see those comments on the board from both sides, whites and people of color i just do not understand why people still have to live in the past. I feel that so much has been done since back when race was a problem and i feel that by now all races should be able to come together. I feel that when those comments come up from people of color along with the comments from the white people the same reaction should be taken because its about the same thing. both comment whether the race are just talking bad about the other, and i feel that people should try to move forward and come together and put those past stereotypes aside and move forward so one day when a professor asks what does it mean to be white and what does it mean to be a person of color, the responses will not be derogatory towards any one.
This is a great question that this guy asked, I was wondering the same thing myself. A lot of what is said on the text boards is pretty funny in my opinion and I know that there are a lot of people laughing with me. Although there were a lot of funny comments a lot of them were also some comments that could be considered offensive by people of both the people on the white team and people on the black and brown team. I for one am not easily offended and I was not offended by a lot of what people said but, so much of what was said throughout all of the texting discussions was really immature and stupid. I am a huge believer in if you dish it out you have to be able to take it too. It seemed to me that a lot of the people on the black and brown team would get a lot more upset about an off color comment or stereotype, it may have just been a few people and I really don’t want to lump everyone into the same category, because I hate when that happens to me, but it was definitely louder and there was more opposition to comments made about the people on the black and brown team.
I like the whole idea of no political correctness in the text messages but I also believe that if that is really what you want to say or how you really feel, you should say it out loud and not hide behind a text message. Stand up and be heard, and be the person to start a debate. I think that Sam would love it and be able to run with what someone says and be able to convey a lesson to us students that we may not have had the opportunity to have before. We are all hear to learn and we are safe to say what we feel in this class so I guess I really am all about everyone being able to speak their mind. Being able to speak your mind is what this class is all about, and although some of the text messages in the discussion were “offensive” or mean these are some of the things that need to be said to spark a true debate about the differences that are seen by all of the races in this class. I just don’t know if the text message debates are really helping us to learn about race relations, it seems like it is being more abused for cheap jokes then for constructive comments. And even sometimes when the comments are constructive it seems like a lot of people are offended by them, we just need to stop being offended and be able to take what we dish out.
I never really noticed the difference in reactions in class. I was kind of surprised at first when the rudeness would not stop. I expected it the first day of testing out the new text responses, but I figured it would die down. Some of the comments were harmless and pretty funny, although way off topic. Others I think surpassed being rude and were offensive and derogatory. But just because Sam said for "only whites" or "only people of color" to answer the question, it does not mean that people from the different team did not post both times, or even only when they were not supposed to. I believe there was an overall disagreement with the overly rude comments, regardless of who posted them. Maybe there was a different reaction from each group, but I did not notice it.
I think it is double standard when black people get so offended people text "rude" remarks about them during class. How do you know it's a white person, it could be a black person just kidding around too. I don't see why it's okay for black people to make fun of white people and not vise versa.
People should just get over these “racial” slurs and stuff, I don’t think they need to be said nor should people feel offended by them. I understand that throughout history people of color have been oppressed and still are today but we should just try to move on. If black people make it okay for them to make fun of white people and not okay for white people to make fun of black people that is simply not giving white people equal treatment.
I really don’t know what can be said to offend a white person, at least about race, but they should not do it to people of color. I’m Hispanic and I’ve been called a Spic before, by black and Hispanic people but I have never really taken offense to it because I don’t even know what it’s supposed to mean. However I recently was told the meaning of it and it kind of did upset me but I still will not fight back if such occurs again.
I think that if you let others see that their words “hurt” you then you are letting them control you and so people should just not take offense to these words. However if these people are legit KKK members or Nazis or whatever then attention should be given to the situation.
I also noticed that lately there has developed “racism” or prejudice against Latinos. I think this is because everyone is scared of the economic situation in the country so they find people to blame it on. The same way the Germans blamed the Jews and set out to destroy them. It’s mostly the government’s fault for racism I think. They put out all these stupid “movements” to save our country and crap but they are not helping, instead they are dividing its people
You didn’t hear of beatings or murders due to racist reasons before, even when there was a heavy flow of Hispanic immigrants to the country but since the “war on illegal immigration” started it has escalated
So I think that the reason people are racist against each other is not because they are racist, but because they are scared and they want to find some way to solve their problems and get back to where they were. But either way white people should not make fun of black people intentionally and vice versa.
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I totally agree with you man. but i feel that if we want to take that texting system seriously we both are going to be held accountable for being rude. I don't like what is being said, and i can't stand it when i have to sit there and read absolute garbage. I get frustrated, people don't have any respect for the class, and clearly do not have any respect for Sam. people need to learn that just because it is anonymous doesn't mean gung ho on whatever they feel like it. People need to grow up and seriously consider it this way "would you say it to your parents?" what if your parents saw you saying those things. they would back hand you so hard! Maybe not the white people…but i know my parents would.
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I agree with the student in this video that the somewhat pointed comments about the colored people caused significant uproar but similar comments made about white people received less attention from the class. I think this all goes back to two key things: social norms and political correctness. For starters, it has become a social norm in our society for white people to act in a manner whereby they do all they can to avoid stating racist or derogatory comments towards people of color, even if such incidents may occur inadvertently. As Sam previously mentioned, when white people go to the race table, they are unlikely to lead or begin the discussion because they like to get a feel for the views and beliefs of the colored people at the table. This is done because the worst thing that you can call a white person is a racist and that whites will avoid offending colored people at all costs, including how they approach or talk to people of color. In terms of political correctness, our 21st century modern society revolves around sensitivity to people of different races, ethnicities, and cultures and that is why it is so crucial to be aware of your behaviors and speech when talking about such issues. These issues are going to come up because we live in the most diverse country in the world, and the best way to approach them is to just be more open and listen to the needs and beliefs of others willingly without displaying ignorance.
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Personally I think that the rude things were because these people are trying to be funny, and they think they are funny. What they do is get some sort of pleasure out of stirring the pot, and if they can do that without getting caught, even better for them and they will keep doing it I guess. Usually the rude messages coming from black people were in retaliation after what the white people said, and maybe some people think that because it’s just “getting even” then it’s okay? Who knows though, we will have to find out by letting black people send their messages first next time.
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After watching this flip video I realized I had many opinions on the subject and that this was a good topic for me to respond to. I feel I have encountered many situations like this in my teenage year as my high school was very diverse. It seemed as though white was the minority. It was almost flipped from the norm that whites are the majority in hall ways and classrooms. It always seemed that when a white person acted out in a bad way such as getting into a fight or causing a scene with a teacher it was a bigger deal than when a colored person would do the same. This seemed to be prevelant through out the schools at events such as basketball and hockey games. It also seemed as if they had much better relationships with the people of authority such as security guards and police. If i wanted I could continue on the differences I noticed but I dont feel that is important. The point I am trying to make is that the class has taught me alot already. I believe now that their was no difference in reactions to the actions of both whites blacks and browns but it was only how we percieved it. We had been taught our whole life about racism and segregation and all of this and this only made us more aware of the racial differences. We've been taught how in the past races were treated and looked at differently and sometimes we become guilty of doing so ourself. If this class has taught me one thing its that everything is just peoples individual opinions and views.
Since coming to school here I have noticed the difference in peoples views and opinions on different races. Because there is not nearly as much diversity here at Penn State as there was in my high school, people and much different views. People seem to be almost uneducated on the subject of race and try to hide behind it through political correctness like talked about in class. But again what I have learned in this class is that their is no fault that there is a difference in how people view race because everyone is raised differently and we cannot determine right or wrong. Here at Penn State I dont seem to notice much difference in reactions to the actions of different races. This video and instance is actually one of the first times I have noticed it. This may be because people just have different views but I feel it simply is because of the lack of diversity here. Like stated in class Penn State is 84% percent white and sometimes we dont even realize it. I just want to show that there is much to learn in class no matter where we come from and how we were raised.
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You hit it on the head its like what Sam said earlier its ok to make fun of other races except for blacks truth is I really don’t know is it because society expects blacks to act in a negative way so its ok? A large reason to why the conversation always goes back to white and blacks is because we are asking white and blacks to comment about racism. If you put some middle eastern people, Hispanics, and Asians in a room and asked them to talk about racism I guarantee they will not end up talking about white vs black. They'll end up talking about racism they've encountered from their point of view. America is about 75 percent white, whites (lets be honest) don't really like blacks… So if you ask the average white person about racism their gonna talk about their personal experiences and their feelings towards blacks.Racism in America is not mild compared to Europe. Its just very discreet. In our society people care what others think about them so even if someone is racist and wants to say racist things they usually dont because they care about what other people think.Blacks and whites always have tension because.. I believe the average white person doesn't like black people. In other words whites don't want blacks around. Most blacks are able to sense this dislikement towards them and then they in return get angry or call whites racist. Even though most of the time white people aren't racist its just a systematic exclusion of blacks they all want. Also besides Native Americans, whites and blacks built America. There is so much negative history between the two racists. This history is founded by struggle, pain, suffering, inequality, and injustice. I feel like a lot of the time the reason we say its always about whites and blacks is also because we, as individuals, have personal stories or negative anecdotes about a time in our life, or a friends or a family member or someone we know that had a bad experience with the other race
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I think that it does go both ways, because people of color still have that feeling that we don’t look at them the same and I think that is a reason why when people posted their comments they thought that white people were being rude. I still feel that we may have that white guilt but black people even though what they went through, I feel like you can also have controversial issues about it. I have seen black people be conceited where you have them to be known to great at like basketball and running and I definitely think they get the same way as white people. Don’t get me wrong now I have seen a lot of rude white people too or if they think they are really good at something. It works both ways I think that even when we try to say that we think black people are conceited you feel that guilt, but at the same time they could say that a white person is conceited and nobody would give it a second thought that they should feel guilty for saying it. I feel that white people may feel like we can’t be ourselves, and that guilt will always be there.
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I mean this just goes back to the whole concept that white people are more heavily-criticized for being racist than minorities. This stems from the fact that since whites are the majority in this country, if someone says something negative about them, no one really causes a scene or draws attention to it as much as when a white person offends a black or brown person. A perfect example of this is last year a few days after the election when Obama won, I saw a brown guy in West commons wearing a shirt that stated "This year, I voted black." I was literally appalled by the shirt. If a white person walked around with a shirt that said "This year, I voted white," I can only begin to imagine the commotion it would cause. But I guess that nobody was as concerned upon seeing the shirt as I was, or perhaps they, too, were just too appalled by it to say anything.
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We all never truly mean to offend each other and I think that we just need to look at it differently and think of it as all of us are equal and that we shouldn’t feel the need to feel guilt because. Black people may think of white people as rude because we may be the ones that black people feel that we look down on them because of their past. Maybe or maybe because we are white, but I don’t think that it is that big of a deal. Race is just a color and I don’t think they should feel that way.
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Let me start off by saying that yes, the rudeness does go both ways. In reference to the text messages, the things that made people react about the white comments were the fact that they were racist. Most of the black comments were stereotypical, which I may say could have been avoided as well. Take for example the comment “nigs ain’t shit” posted under the white responses. Never did I see a person of color call a white person a cracker or anything offensive over the text responses. But let this not become a black vs. white thing. As a whole I feel it is a way the people respond. As a black man I will not take to be offended in such a way and when I read the comment I immediately reacted. Maybe whites did not react the same way when they were offended but that is not my fault nor is it the fault of any person of color. Whites just as well as blacks have the right to comment or react and if white people allow themselves to be silence then shame on them. We are coming together in this race relations project, although it may be hard we have to get past the guilt and come to a common answer.
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That thought had never even crossed my mind. It was clearly noticeable that when white people said rude things many times it was ignorant or "offensive" when people of color said things they usually were talking about neighborhoods or other jokes that some would not find "offensive" however, the real point is. We CANT know who wrote what. sure the question was intended for one group but whos to say that someone else didnt just answer themselves? How do you know that the comments you were reading actually came from the groups you believe them to be from? The truth is, we really cant.
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I was going through this same question in my group discussion the other day. I found it very interesting that when white people texted something that was offensive or racist there was a lot of buzz and tension around the room, but when black people retaliated with the same kind of texts there really wasn’t any acknowledgement throughout the class. I really have not done any research in this topic but I have my own opinion on why this happens.
Because white people are the majority in our nation and here at Penn State white people almost feel as though since we have most of life’s advantages in our favor that we should never question the minority. I think this also factors into white people taking the back seat in a ‘racist issues’ discussion. From what I have seen I think white people believe that since minorities have many disadvantages in life that somehow letting them rip on us without responding back in any kind of way is a means of making up for those difficulties. Along those lines it seems as though that we are venturing into white guilt in social situations a great deal. On the other hand I think minorities, especially black people, feel the same way at the opposite end of the spectrum, they feel as if they deserve to poke fun at the minorities (even in a racist way) and they don’t feel any guilt about it what so ever. Although this is a very weird and awkward way of looking at these things I think it makes sense. But even though I think it makes sense I feel as though it pushes us farther away from ever getting over racism as a society. How can we overcome racism if it is still normal and accepted in these kinds of circumstances? I don’t think we can. If we ever want to begin to start confronting racism as a whole, matter like these needs to be put in the rearview mirror for us to move on.
Now to go off topic and rant a bit on how I understand racism and the stupidity of it. My father is Colombian and my mom is American, I was born in the United States but I still practice Latino culture with my family and feel I am very in touch with the part of my background. While I have more white friends than black and brown friends I have experienced both social screens and have come to a conclusion about racism. We are the same people! Each group talks about how different we are from each other but I really don’t see it. There are slight differences between the two but it is definitely not enough to warrant racism and the division between us. I think both sides need to realize how racism is only as big as how we make it and get over it.
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I was thinking the same thing as this guy, and I also discussed it with a friend of mine in the class and he noticed it as well. Last week a white person used the N-word in a text on the board and a black girl in the class spoke out that she was offended. However, when the black people in class had their chance to text, someone used the N-word again, but this time nothing was said. This is so annoying to me, and I don’t get it. If you’re offended by that word, then it shouldn’t matter who says it. It’s not fair to have a double standard. I feel like at times black people have been outspoken when a white person says the word to accuse that person of racism. Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that it’s okay to say the N-word. I have never used that word and never will, but it’s not fair when black people call each other the N-word but then freak out on white people for saying it. They shouldn’t pick and choose who’s allowed to say it. If you’re offended by it, then speak out against anyone who says it, not just white people. Why use the word, anyway? I don’t get why some black people call each other that word. It’s as if when they say it to each other, its meaning is “buddy,” or “bro.” The fact of the matter is that the N-word is a derogatory term in itself.
As far as other offensive comments, I feel like some people (black or white) think that making fun of white people is funny. I’m not offended by this, but at the same time I don’t agree with it. When Sam showed us the website of the things white people love, some of the things listed didn’t even make sense to me. I think white people are often targeted for silly amusement. The song we heard in class, “White & Nerdy,” is also a good example of this. White people often make fun of themselves and other white people as well, so black people probably think it is okay to make fun of them too. This is like the N-word situation reversed, but in this case no one speaks out that they are offended because white people (at least those in class) don’t have a double standard of who can say what when making fun of white people.
Overall, I think white people are a lot more laidback than black people when it comes to instances when people of one race talk about or make fun of another. I think that if more black and white people were friends with each other it wouldn’t be this way because there would be more of an understanding of what is or isn’t offensive.
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The gentleman in this video actually proposed a very good question. I can't give a definite answer for this question, but as a black person, I feel I can give a sufficient answer. (And just want to note that I was offended by nothing that was posted on the screen). It caused an uproar because there is a history of white people oppressing black people and not the other way around. Not justifying the fact that black people can say rude things because it is definitely wrong, but the world is what it is. It is what Sam was talking about in class. The worst thing that you can call a white person is a racist because white people never had an oppressive era in the history of the world. Not that minorities are angry of this fact, but minorities are sensitive to the words and actions of white people because white people have a history, so to speak, of putting down other racist. One may say it is in the nature of caucasian people. So for that fact minorities stay alert for the next act of racism, which is no way to live. Also, it is difficult to describe what true racism is and what could possibly be a joke but to ensure that all racism is caught society jumps at everything that looks like a hate crime. Along, with the ideas that I just stated I will also state that white people are not easily offended (as a whole). There isn't to much that you can say to a white person regarding their race that will hurt their feelings because they are on top of the food chain so to speak. So in a sense the emotions of minorities are much more fragile than that of a white person. So to answer the question at hand it is more offensive for a white person to say a racist comment than a black person to say a racist comment because white people have a history of being "racist". I mean in all seriousness true equality in America just began in the 1960's. And even still equality isn't "true". But to answer the other portion of the gentleman's question it is in no way, shape, or form for "black racism" to go unpunished if "white racism" is punished. If we as a society want to promote equality it has to come from both ends of the spectrum. We as a people need to stop being so sensitive and let things be. Minorities if someone calls you a offensive name turn the other cheek, and white people if someone calls you a racist let it be. We will never get to a world where everyone is equal if we keep supporting arguements that keep us apart.
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I noticed this exact same thing: Sam stopped class and was defensive when someone of color received an offensive remark on the texting board, but failed to do so when whites received an offensive comment (I believe we were referred to as “sorority sluts”). And coincidentally, this occurred during the same lecture in which Sam tried to say that nothing is offensive.
However, I think the exercise was fruitful in what Sam wanted to demonstrate. He has been trying to show that white people have never had to think about what it is like to be colored in our society. He has used the example of how many people do not think about what it is like to be handicapped; similarly, whites are rarely challenged to think about what it is like to be colored. On the other hand, race is a large part of identity and experience for those of color.
The responses to the question “What does it mean to be white?” demonstrated this idea. Those who were white responded with very simplistic, general responses (as others have pointed out). Many people sent in responses along the lines of “skin color means nothing,” “white is just a color,” “lack of melanoma,” etc. However, students of color responded with more directed and poignant responses, illustrating more thought and reflection on issues of race (if not any more maturity – as the texting program allows us all to give immature responses).
But I think that the fact that Sam will defend colored students, but not white students, goes back to a central issue we’ve been grappling with throughout this semester. Historically, our races have not been equal, and we are still not equal. We are not to a place within race relations where our comments are taken equally. There is still too much emotion, hurt, and fear wrapped up in our language and behavior.
I have struggled with some of Sam’s apparently contradictory comments and lessons in class thus far. For example, he says we all are equal at the race table and we all need to be a part of the solution. Additionally, we had that lecture on the bystander- effect and standing up for others. However, Sam also seems to argue that nothing is offensive and that we should stop over-analyzing our words and comments when it comes to race.
The truth is, we still take more offense to comments and actions against people of color. And I’m not saying that we should not be offended at such things. But if we are all equal at the race table, then we should also all be equal with our political correctness and comments.
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Yes rudeness goes both ways. What difference does it make if you are white black, brown, or whatever you want to identify yourself as. Its not only whites who can be rude to others we are all rude to each other and thats that. Its sad because society promotes it and thats how we are used to learning about other races through jokes so we our selves feel thats the best way to do so. We think we are being funny when we are actually showcasing stupidity and utter ignorance.
When people write offensive things on the screen I don't take offense to it because I think they are punks. Like Same said if you cant say iit to whatever race face then don't put it up there for a laugh because its pointless. The only person that going to pat you on the back is your self and your stupid friend who encouraged you to write what you wrote. I thought we were in a place where people had some form of education to know when to utilize common sense and not act like simple-minded animals.
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I picked up on this too. The big “racist” comment that put everyone in an uproar was when someone said being white meant “dealing with loud black chicks in the computer lab.” Such a statement can be offensive, and since a white person said it, it is taken as racist. Even Sam Richards was taken back by the comment and requested people refrain from making such racist comments. However, when the tables were turned and the black students in the room were given a chance to answer the question, many of them made comments such as being white meant “being stuck up” or “throw out the uggs.” Such comments were taken with humor and as far as I recall, Sam did not say anything in defense of the white team and say that was racist. There is clearly a double standard in the works here. What makes “dealing with loud black chicks in the computer lab” any different than “being stuck up.” Are they both not offensive? To say that being white means to be stuck up is a negative comment that generalizes the white team. Not every single white person is stuck up. Not every single white girl wears uggs. These comments are stereotypical, yet they were taken as less offensive than the stereotypical comment on black women. To say that black chicks are loud in the computer lab is just to make an observation that holds some truth to it. I have been in plenty of computer labs here on campus that had black women being obnoxiously loud when they shouldn’t be. I’m not saying that every black woman is guilty of this act, but there is some truth to the statement mentioned in class. There is also truth in the statement that white women should throw out the uggs. A lot of white girls on campus own uggs, but not every one of them do. So all the comments mentioned in class seem to hold some truth to them, and they were just statements. So why did the comment towards black people hold more weight to it than the comments towards white people? It seems that this is usually the case. I think our white guilt is the root of all of this. We see any comment directed towards the black race that may be offensive as a large step backwards in the road to equality. Yet, the white people don’t say much when black people direct offensive comments towards them. This is actually another step backwards in the road to equality because now a double standard exists where white people have to be careful about what they say to black people, yet the standards on comments made by black people are a little less regulated.
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Rudeness does go both ways between people of color and white people. I have two experiences that I want to share that I have had in college. What was made very clear to me was that the dialogue between white people and people of color is not as open in the North and straightforward as it is in the South. Early in the semester I went to Texas for a LGBT leadership retreat. I was shocked when I went to visit the people of color suite in the hotel for breakfast and saw a sign on the door that said people of color only. There were blacks, Asians, Latinos, and Native American’s in the suite that shared that space and if a white person tried to enter the room everyone converged on that person in a hostile way. I understand that they where trying to show white people how it feels to not be wanted in a space based on skin color, but they did not explain their objectives to the white people who wanted to join their friends inside the suite. I understood that it was a social experiment, but it was the malicious way that they went about it, it was purely not for educational purpose. I felt like I was in a weird twilight zone, were minorities were now reverting to the blatantly racist attitudes that the whites displayed in the during the Civil Rights movement when they were forced to desegregate. Some white people did understand the point that the sign “colored people only” was trying to make and others used it as fuel against people of color as another reason why they didn’t like them.
I was uncomfortable being in that environment, because I did not agree with how the people in the suite handled the situation. We had an opportunity to open up and create a change by being able to have an open dialogue discussion. It was interesting to see how the king of the mountain example came into play once the shoe was on the other foot. When the minorities had the power to control a space they did not use it to repair race relations, but discriminate against whites. I was really disappointed in how everything went down and it took a couple of people to keep me from going off the deep end and telling off every single person in that room. Minorities always speak about equality and how it’s a right for everyone, but I feel that white people aren’t always included in that picture of equality because of what happened in the past. I guess that’s why whites are hesitant to share some of the power, because of guilt and also because they have not have to answer for generational discrimination.
Going back to the question asked by the man in video. If there was a suite for white people and they did not allow people of color in I can guarantee you that it would have been a massive uproar. Letting people have a safe space to talk is step on in the road to repairing race relations and we need more courses like soc 119 and straight talks that allows to have open dialogue and talk about these types of issues. I agree with Sam that you have to allow people to have an open discussion. In my straight talk class I took my sophomore year we had a lot of open discussion and we talked about our fears about discussing race. I remember this White guy in my class who was really concerned about offending people of color in discussion groups. He looked for acceptance before he spoke and constantly kept apologizing and being safe with his word choices. I appreciated that he voiced his concerns and that he eventually opened up and gave his true opinions and concerns. I remember Sam saying along the lines that white people are taught from early on to have a filter and take a passive role in race relations conversations.
I recommend that all students take a race relations course or a straight talks class because not only do you understand your own identity you learn about other peoples identities and to not only celebrate diversity but our similarities as well. There is always going to be “rudeness”, because you cannot make everyone happy all the time. It is in people’s nature to seek out the differences. If it’s not your skin color than it’s your gender, religion, age, class, or your sexual orientation that will be used to discriminate and keep some system of hegemony. Everyone should be held accountable for what they say no matter what their skin color is, ignorance is ignorance.
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This is a very interesting question. I did notice this also happening in class. When you are whit eI think that ow are put up to a double standard which I don't think is appropriate at all but unfornatley. I dpnt think this is acceptable at all though. When people were making those comment I think that black people feel entitled to say what they want because they feel that we are held back in todays standards of society. Yes even though statistically speaking this may be true this does not make them any better and they should not be entitled to say what ever they want without getting backlash as well. I feel like so many people think this way not even if they are black but if they are gay, muslim, or any other group that is discriminated in todays life. Yes this is rough and the relaity of things but spreading that hate does not make it any better. People go thorugh rough times everyday but if they thought about the event that happened to them fighting back or doing action like saying negative things about white people will not hep the situation and will most likely end up making is worst. I feel that it is a much stronger stance to not say anything negative at all, acklnoledge who todays world is, and be s truing person breaking down those barriers as the person you are, not with the race you represent. In term of the white people saying negative things they should be ashamed. How do they think its funny white or black to say such things. Hello people it is 2010. We should not drop jokes like these especially in a classroom setting. ITs just rude and makes people feel very uncomfortable wether hey are white or black . Double standards exist everywhere in this world and will always exist in this world. They will orbably never be broken down but if people start to respect eachother one person at a time then eventually one day. I will say that they white people were not more wrong than the people of colro. Its just pure ignorance on both sides. Maybe one day we will learn that being an asshole has nothing to do with race but who you are as a person and people will not be put up to these double standards anymore.
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I think that the rudeness does cut both ways. If you think about it, when Same posts a question to all the white people in the room there are always some racist comments in there. And when he posts a comment to all the black people in the room, there are a lot racists comments. I think that this is because the majority of the class is white! The white people in the room clearly outnumber the black people so obviously there are going to be more racist comments coming from the white people. I think that if the room were filled with more black people then there would be just as many racist comments.
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i really think that black people say the things they say because they think that they should feel some kind of disadvantage against everyone else that is not black. as for white people, they might have this abstract thing called white guilt that makes them feel horrible for something that they have not done. either way the rudness definetly have something to do with the race of that person because if you had a lecture room full of multicultured kids, you wouldnt see any hate texts because they have nothing to hate the other for. and no matter what you do, you cant stop the hate between both races until you raise them a different way with different mentality.
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I have to say, that some of the things that people were saying on the texting thing were just surprising. I mean how old are we again? I just think some of the things that were said were absolutely ridiculous and I was incredibly surprised we did it after the first day. No matter what gender or race of the people who were saying these things, they just should not have been said at all. However, after I watched this video and heard his question, I am pondering the same thing. Now being a white person, I know the stereotypes of white people not being able to dance, can’t jump, and blah blah blah. But when those were posted up on the screen I did not jump on the defensive right away and get offended; it is honestly not worth my time to get offended over every single thing that is said about white people because in all honesty I do not care that much. I cannot jump and I like to think I can dance and have a good time, end of story, who cares. I think because I am a white person these things just do not bother me, I mean they are not terrible things being said so why would I let it bother me. But I did realize a big difference between black and white people getting offended over the texting when the comment about someone having to listen to loud obnoxious black girls in a computer lab. Obviously whoever wrote this in wanted to get a rise out of people, or they just do not care, but to me it really is not that big of a deal. I mean aren’t there bigger things to worry about in the world other than someone calling black girls loud and obnoxious? Because can’t white girls be loud and obnoxious? Or Asian girls? I cannot count the number of times my parents have called me obnoxious, but I have never taken offense to it, I have been called way worse in my life. I just feel like there is always a double standard to what one racial group can say to another and a lot of it has to do with a peoples personalities. Maybe the people in our class that took offense to this comment have had a bad experience with someone calling them loud and obnoxious, who knows? But then it comes back to the questions of why can those people take offense to a comment like that, but when a comment about white people not being any good at sports comes up, why can’t a white person be offended by that? I feel like this would be a good topic to talk about in the discussion groups because I think it really depends on the person and/or peoples personalities.
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I believe this has a lot to do with stereotypes and oppression that happened earlier. I don't believe that white people were oppressed by anyone. They were never really forced to do anything so, I don't really think this works both ways. A person of African origins would not try to be politically correct when he or she is speaking to a white person, whereas a white person would always have that at the back of mind when he or she is speaking to a person of African origins. I dont think this would work in the same way when black and brown people are having a conversation though.,
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My response to the blog, “Does this rudeness thing cut both ways?” is that I do agree with what was said and also I witnessed the difference in reactions from rudeness put out by white people versus that put out by colored people. What I have to say about this is that I believe that because of the history between white and black people it will be near impossible for equal rights ever to occur. What I mean by this is that when white people say something offensive about black people, they are traced back to believing what people in the past believed, that whites were superior to blacks. On the other hand, when a black person says something about a white person I feel that it more so shows that now they have more rights than they used to before and they can freely say whatever they want to say. I believe that a white person would not be as offended by a rude comment from a black person because I believe that their feeling would be it's okay, we once were able to express our opinions about them, now they are able to express their opinions about us. Also, overall black people simply have a reason to have animosity toward white people, and unfortunately nothing can change that. This is not to say that I believe black people are allowed to say things that white people are not, but I am saying that due to the history between the two races, it is simply more accepted. It's almost as if the black people know that they are more empowered now than they were before and want to do things to prove that they are. I believe this is also the reason for a great increase in reverse racism today. Much like rude comments, even rude gestures are taken extremely differently by each race as Sam mentioned in class. If there happened to be a black only night down in one of the clubs at Penn State, nobody would give a second thought to it. However, if there was a white only night then it would be all over national news. I do not think that this is fair, I simply think that this is what our world has come to. Perhaps in the future we will all be more or less over what has happened in the past to our ancestors. However for now, nobody can change this.
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I think most black people show more emotion because the comments that were rude had some racist flair. I didn’t really see any comments targeting whites. Maybe since there are more whites then blacks they feel targeted. I don’t think it’s a color thing on why they show more emotion about comments. I don’t really notice it anyway. Overall I think that the text in wall is a great thing for the class especially the poll questions. Some kids are idiots and write some rude comments but it is a small price to pay. I wish that it could identify who sends the message in.
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I feel like this is a very interesting topic and one that has bothered me for awhile now. I feel like it is okay for colored people to say whatever they want about white people and it's okay and not offensive, but as soon as a white person says anything remotely close to offensive towards colored people then it turns into a big uproar. I personally don't really care what people say about me and white people cause that stuff doesn't bother me and some of the things colored people texted was actually funny to me but I'm sure it offended some of the girls in our class, especially sorority girls when they said something about uggz and such. I feel like no matter what white people say about colored people it is always made into a big deal, regardless of what is said, but if colored people are to say something offensive towards white people it just get shrugged off and put aside. Now don't get me wrong, the things said in class about black people and black girls was much more disrespectful than what the colored people texted about white people, but I still feel like it should be equal both ways. Colored people want to be treated equal to white people in regards to jobs and voting and being President, so then when it comes to being racist and saying offensive things then it should be equal, colored people should be yelled at as much as white people are. I feel like white people always have to be careful and watch what they say around colored people because we have to be politically correct and not hurt their feelings, but it's okay for colored people to say whatever they want about white people and we can't get offended by it. I just feel like we have come such a long way from the past and colored people being discriminated and in today's world we should all be treated equal no matter what. And for us to all be treated equal then what colored people say about white people should be labeled as offensive just as much as what white people say about colored people. I also feel like colored people label every white person as racist and rude because of what a couple stupid immature people said. Like what those few white people said about colored people does not represent the opinion of every white person in our class. It doesn't make every white person rude and racist. I personally feel like what the one person said about Sam's wife is 100 times more offensive then anything said about white or colored people and that situation should have been addressed a lot more than the situation where white people said rude things about colored people.
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I agree that when we saw the things in class said by white people it was kind of a shock to us other white people, especially when that comment was said about the black people in the library. If the opposite happened I feel like it would not have been a big deal and the other white people in the class would not have thought anything of it. It is true in my mind that white people just ignore when they are called bigots or something of that matter because it is expected but black people can get away with murder when it comes to this category.
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The white people are always the ones who did something wrong. I feel that if a white person doesn’t like a black person, then we are considered rude and if a black person doesn’t like a white person it’s ok. I think that the rudeness is equal it is just that whites get looked down on because it’s like that whites are expected to be like that to black people. And black people aren’t expected to be considered rude because anything we say to them is due to race at least that’s the way it seems to be. I think that all people are rude in our own ways and that we all have different opinions and views. What is considered rude by one person may not be considered rude by someone else. I do think that the rudeness does go both ways although we all feel that we are rude to each other.
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I think you made a very good point with this comment. I actually also observed this in class when the texts were being sent up on the screen. In response to the new texting response system in class, I don’t like it all. I think it is a huge waste of time, and I feel that we are all staring up onto a screen and watching the same short comments being thrown up into the screen, mixed in with a few rude, inappropriate comments. I think the system would be much better if everyone was linked to their specific comment with an anonymous user ID (like the blog responses), but that nobody would really know who anyone was. By doing this, the anonymity of the responses would still be there, but people would not have so much power to write whatever they please, including inappropriate comments to purposefully hurt other people’s feelings for no apparent reason. It is obvious that power can’t be given to the class because most of the students are unable to handle it. I am shocked that so many students would take advantage of the fact that these responses are completely anonymous and say rude things to other people. As Sam said in class, “if you can’t say the response to a person’s face, you shouldn’t be putting it up on the screen.” Also, even if a person could say such rude things to someone’s face, it’s a race relations class and people should be more respectful towards others.
Specifically in response to the fact that everyone seems to laugh when someone makes fun of a white person, vs. someone making fun of a black person and people getting really offended, I think it has to do with history. Honestly, the ‘N’ word has really strong negative connotations for a lot of people. It was used in an extremely derogatory way towards many black people during a really tough time in their lives when they were race was strongly oppressed. If white people had similar words that were used against them, I feel that the reactions would be just the same. When people make fun of Penn state girls wearing “uggs” or a white “bench warmer”, the words are used in more of a light-hearted way and are just simply poking playful fun.
I think another thing that people need to realize is that the majority of our class is white. Of course the majority of the class is going to feel comfortable within their skin and laugh at the things that they are being made fun of. However, when you are making fun of a minority group, or a smaller percentage of the class, it singles people out more. I remember the one comment stated in class: “loud ass black girls in the computer lab”. Honestly, who wouldn’t get offended by a comment like that? It is obviously meant to purposefully hurt someone’s feelings. Even if the comment was not directed towards black women, a person being extremely loud is not a phrase that has a good connotation tied to it.
I hope that the texting response system improves a little bit during classes because right now I think they are a huge waste of time, and really taking away from class because people are not taking it seriously.
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This question raises an interesting topic. During class on Thursday, Sam Richards asked the question, “What is the difference between black people and white people?” When white people were told to respond through text, most of the answers were respectable and nonjudgmental. The only exception was the following response: “I’m tired of loud ass black girls in the computer lab.” It is obvious that this is a terrible thing to say, especially in a room with a large population of black students. This is highly offensive and shows that some people are inherently ignorant and just plain rude. It definitely deserved the response that Sam gave. However, most of the other comments made by white people were along the lines of “there is no difference,” “skin is just a color,” and “whites are the majority.” While these responses are ideal, I have to question the sincerity of them. Is that what people truly think, or is that what white people think black people want to hear? Also, are white people just trying to prove a point to the black population? If those responses were all sincere then discrimination is much less of an issue than it is made out to be. But, I believe that many of those comments were the result of good manners and the participation in an ideal culture. Whether we follow those beliefs or not, there is a large chance that those comments were not all true.
Moreover, when the previously stated, ignorant comment was made, Sam was enraged. But when the black students were told to respond, most of the answers were very racist, judgmental, and stereotypical towards the overall attitudes of the white population. I found this insulting because I consider myself to be very open to other cultures. I may not be fully aware of the racism that still exists today, but I can honestly say that I have never in my life judged a person or treated them differently based on the color of their skin. While, I cannot recall specific examples, I do remember wondering why their multiple comments did not warrant the same reaction that the one racist white comment entailed. One of many things that I learned in class on Thursday, is that Sam Richards can claim to be cultured and unbiased, but that is not always true. Reverse racism is very prevalent and was made apparent through this class exercise. It really does baffle me as to why nothing was said about the stereotypical comments that were made towards white people. It was interesting to see the difference in comments between both races, however are whites supposed to filter their thoughts while blacks can say whatever they feel? That doesn’t sound too fair to me.
Maybe as a Caucasian I’m biased, but I definitely left class on Thursday with some anger. Comments attacking the white population will only make the situation of racism exponentially worse. By black students attacking white students a cycle begins and does not end until one group is able to get in the last word. The only way racism will come to an end is if all sides can make an effort to do so.
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I think that rudeness is a two way street. The difference between rudeness initiated in a black/white situation is that a special type of rudeness is more likely to just go one way. There will always be sensitivity by blacks to certain comments that may be made by whites. It may pertain to a label, such as Negro or colored or it may trigger a stereotype that is insensitive or demeaning. Racial rudeness towards whites does not trigger that same degree of emotion.
I think that rudeness outside of racial aspects should be thought of the same regardless of race. Making disparaging comments about someone’s clothing, religion, family or intellect is hurtful, regardless of color.
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This kid, my peer brought up a very good and interesting point. WHy is it that when white and black people say racist comment, only white people are told that they have done something wrong and society looks down on the white people that said the comment.
This question raises an interesting topic. During class on Thursday, Sam Richards asked the question, “What is the difference between black people and white people?” When white people were told to respond through text, most of the answers were respectable and nonjudgmental. The only exception was the following response: “I’m tired of loud ass black girls in the computer lab.” It is obvious that this is a terrible thing to say, especially in a room with a large population of black students. This is highly offensive and shows that some people are inherently ignorant and just plain rude. It definitely deserved the response that Sam gave. But when the colored people in the class were told to text their answer to the board about what they thought white people thought about being white they were very offensive, rude, and totally inappropriate. Specifically in response to the fact that everyone seems to laugh when someone makes fun of a white person, vs. someone making fun of a black person and people getting really offended, I think it has to do with history.
Honestly, the ‘N’ word has really strong negative connotations for a lot of people and i understand why people would get offended. If white people had similar words that were used against them, I feel that the reactions would be just the same. It was used in an extremely derogatory way towards many black people during a really tough time in their lives when they were race was strongly oppressed. but that brings up the point why are black people allowed to call each other "Niggers" (sorry for using the word) and white people can not call black people it even if it being using in a non judgment or derogatory way. If they think it is so offensive when white people say it then they need to stop using it too!!!
When people make fun of Penn state girls wearing “uggs” or a white “bench warmer”, the words are used in more of a light-hearted way and are just simply poking playful fun. But it is still rude.
I hate when people of color just assume people that are white have everything handed to them! they do not know what me or my family have been through. They are probably more privileged than most of my family. People of color get college scholarships and financial aid over white people. My friend who will remain anonymous did not get anything for school even though her mom did not work and her father had been laid of his job for a year and could not find another job. She was working a full time job and going to to school. Their family could hardly pay their mortgage. Still she did not get any financial aid. I think it i complete bull shit!
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I completely agree with this post. I mean first off colored people didn't even answer the question they were asked. They just assumed they would be asked the same question that whites were asked and jumped the gun. Many did not even take the time to read the question let alone think of an honest answer. I just think that if they want to hear what we have to say they should honestly listen instead of just let our words stream in one ear and out the other.
Also I just want to point out that not only white girls wear uggs and northfaces.
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I completely agree with your statement. When first being introduced the text comments I thought it was a good idea, but it will eventually get out of hand. Sam is trying to stir up a conversation from some students that normally don’t speak up. However, since the comments are anonymous, people feel that they can crack jokes without having repercussions. I’ll be honest admitting that I have said a few jokes during the past few classes, but I don’t really mess with race. There was a point where white people were told to only answer, and any joke that was made automatically stirred up controversy with the black people in the front tier. However, once black people had a turn, the jokes that they cracked, racist or not, did not result in a disgusted response. I don’t know where black people get off believing that they are privileged to laugh at white people and make jokes, but the second a white person fights back it’s a crime.
I feel that black people believe they are entitled to make racist jokes and act out because their people went through slavery. The only problem with that is slavery existed over 150 years ago. Just because their ancestors endured pain, doesn’t mean they feel it now. They never even met their great great great grandparents. I admit that slavery was wrong and should have never happened, but I did not enslave your people so don’t take your hate out on me. I notice black people acting privileged in all aspects of life. If you’re ever at a party and a black person starts acting crazy and dancing around, people laugh and enjoy it. But if a white person ever did that, they would be looked at like a loser. I just can’t stand how one race is allowed to get away with things and the other is not. I know it works both ways but white people are suppressed in ways too.
White people feel that if they ever did laugh at a racist joke around black people, they would get jumped. I see it all the time. I don’t know why, but black people think they can take on the world and fight anyone. They see videos on MTV and these “thugged out” millionaire rappers and feel that they have to act tough. Even if a white person has fifty pounds on a black person, the black person thinks they could take them. Also, I feel that black people are more confrontational. If something is said that doesn’t fly, a black person will let you know it 9 times out of 10. Yet if a white person hears a black person say something racist towards them, they’ll probably just sit there and take it. Racism is a problem still and it will only go away when we all see things both ways.
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I agree with this question a 100%. I find this to be interesting and disgusting at the same time. I think this texting our answers is a great new thing to be used during class, but is it going to cause too much of a controversy. I feel when its white peoples turn to answer the questions about race we answer them legitimately but when its the other way around black people just make it a joke. Things being said such as, 'orange', 'ed hardy', 'uggs' 'north faces' and 'being white means going to Dave Matthews band concerts' by the way, what does that even mean? The majority of Daves band is black, but good one. Even though this is all true and made me laugh, I still think we need to grow up. Race isn't based on what one wears or what the fashion is it goes much deeper than that. I think its real interesting that before we had this texting thing and people could identify who was making the comment none of the 'real' stuff was coming out. There was barely anything said that would offend anyone of either race, but now that the race is hidden, we really attack each other. I guess that's the point of this texting thing to get what we really feel out into the open but in another way I feel that were in college and we should be a little more mature than this. Race doesn't rely on what we wear or what the 'in' this is. Race is sooo much more than that.
Before this class I really thought we had outgrown racism. I mean, I knew it still existed but not to this extent. I didn't know that we still hated on each other for ridiculous things. And I didn't know it was this bad. In a way I feel like I have been lied to or naive, one of the two. I knew there was still a line there in between black and white people but I had no idea it was still this deep and so much hate and animosity still existed. But I'm happy i found out how things really hard instead of going along through life thinking we're just one big happy world that loves each other. Reading the comments above I realized that no matter what there is always going to be a double standard between everyone and everything. Which is sad to justify everything with but its the truth. Thinking about all this what do 'brown' people have to say? How come its just 'black' and 'white'. I'd find it interesting to know what brown people think of of this whole thing between black and white people and where the stand in it.
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I think the problem lies in the above intense debate topic of “white guilt.” Obviously the jack off who said something rude about the “black/brown” team doesn’t care and probably doesn’t experience this phenomenon of “white guilt” like others. That being said the folks who gasped at seeing racial stereotypes on the board were not all black and brown. I think that white folks are (in some cases) hypersensitive to making sure no one rocks the boat and that everyone plays P.C. On the other side of the same coin, when black/brown folks ripped on white people I noticed some gasps however to me (and know that I am white) it did seem like this behavior was less of a “no-no.” This is better than where we were say, 50 years ago however we need to get beyond this if we want to progress in the ongoing race relations dialogue.
I can understand where this phenomenon originated from. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out that hundreds of years of oppression that did not end after the civil war but continues in different shapes forms to this day by the dominant race group’s sociopolitical legacy from yesteryear – I am talking about the white people. I myself felt more uncomfortable at the sight of people from my “team” taking shots at black/brown folks than offended at black/brown team members returning fire. I am sure that in all the white folks who felt this way it came from feeling as though black/brown people were taking kicks while on the ground – as if they are the underdog and need extra assistance. I think this line of thinking is implicitly racist and dates back to hundreds of years of European philosophy which asserted that black/brown peoples needed the guidance of white people. On the same token, when receiving jibes from the black/brown team, just over the line of consciousness I felt that maybe “we deserve it” for our ancestors’ wrongdoings. I think the culmination of this happening is pretty bad. It lends itself to the problem which to SOME extent is a problem of labeling. What I mean by this is that part of the race relations problem comes from BOTH teams’ labeling techniques of the problem. Obviously there are still problems in out society with racism, but for those who are not blatantly racists themselves, some issues arise from this attitude that people on the white team have to feel like they personally should feel guilt for something much bigger than themselves. Sure one’s everyday actions have consequences, however this has been a problem for centuries and it is no one person’s burden to take on the weight of the world. I think when people on either side of the table make jibes at the other it takes away from the dialogue equally. White people are afraid to come to the table for fear of the perceived risk of being labeled a racist and what happened in class the other day is a perfect example. It is as if white people think that certain people at the race relation table deserve special speaking rules which is the farthest from the truth as I have come to learn it. Within the confines of the race relations dialogue everyone should be given the same channel of openness. It is only through honesty and a true yearning for change on both teams that we can make progress. To the white folks: stop wasting your time with focusing all of your energies on what went wrong in the past. Acknowledge it, remember it, but then move forward.
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I think that this is a very interesting topic and one that I do not really know a whole lot about. I have felt in the past that people of other races are able to say things without feeling nervous, rude or ignorant, but if white people say it, it seems to be such a problem. I also feel like this problem goes a little bit into the white guilt topic. It seems as though white people know that there is history that they may have a reason to be guilty about, however, not a lot of white people seem to know their direct link to that history. They do not know if their ancestors were involved in holding slaves, or maybe even freeing them. They just seem to know that something bad went down and they need to feel bad about it. This whole idea also relates back to the discussion on how in race discussions, white people sort of sit out and sit back and just listen to what other people have to say until they realize what will be acceptable to say and what not to say. I do think that some things are viewed as rude when white people say things rather than people of color.
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I think that a prime example of this is in Laurie’s book when she told the story about how Sam was viewed as the racist white man. There was no other mention of people of other races making a comment and being viewed at the racist black man or the racist Chinese man. People only seem to think that white people could make such a rude comment because they believe that white people believe themselves to be superior or the dominant race or something. All in all, I do not really understand it to be honest. I do not understand how one person could say something and then when it comes out of the mouth of someone of another race, it is completely offensive, rude and ignorant.
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I feel this is why white people seem to sit back on race conversations because t hey may say something that gives them the title of being the racist one. It seems contradictory and hypocritical to me however, for someone to put a label on a white person as rude or racist for stating an opinion when that is solely what our society is trying to get rid of. The race discussions are set up to achieve an understanding with one another and get a gist for what other people’s experiences are and by only allowing certain people to say some things and not others is not helping in moving us further towards a more just and equal society.
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I was actually thinking the same thing during class. I did not see a reason why there was uproar when white people made rude comments but people just laughed when black people made rude comments. I think it is because the race issues stem from black verses white and how white people were racist towards black people. Now a days most white people try and be politically correct so things do not bother colored people. Now I question whether black people try and be politically correct? Sometimes I feel like they do not. I have witnessed many black people make fun of white people but it comes off as a joke not racism. Black people do not need to watch what they say half the time because I think they believe that they were the victims and now have a right to say anything now. This is also the reason white people can not say anything they want. White people used to be the racists and to prove we have started to unite we have to make sure we do not revert back to racism. I think in class it was a big deal when white people made rude comments because most people did not expect that to happen. Most people probably expected white people to be politically correct but also state how they felt. In addition I think a lot of black people felt like if a white person would say that up on the board without showing who they were they would never say it in public. I think that it was also funny when Sam brought up to the black people that they want the white people to say how they feel but if anything is rude or racist they hate the person who said it. For white people it is not an even playing field; you can either hide your views about other races and have everyone like you or tell how you feel to the other races and be hated and treated like a racist. This was evident on the board where some people decided to hold back their feelings with comments like “I don’t know,” or “it’s just a skin color.” On the other hand some people decided to tell people how they felt about the subject but then got bad feedback from the rest of the class. I think though with the texting exercises more people will actually open up and say how they feel because they could not be pointed out as racist. Hopefully more and more people will find that saying your views allows for more opening and realization about our sociality today and how much work we need to do to unite.
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This question is definitely a question I’ve had on my own mind as well, and apparently I am not alone considering most of those above me also agree. I wouldn’t think it’s too far-fetched to believe those of us that agree are also white. This is probably because few, if any, white people comment during class that it seems white people are being held to a double standard; One of which lets people of color speak freely, no matter how rude their comment may be, and yet if one toe is put out of line on the white team, we are being racist and ignorant . . . oh and rich. One of the first things that come to my mind is that any rude comment, white or colored, is usually part of the whole ignorance issue we are trying to overcome in the first place. Regardless, I have seen and heard that many more people of color are very quick to state how a white person’s rude comment is a big part of the race issue, but not their own. I don’t respect any white person who makes a rude comment because I believe Sam’s recent discussion about not thinking about who you AREN’T is another good way to show that we really don’t have the right to speak of how or who other people are. I would hold my words regarding a handicapped person’s attitude towards other non-handicapped people because I really wouldn’t know. An opinion would be fine, sure, but what good would ever come out of my deciding to make a rude comment about a handicapped person? The same way goes towards white people or colored people if you aren’t of that skin color.
Personally, one of the biggest issues, I think, is that there is no responsibility for anyone’s actions for something like this. To send a text without a connection to YOUR phone is way too easy to say what shouldn’t be said. Sadly enough, this sometimes may be the way people actually think, white or colored, but would never be able to say such things face to face to someone of the opposite skin color, so this is a good way to get things off their chest in their mind. However, there comes a time when people just need to grow up and realize that this is not what that texting board is for. Although it is a risky opportunity in my mind, it’s trying to get a race relations class to hopefully try to understand another point of view (from a different skin color) by being able to speak their mind APPROPRIATELY, one of the reasons that this texting board does not hold responsibility to a person’s text.
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I’m not completely sure if this comment is fair. Although in class, Sam did call out the comment from a white person (when white people were asked what it means to be white and someone responded “that you have to listen to loud white girls in the computer lab”), and no comments were “called out” from non-white people. I was in class during this experiment, and in my opinion, there was nothing over the top rude said about white people by non-white people. It seemed like most of the responses were related to being privileged and other seemingly “positive” things.
I think that is interesting because, as a white female, I actually take offense to that. It can be just as hurtful to be called privileged as it can to be called things that non-white people are called. For example, it seems that black people are stereotyped as being poor and white people are stereotyped as being rich. So, when a white person finds success, they get the reaction that “of course that would happen, they came from money and had every advantage”. It is as if it was their whiteness that brought them success, no their personal hard work.
On the other hand, when black people find success they get the perception that they fought through all the barriers and are one in a million. It is as if EVERYTHING they achieved was because of their personal hard work. It is a double standard that is very unfair. That’s why I was so happy that in class, Sam really acknowledged that we should not be thinking like this. I think the exact words he used was “there are tons of black and brown people in this room that could buy some of your white families”. I’m sure they could.
I am personally very bothered by this mindset because, although white, I came from a lower middle class family. I am a first generation college student, and am paying for most of my college by myself. I’ve worked so hard for the past four years in class, and have held down a job during school, and have been fortunate enough to secure a job with Merrill Lynch/ Bank of America in New York City for after graduation. I would be willing to bet that when people meet me and talk to me for a couple minutes they would assume I come from a very affluent area, and that my family is extremely well educated. I feel like the battles I went through are discredited because people just assume I had everything handed to me. I am proud of where I am at and what I have achieved as compared to how I started out. I understand that not being white does make life harder, but unless someone has lived my exact circumstance, and the only difference is color, I really don’t know how we can assume skin color is that large of a determinant.
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I definitely noticed this as well. I feel like this happens a lot, even in the real world, and it could connect to the whole white guilt or white responsibility thing. I feel like since our history is full of white people putting down or discriminating against colored people, we have been taught that doing that in the present day is ignorant and very unacceptable. I feel like a lot of times, we learn that being rude, discriminating, or making fun of people of color is wrong, not just doing those things in general. This takes discrimination against white people out of the lesson, and makes things like what happened in class “not that bad” when compared to if it happened to a person of color. Recently, I was out at a party with some girls who were black. I admit that I do not normally interact with black people here at Penn State, but it was not like I felt uncomfortable. The black girls were talking about how the “white girls could dance.” This was obviously playing on the stereotype that white people are not as good at dancing. Since I am enrolled in soc 119, it made me think about something similar to this post. Would it be alright if I, a white girl, said something like this that played on a black person stereotype? I really do think that it would not be alright in a lot of people’s opinions, and mostly that rests on the fact that I am a white person talking about a person of color. I also think that a lot of white people are almost scared to speak up when there are situations of “reverse racism” because they feel like its more acceptable and they understand where it is coming from. I think that this idea needs to be eliminated from the minds of white people. If it is not acceptable in one situation, it should not be acceptable in another. With what happened in class, it seems like a lot of people in this class feel like it is more acceptable for reverse racism. I also think that there is a certain “shock” value when we experience or witness racism in the present day, and for a lot of people, racism is a white attacking black thing, not the other way around. The shock value, I think, has to do with the mentality that all that oppression and discrimination is part of the past and we are all better and more intelligent in the present. So when someone does something like what happened in class with the texting, we are all (at least most of us) conditioned and taught to react with shock and disapproval, ESPECIALLY when it is a white person attacking a person who is of color.
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The texting polls are a great idea in theory, but did you all really think that college students were mature enough to use them in the proper manner. I mean, I guess that you did, because it's something pretty fair to assume, but it was clearly shown that this is not the case. I'm not sure if it's because it's anonymous, or because people are bored in class, or they want to impress their friends, but this got out of control so fast. I just think it's a shame that Sam tried to do something fun and interesting for us in class, and it was tainted by people acting like idiots… Not like Donny, or whatever his name is video guy, helped out the situation…
Luckily, after a few weeks of trying this out, it seems that Sam has figured it out. I think there's more to be controlled with the close ended responses, but unfortunately there isn't as much value in what is being said. With close ended responses, you're forced to agree with one of 5 options, but with an open ended response we can see how people really think. And when used properly, it sparks good controversy, controversy that can help us think in a different way about race and the topics associated with it. Honestly, I don't even know if the closed ended questions are worth asking because people are going to be more politically correct, but it is a nice break from lecture.
Answering the proposed question, I think that the rudeness does go both ways. Although I noticed black people going crazy at white people's rudeness, I also noticed white people upset by black people's rudeness. Both sides of the argument were relatively heated, and it started to seem like more of a competition to "roast" the other race than to actually text in honest, appropriate answers. Why is that in a class that is supposed to foster better relations? I don't know? Maybe because people are still going to side with and feel the need to defend their race, regardless of what they've been taught. Or maybe people's views, or at least those on the extremes, are impossible to be changed.
Whatever it is, in class polling showed that we still have a long way to go. We all clearly still have HUGE strides to make when it comes to understanding each other, in even wanting to understand each other. But what this activity did show me is that people of both races, really of all races, are discriminatory and prejudice against races that are not their own. Therefore, it isn't just white people that are "racist". In fact, is anyone not racist? Sure, racist is a strong word, but is there really anyone that isn't partial to their own race? I think we'd be hard pressed to find many people, that if given the chance, would be interested and follow through with changing their race. This goes back to a belief that we all accepted, whether we want to admit it or not, at an early age of "I'm better than you."
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Actually, I first noticed what Sam mentioned- that the people of color in the room actually seemed to be less serious about the questions being posed, and wrote more offensive things than the white students did. As far as the rudeness thing went, though, it seemed to me that the level of uproar coming from the audience was pretty much the same. If anything, I thought it was worse, actually, when the students of color were posting rude things, just because there are more white people in the room than people of color, and because of the sheer volume of not-so-nice comments made.
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I was really disappointed and kind of upset about most of things that were displayed on the texting screen. It was shocking to see how rude people are and think that it is ok to write things like that. I don't quite understand those people's thoughts when they text those meaningless and impolite stuff to the screen. I couldn't understand because when in discussion group, everyone was very nice and always caring about the others. We discussed in our group how people would never dare to say those things to a persons face so what makes it ok to anonymously write that? No one sitting around me in class thought any of the nasty remarks displayed were funny, so why do it? Although I didn’t speak out and make any comments, I sat there in disbelief at the amount of things that people were saying. It was sad that very few people could take Sam’s exercise seriously. It did also seem like people of color were posting much more rude things about whites I found. This did bother me in a way to know all these horrible things that they thought about whites.
I think that this feeling of being politically correct is a good thing because sometimes people would otherwise say offensive things. But I also think that it can be bad because it prevents people from opening up to each other because you accidentally offend a black person or any person of color. How is it that everyone can reprimand white people for saying rude things about black people if black people say rude things about white people? Regardless of what happened in the past, on an individual level this is never okay. I do agree that when both groups put up racist comments it defiantly seemed that the white’s comments were much more offensive and I think also upsetting to a lot of people. I definitely do think that each group responds to both ways very differently. I also agree with the point that when white people make a negative or racist comment about colored people it is socially fine for the colored group to get outraged and furious. However, when a colored group makes a racist comment towards white it is usually just laughed off and not made a big deal or anything. Although I do believe that these issues are going to come up because we live in the most diverse country in the world, and the best way to approach them is to just be more open and listen to the needs and beliefs of others willingly without displaying ignorance. Overall I think this activity showed that we still have a lot of understanding to explore about one another. This did show me that both races still do have a lot of discrimination against one another.
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JamesParsons Reply:
March 23rd, 2010 at 6:56 pm
I agree with what is said on this question, it did seem like white people were being reprimanded for saying things that were not called for. But I also thought that people of color were being equally rude or even worse and they weren’t told about it at all. People see an opportunity to anonymously post something and try to make people laugh but I guarantee those things would not have been said face to face. Some of it has to do with the reaction from the students when they saw what was posted many laughed or were waiting for someone of color to flip out. If we cannot take care of a racial issue like this in a racial relations class then how is society ever going to overcome it? Also I think a lot of those rude posts were just students being immature and taking advantage of a good thing. If these posts either had phone numbers or names to go along with it I highly doubt we would have had these rude comments posted because these students would have used their heads a little bit. I also think that if black people would have gone first we would have had the same type of thing going on and white people probably would have retaliated even worse. But if the white students are going to get yelled at for being immature then the black people should have been dealt the same treatment. Both the black and the white sides said some rude things that are the main reason why we are still dealing with race issues. If we can’t do simple activities like that in a classroom how are we ever going to be able to overcome this situation throughout our lifetimes? I think if this activity was used properly and we got some really good points made that would be a spark for conversations not only in lecture but also in our smaller discussion groups. I know sometimes in my discussions we kind of sit there and try to think of things we want to talk about, if we had legit posts to go off of we could use those to talk about later. The whole white guilt thing is defiantly an issue just be going on what has happened in the past that all of the white students in class had nothing to do with. I don’t understand why younger generations of white people are still paying for things that SOME of our ancestors did years ago. I am not saying that in any way what happened will ever be justifiable in any way, but at some point the white people cannot keep being guilty for things we had no control over.
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I think there are two distinct ways that this question can be answered. The first is that people of color feel more free to speak their opinions than white people when it comes to race relations. White people, as a whole, are more reluctant to speak out or discuss what is really on their mind before testing the waters. Brown people, on the other hand, seemingly have dealt with these issues for a long time and have very few, if any reservations about what to say. Therefore, it can be the personal attachment and feeling of entitlement that explains why people of color react more strongly to "rude" comments made in class.
However, I think the stronger explanation for this is the usage of words and the meaning behind them. There are many slang words for people of color, the most offensive (in my opinion) being the n word. A word such as this is rooted in deep seeded hatred and racism. It has such a power that it can silence a large crowd or create an uproar, as we have seen many times in class. When someone texts in to the board using a word like this, I do not blame people of color for being offended or truly upset and causing a bit of a scene. At the same time, the scene that is created by yelling and showing anger is the motivation for someone in the crowd to anonymously text something offensive and create such a reaction. I do not quite understand what motivates someone to say a word in such a negative context that it offends large groups of people, unless they truly are that racist which is something I can not believe. I think its more just that they think the reaction is funny or they like creating a hostile environment, or something of the sort. The alternative side to this argument is that no such word exists with such a passion and history toward white people. Although some offensive words like cracker, honkey, and white boy exist, none have the background or history as some of the derogatory terms used to refer to people of color. The worst thing you can call a white person is a racist, and although doing so is highly offensive, it does not create a large backlash. When a white person reacts loudly to being called a racist it makes them look defensive like they are hiding their true feelings. Like Sam said in class, sometimes when someone accuses you of being racist the best thing to do is just sit back and keep your mouth shut. The more you try and defend yourself, the more it looks like you have to hide.
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This topic is a very interesting topic and a topic that i feel needs to be brought up. Over the course of using the text messaging on the board in our class has raised a lot of feelings and i feel that it is brought up some tension between white and people of color only when we are separated and are told to respond to each statement. i feel that by "white people" needing to respond, and then "people of color" needing to respond i feel that ultimately there is going to be conflict amongst the class. The topic of this video makes sense to me, because yes i am white, but i did also notice what this kid is talking about from those days in class when "white" people need to answer and then "people of color" need to answer. I feel that all comments whether from people of color or from white people i feel that there are rude comments flying back in fourth on the board from all races. This video is true though, white people did say rude things, but so did people of color and I can not find a reason why there was alot of noise and commotion when a white person made a rude comment but when it was time for the people of color to make a comment, and theirs was rude there was no commotion. I am white but i would never say half of the things that come up on that board. I fell that many of them are rude and i just can not believe that people can actually have the balls to say that stuff for the whole class to see. i feel the comments are just rude and obnoxious on both ends when they are derogatory to one race or another. Some comments are practical and necessary for class but the other comments are just not needed. i know some times there are tensions and issues but then those obnoxious comments should not be said, especially on a screen in class, they should be kept to themselves if they feel that strongly against the other race.
When i see those comments on the board from both sides, whites and people of color i just do not understand why people still have to live in the past. I feel that so much has been done since back when race was a problem and i feel that by now all races should be able to come together. I feel that when those comments come up from people of color along with the comments from the white people the same reaction should be taken because its about the same thing. both comment whether the race are just talking bad about the other, and i feel that people should try to move forward and come together and put those past stereotypes aside and move forward so one day when a professor asks what does it mean to be white and what does it mean to be a person of color, the responses will not be derogatory towards any one.
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This is a great question that this guy asked, I was wondering the same thing myself. A lot of what is said on the text boards is pretty funny in my opinion and I know that there are a lot of people laughing with me. Although there were a lot of funny comments a lot of them were also some comments that could be considered offensive by people of both the people on the white team and people on the black and brown team. I for one am not easily offended and I was not offended by a lot of what people said but, so much of what was said throughout all of the texting discussions was really immature and stupid. I am a huge believer in if you dish it out you have to be able to take it too. It seemed to me that a lot of the people on the black and brown team would get a lot more upset about an off color comment or stereotype, it may have just been a few people and I really don’t want to lump everyone into the same category, because I hate when that happens to me, but it was definitely louder and there was more opposition to comments made about the people on the black and brown team.
I like the whole idea of no political correctness in the text messages but I also believe that if that is really what you want to say or how you really feel, you should say it out loud and not hide behind a text message. Stand up and be heard, and be the person to start a debate. I think that Sam would love it and be able to run with what someone says and be able to convey a lesson to us students that we may not have had the opportunity to have before. We are all hear to learn and we are safe to say what we feel in this class so I guess I really am all about everyone being able to speak their mind. Being able to speak your mind is what this class is all about, and although some of the text messages in the discussion were “offensive” or mean these are some of the things that need to be said to spark a true debate about the differences that are seen by all of the races in this class. I just don’t know if the text message debates are really helping us to learn about race relations, it seems like it is being more abused for cheap jokes then for constructive comments. And even sometimes when the comments are constructive it seems like a lot of people are offended by them, we just need to stop being offended and be able to take what we dish out.
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I never really noticed the difference in reactions in class. I was kind of surprised at first when the rudeness would not stop. I expected it the first day of testing out the new text responses, but I figured it would die down. Some of the comments were harmless and pretty funny, although way off topic. Others I think surpassed being rude and were offensive and derogatory. But just because Sam said for "only whites" or "only people of color" to answer the question, it does not mean that people from the different team did not post both times, or even only when they were not supposed to. I believe there was an overall disagreement with the overly rude comments, regardless of who posted them. Maybe there was a different reaction from each group, but I did not notice it.
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