posted by Sam and Michelle
Post your 450 word (minimum) comment and 100 word (minimum) response to a classmate. You should be responding to the lecture about Stages of Racial Identity – White People: Stages 1 & 2. You can write anything you want about whatever you hear in the lecture.
When thinking about this week’s lesson, I couldn’t help but think how beneficial this course could be to everyone at Penn State. It’s one of those courses that should be mandatory in the same manner as courses such as English 15. The topic of race relations cuts across all different types of industries, cultures, religions, etc. In looking at the existing posts as well as some of the other posts that have been previously during this semester, it’s very interesting how many people have said there was so much they did not realize about other cultures or how they realize some of their perceptions of thoughts about individuals or cultures were so off-base and misguided. For colleges and universities like Penn State, the size of the student population provides an opportunity for each and every student to either interact with or become exposed to students from other races and cultures.
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(cont'd) Being a major university in this country, the student population of Penn State is comprised of students from all over the world. Students come from a variety of socio-economic backgrounds and cultures, religions, and communities. I have met people at Penn State who come from inner city areas as well as others who come from suburban and rural areas. There are many people whose only exposure to other cultures and races prior to Penn State was what they saw on television, heard about in the media, or heard from other people. This is not to say that Penn State has not had its share of race relation problems or issues. Back in 1988, there were major racial problems on the University Park campus. Since then, there have also been racial issues that have surfaced at Penn State. But, the exposure to a diverse set of individuals can be very educational and can serve as a starting point for improving race relations.
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I found this lecture to be extremely interesting. I am a white person and I haven’t really thought about myself as a white person until recently. I was surprised to learn that there were 6 stages of Racial Identity. I know that I am probably a round stage 2. I don’t know if I’m any further than that stage because I don’t know what those stages necessarily mean yet. I am curious as to why Professor Richards said in class that white people mainly never get to stages five or six but I guess that is a discussion for another class time.
I think that a majority of white people are probably at stage 1. I know that we know that we are white but I don’t think we fully understand what it means to be white like a person of color understands what it means to be a person of color. I don’t think being in stage 1 makes a white person racist. I don’t believe that these levels have much to do with racism.
I thought that the comedy clips were very interesting that were shown in class. The clip with Dave Chappelle, when he was talking about doing drugs with your white friends, was very funny and a good example. There is another comedian Katt Williams who does a joke about never drinking with white people because we drink whatever we can find. I find this joke hilarious because he begins by saying how black people have one drink that they always drink and a back up incase they don’t have their first choice. Then he goes into saying that white people will mix the strangest things in with their alcohol like red bull and liquor. I can see the truth to this joke and that’s what makes they joke funny.
The other comedian that was shown who talked about the how awesome it is being white I found more interesting than the other clip. I had thought about being white and the advantages before this lecture; however I hadn’t really thought about it in a powerful way. I mean I didn’t think of being white as me having power of people of color. After the clip there was a thought that popped into my head about discrimination and how I never really had to deal with that. Even in the beginning of this lecture, when Professor Richards asked about how you would define yourself white wasn’t one of the words I would use. I wouldn’t say I was short because I’m not but I would use daughter and sister to show that I was a woman. It is weird how things come out when they affect us everyday like skin color, height or a disability but if they don’t you don’t think of them.
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(cont'd) Let’s face it. There are always going to be issues with respect to race relations. However, trying to avoid being around people from different cultures and races does nothing to end stereotypes and prejudice. Being around others from different cultures and backgrounds than ours is one of the best ways to really find out what people are about and how detrimental the existence of stereotypes really is. I think that at the end of this course, all of us may be able to look back on this course and remember several things that we learned that we previously had very little or no knowledge of. This lesson also can serve as an eye opener for people who really thought that everyone in our society is equal and has the same equal opportunities.
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JessOver Reply:
June 17th, 2010 at 3:41 am
I think there will always be issues with race relations as long as each race is unwilling to get past our own individual ideas about who is racist and who isn't. I really think that it's important to fully understand another culture before judging it. It's easy to compare cultures and respective practices but what is really important and absolutely necessary to accomplish is the act of immersion within another culture and through doing so come to terms with what it means to live within that culture. There will always be differences between races and even within races, but there is nothing inherent within individual races that makes one better than another and I think that's important to remember.
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(cont'd) The fact is that a person’s racial composition can provide that individual with advantages just because of his or her skin color. In one of the most, if not the most, diverse nations in the entire world, there are numerous race relation problems and issues here in the United States that need to be corrected. A starting point for that correction would be for each of us to commit to eliminating personal racial stereotypes, perceptions, and biasness that we may have for others.
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It’s never acceptable for white people to talk about what it is like to be white, at least that’s what it feels like as a white female. It’s fairly apparent that the common conception is that whites are frequently judged by what they have to say regarding their opinions not only on races but on being white in general and others are quick to throw out the racism card.
On the idea of actually thinking in depth about what it’s like to be white, it’s completely true that prior to this lecture I would never have thought about what it’s like to be white on a daily basis. I mean when I have travelled to other countries it becomes blatantly obvious of what it means to be white and the general life differences that occur from being a white individual. However, once back inside the borders of the U.S. and by living in areas that allow for lacking interacting with other races, it wouldn’t be a common thought to think about what it means to be white. I have never had a conversation with other white friends about what our lives are like because we are white or how our day to day lives are.
I think this stems from the fact that it’s so much easier to think about what it is like to be other people instead of actually thinking about what it means to be yourself. It’s easy to judge others and their culture or practices and to attribute them as being abnormal as compared to yourself. But ultimately it’s really interesting to think about going into a situation that is unknown or unfamiliar to someone and to leave questioning oneself instead of judging their culture.
I think many of us are in the stage of avoiding racial risks stage. There’s always that awareness of not saying anything that may offend people that are of another race. Especially in the world today where we are very centered/focused on remaining politically correct it has become difficult to say things regarding race other than our own that doesn’t affect or offend someone. I think the whole idea of absolute political correctness is absurd because honestly it’s complete bullshit if white people can’t say certain things regarding other races but it is entirely appropriate for members of those races to call each other the same names or speak in the same manner that they are criticizing white people for. It makes it very difficult to try and understand what is and isn’t considered acceptable if it’s deemed racist for some to say something that is completely kosher amongst the other race. It would be much easier if political correctness across the board was eased up to allow a more candid level of speaking in which every person had the same understanding that the goal was to further communication and to eradicate racism—if that’s even possible.
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Never have I thought to imagine what it is to be white or to even begin to know what that entails and means. I only have ever imagined what it means to be me and what thoughts define me. I am not a white person so to step into another person’s shoes of a different race is not something I would think about. I guess as a child you always think oh I want to be that person or just like them but I never thought what is was it would me to be a white person. I do not think anyone including white people should feel bad in any way for the color of their skin in this case white skin. Everyone is dealt a hand of cards that they cannot change skin color is one of them. I think when people become aware of their whiteness or notice how they are white and other people are not they can feel bad. However feeling bad does not do anything for anyone or change whatever he or she feels bad about.
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The idea of the stereotype of white person is a weird concept. I have never thought about what I think a stereotypical white person is or looks like. I people thinking that there is such a thing of a generic white person is ludicrous. I think people cannot be generic and that none of us are exactly alike to be able to say this. I don’t think there are any stereotypical people only thoughts of stereotypical people. People have come up with the notions of stereotypes and have played into them for however long. If no one had said something was a stereotype then it would probably never have been a stereotype. I am not fond of stereotypes and placing people in boxes of one thing or another. That limits people and I do not think people should be limited or most are not just one thing.
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Rockski Reply:
June 17th, 2010 at 5:30 pm
I understand what you're saying on that, the funny part about it is I can't even really think about stereotypes for white people, I mean the terms used to offend them don't even really carry much weight. The only thing I can think of is white people run incredibly funny, but does that even really hurt? Well stereotype place limits on white people, but do you think they really have that many limits? Only if you think it about can you find a problem with white society, but I do get what you're saying about generics, everyone is different, but not many people realize it.
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The notion of political correctness has never sit well with me. When people say something is political correct or not I think what really makes it politically correct. Who made up these definitions of what the norm should be for political correctness. I also think this really limits people from ever expressing their true thoughts. Though some people have cruel thoughts others are just curious or want to say something not to be cruel and the words that this is not politically correct is always thrown out there. People tend to also use this as an excuse to not interact with different cultures because they are scared they will say the wrong things. I also think this is a cop out and people use this to toss the blame around for why things are the way they are.
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16Jun10
When Dr. Richards asked who are you, the first thing that came to my mind was soldier-medic. I did not even think of my height, sex, what my job is, race. None of that came to mind. I guess it has been ingrained in me now that when someone asks who are you, my response is immediately, I am a soldier-medic. It was not even a question what to answer.
I have no idea what stage I would be in or is currently in. I did not even know that there stages. Guess you learn something new everyday. When Dr. Richards was describing how he helped a disabled student go to the bathroom, I immediately thought of work. How many times have I had to help a patient go to the bathroom? At first, when it was a male patient, I would always try and get a male tech to help because I was embarrassed. I did not want to touch some strange man's penis (even with and only with gloves on). I was afraid I would see something I did not want to see. But there came that one time when a male tech was not available and I got stuck doing. I had no idea what to do. I knew the obvious that the penis goes into the urinal but I did not know about this whole shake to get the last drops out because I obviously do not have a penis. Then it became, oh shit, so how many times do I shake this stranger's penis before it becomes something else. I figured out that I would just use the edge of the urinal to do the shaking. Now I am that point where I have attitude, you have seen one penis, you essentially seen them all. Albeit, they are different shapes colours and sizes. Now, I am the tech the other female techs run to when a patient feels it necessary to, how can I put this appropriately, enjoy the pleasuring of oneself (yes men in the emergency department will attempt to masturbate and it is so gross) to walk in the room and demand they stop their inappropriate behavior. Of course when I walk in, I intimidate them so they know not to attempt this behavior again.
I never realized that white people never thought about the fact that they are white. I guess because society told me that I had to “be black” or at the very least act black, It never crossed my mind that white people did not think the same way. (Kind of like my friend who speaks three languages and I am dying to know which one he thinks in). I just assumed everyone saw their race and thought about it. Well I put my foot in my preverbal mouth with that concept.
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I really enjoyed this lesson, more than any of the others. I too never thought of "who I am". However, everyday I put on heels, I do think, man I wish I was taller. I also don't understand why people get so bent out shape with the words niggers, cracker, etc….if you know you are not either one of those terms, why get upset? I enjoyed the stories about the disabled individuals. I work with various disabled individuals, and some of them have said they forget they have a disability because they have grown in their own skin and have excepted their disability. I wonder if we have done this also. If you don't say I'm a white, black, asian girl, is it because you have grown into your own skin? Or is it just because it's obvious, so you don't add to the description of yourself, your color? I will say the one thing this lecture has me thinking, is why I catergorize a group of people based on what one person has done. It's not fair to that group, because every in that group, may not be a butt head like the one person who has pissed me off. Shame on my judgemental self!
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Blog Response White People Stages 1 + 2
I never knew there was six steps to racial identity. I just want to know why it takes so much for anyone to know who they identify with. I commend you for helping the disabled people, as that touches me incredibly deeply. When people aren’t able to exactly do what they want to do, and most go through a process of losing mental toughness because they can’t fathom losing their independence. It’s a very sad thing to witness. I reflect how I’m 6’5 (no mustache) often. Little kids often come up to me and say I’m a giant and almost every person asks me if I play basketball if having an extended conversation. I’m constantly reminded when I go into stores and an short old lady will ask me to get a box off the top shelf. Then I have friends who tell me I make basketball boring because I’m too tall to spop then, but I’m not 7’0 and if that happened that would be way worse. As is I feel like I get that “Damn, he’s tall” look all the time the same with my father, who is about the same height as I am. For the left handed side, my brother opriginally wanted to play baseball but it was much harder for anyone to teach him how oswing because he’s a natural lefty, so in turn now he’s ambidextrous because people couldn’t cater to his needs growing up. He picked up basketball because it’s much easier to learn. Both comedians were really funny in pointing out things I never really noticed, except for Chappelle and the weed thing, but I never even thought about the “white privilege” that no matter where they go they don’t have to worry about anything. If not on a stand up stage if anyone said any of this, they would be castrated, humor is just a funny thing. Political correctness for doing the right thing is just a sad concept, people who get angry about not being able to speak the language correctly is just incredibly stupid. Take for instance Geno’s steaks in Philly which had an incredibly racist sign basically saying this is America you need to speak English to order. The fact that they can discriminate against anyone and not want to serve them food because they don’t speak a specific language makes me angry in that aspect. The Carlos Mencia clip proves a point too, the point of political correctness is simply annoying too, take the politician who was just saying how he felt, and then had to apologize immediately after, and those apologies are not reported with as much rigor as the initial controversy.
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This lesson was interesting to me, and what I thought was the most important part, was the concepts of the preawakening, and awakening stages. Many individuals fail to understand the concept of race, and do exclude white people when it comes to it. Automatically when someone thinks of race, the first thing that comes to mind is people of color, or anyone but white people. Race is race. It is true that very little thought is given to race, and it is difficult to change people’s opinions and views. The episode with Dave Chappell was hilarious, but with much truth to it.
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June 16
My husband was listening into the lecture, and when this came on, he paid even closer attention to it. My husband is an African American man, and when he heard this, he said, “I dare someone to put a carrot in my a**,” which is the response that Dave Chappell expected from the black men. What one culture may think as funny, the other may not, but we should respect that and not shun away from it. There are certain things in my culture where people think that it is odd or weird. For instance, Puerto Ricans are considered loud, which is for the most part, true (at least for my family we are loud.)
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Everywhere I go with my husband, he asks me, “why are you always so loud“, and I say “babe, I am not loud, I am Puerto Rican, that’s just how we talk.” I said this to say that many people see my family and I and just look at us like we are crazy, but that is just our culture. White people are going to act out a certain way, black people may act a certain way, Hispanics, Asians, whatever. We are who we are and we should just keep it that way instead of focusing on the color of our skin.
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I don’t see white people as uncool, I don’t see all blacks as ghetto, I don’t see all Asians as martial arts experts, I don’t see all Hispanic people as maids, I just see PEOPLE, and that is the way it should be. This whole “Us versus them” controversy is never-ending and annoying. But no matter how much we talk about the issue of race and how easy it is to blame the white man or the white woman for everything is difficult to overcome, we still have these issues. It’s easy to say, “Can’t we all just get along?” But it’s not realistic. We could, if we all got over our stupid ways of thinking.
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6/20/10
This week, I enjoyed the lecture like always, but I started reading the assignment for this section, and I can’t put it down. Some of the things she wrote in the first five chapters really blew my mind. The first chapter pretty much defined the problems I’ve run into with these topics. At first, I wasn’t sure what she meant by “your” people or her general “you”. I put two and two together pretty quickly. It’s a little weird to read, as a white person, but I can see how it helps her argument. The entire book is a conversation. When you’re reading it, you can imagine that you’re at the Circle that she mentions. At the beginning she establishes her determination to see this thing through by rebutting all of the common excuses for not talking about race and problems between races. One of the ones that she talks about that I come across often is the idea of trust. People of other races and colors look at white people differently, and they rarely feel like we’re sincere. I’m not trying to make generalizations, but I’ve seen her examples in action. She says that they don’t know us, and they don’t know what we do when we’re comfortable in our white communities with our privilege and our freedoms. I’ve found myself struggling when talking to people of other races, not just from the strain of trying to constantly be politically correct, but from trying to prove that I’m not just putting on a show in an attempt to be more socially acceptable. It only feeds into the stereotype to act like that. It’s frustrating to be honest. I find myself feeling like I just want to quit. It’s almost impossible to fight against this. How do I prove that I’m not the stereotype? Is it my fault? Should I just ignore it? All of these questions popped into my head when I was reading the book and I’m working on the answers.
Another thing that caught me off guard was the story she said about her brother -in-law and the joke. I can relate with her brother-in-law. I like to joke with races and stereotypes, and I’ve found myself in those situations before. It’s hard to joke with people. It’s a lot like political correctness; if you go up to eight different black people and asked them what they wanted to be called, and you would get eight different answers. It’s not that the jokes are offensive to everyone. I mean, I have a lot of friends that make white jokes around me and laugh when I shoot something back. There’s nothing behind the jokes and definitely no hate at all. I think that it’s good to joke, because they can open up a conversation. For example, when I joke with stereotypes, I tend to ask people whether they have any real foundation. Laughter makes people feel more comfortable with the topic. If they get offended, they obviously aren’t ready for the conversation.
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Finally. After a very crazy three weeks, I am able to find a few minutes to turn my attention to SOC 119. I have missed participating in the class lectures and assignments. I found lesson 8, “The tale of the White Fish”, to contain a lot of very interesting discussion. As a white person, I would have to agree that I do not talk or think about what it means to be white very often. I will have to admit, though, at times I have been thankful to BE white. This is especially true when contemplating the many issues that people of color have had, and still have, to deal with. Racial discrimination still occurs today, and will continue for many years to come. I must add, however, that I believe there are more and more cases of reverse discrimination occurring each day.
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When Dr. Richard asked me to reflect, “Who am I?” My response would have probably been something like: A son; husband: father: brother; police officer, American, etc. I can’t say that ‘white guy’ would have been real high up on the list. That is because I don’t think about it that much. In my mind, it does not affect me that much. After listening to this lecture, I think that it actually does. This is especially true when I put myself in the shoes of a person of color. It does affect them. It can have an affect of nearly every facet of their lives. I identify myself as a man. A person of color most likely identifies themselves as a black man.
I found the discussion concerning majority and minority relations to be interesting. I consider myself a pretty average guy. I am white, about six feet tall, straight, and right handed. In each of the majority/minority examples that Sam provided, I found myself in the majority. To me, that meant that I never really reflect on the issues presented since I am in the majority. The world seems to “fit” or be “normal” to me.
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I certainly have mixed feelings about the Sen. Bird “White Nigger” comments. I am surprised that someone with that much public speaking experience would make such a comment. When seriously thinking about the issue, I really think I know what he was talking about. I perceived his comments to mean that the term “Nigger” is an extremely derogatory term for the worst group of African Americans. I think what he was trying to say that there is a “worst group” of whites as well. There is not this group of African Americans that is far worse than the worst group of whites. They are equally bad. I am finding it hard to explain this issue, but I did not think that his comment was racist in any way. Actually, it was to the contrary.
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I thought that this was a very interesting and important topic for this course, and I was wondering when we were going to really get to it. Now I am eager to see what the next part of the lecture brings! One of my main “problems” with white people has always been that they often feign innocence and ignorance when it comes to racist situations or racism in general. I fell as though almost every or anything “foreign” to them can easily cause them discomfort and thus they just avoid it when possible. It’s ingratiating, however, because every and anything can be considered foreign when you are in a position of power so to speak, and thus are responsible for creating and molding the norms of society. At the same time, it sometimes saddens me that many people of color often put white people into one group. This can be annoying for two reasons, one because it is often done to black people and many of us spend a lot of time trying to fight the stereotype that we are all the same. Two because I happen to know a number of very different white people and yes there are many different types. But I don’t think that white people really consider this when thinking about themselves because they are often in the fortunate position of thinking and speaking from an individualistic perspective. A luxury that is not always afforded to minorities. I also feel as though that in terms of being at the pre-awakening stage or the first to points of the awakening stage there are also luxuries of ignorance that adults should not be able to claim. I was always taught that once you know better, you do better, and that anyone other than true children are responsible not only for the things that they know but the things that they do not as well. Any judge will tell you that ignorance of the law is no excuse for breaking it. Why do these same rules not apply during conversations about self-identity and responsibility as they relate to racism? Although there is a desire to cut people slack and say that if you don’t have the experience you don’t know (and it can often be true), the onus also sometimes lies on the individual to go out and find the experience or create it themselves t find out. For example, I came from the hood and was born poor without a whole lot of exposure to a lot of different cultures or life’s other multitudes of offerings. As I grew up, however, I realized that in a world trending towards globalization and in the interest of my own personal growth and success, as well as a n ability to educate my daughter efficiently, that I would have to go out and discover some of these things whether it be through study abroad, picking up a class or book I usually otherwise wouldn’t have, or even spending a few extra moments chatting with the owner of the local bodega from Cuba around the way. It seems as though white people often truly do epitomize the theory that ignorance is bliss, and I think that we have to move away from this to start to evolve in our national discourse on race relations. I still love my white brethren though – keep hope alive!
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